### Apollo BBS Archive - August 13, 1991

    Message: 77544
    Author: $ Michael James
    Category: Vote
    Subject: New Vote Idea:
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 14:38:16

    Over the past few months, what percentage of the time have you enjoyed your
    job?
       [A] 91-100
       [B] 81-90
       [C] 71-80
       [D] 61-70
       [E] 51-60
       [F] 41-50
       [G] 31-40
       [H] 21-30
       [I] Rarely
       [J] Never
       [K] I haven't had a job over the past few months

    How do you vote [A-K] or [CR] to abort:H

    Poll results to date:
    [A] 0    [B] 0    [C] 1    [D] 1    [E] 1    [F] 1    [G] 0    [H] 3
    [I] 0    [J] 1    [K] 2

    Mail from Nick Ianuzzi
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 04:23:21

    I'm not sure if JT's opinions on recreational drug use have changed along
    with his politics, but it's worth talking to him about it.  His phone number
    is (201) 653-2135.

    Mail from Apollo SysOp
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 22:15:42

            Rod
            As you know I am working on my 65 Barracuda... trying to restore it.
    I need new rubber door and trunk lock gaskets...  Can these be had without
    buying a whole new lock set...  If not, how much does a new door and trunk
    lock set go for.

    [R]ead rest or [S]kip rest:Read rest

            Thanks!

            *=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SysOp *=*  <-clif-
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue, [I]nsty-reply or [Z]ap:Insty-reply

    Enter a line containing only an [*] to stop
     1:The gaskets can be purchased separately at a GM dealer if they stock them.
     2:Lock Supply here in Phoenix should have them but then again I think I have
     3:them.
     4:
     5:A new lock set, trunk and door locks are sold in a set for somewhere in the
     6:neighborhood of $15.  They come with gaskets and are keyed although the
     7:uncoded sets would be cheaper.
     8:
     9:Later, Rod

    $tatus Club Bulletin Board command:$C

    Message: 7975
    Author: $ Gordon Little
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Daryl/Peking
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 00:14:44

    Thanks for the answer about the Peking skulls, Daryl.  Dr. Ham's comments
    were very interesting, so I'm looking forward to seeing what he has to say
    on the tapes.  Now I wonder if he has ever seen pictures of the remains.

    It's worth noting that Dr. Ham accepts the evidence that fire and stone
    tools were in use at the time.  And by the way, you asked:

     DW>>...does it show that fire and stone tools were used to cook "Peking
     DW>>Man"?

    The answer to this question is very probably Yes!

    In 1927, a humanlike but unusual lower molar tooth was discovered in Chou-
    k'ou-tien cave near Peking.  Davidson Black, a physical anthropologist who
    was professor of embryology and neurology at the Peking Union Medical
    College, classified the tooth as remains of a previously unknown manlike
    creature.  Later, in 1932, he pointed out similarities between this tooth
    and those of other remains found in Java before the turn of the century.

    On the basis of this single tooth, Davidson's guess turned out to be right.
    Later excavations in the cave turned up the remains of skulls, limbs, and
    teeth from about forty individuals of similar type.  The remains were
    subsequently dated to around 350,000 years ago; though of course I wouldn't
    expect Dr. Ham to accept that.

    Also found in the cave were tools of flaked stone and worked bone, and
    charred animal bones which, together with the remains of stone hearths,
    showed clearly that fire was in use.

    The skeletal remains are broadly comparable with those found in five places
    in Java, but also similar to other remains found at two sites in the Lan-
    T'ien district of Shensi Province, and probably with others found in Algeria
    and Chad.  Unfortunately the original remains of "Peking Man" disappeared in
    1941 while being smuggled out of China to the United States to avoid the
    threatened Japanese invasion.  However, plaster casts of the remains still
    exist, and further remains were found in Chou-k'ou-tien cave in 1958.

    Now, if Dr. Ham wanted to point out damage to the skulls suggesting that the
    brains were being eaten, he is probably right.  The damage isn't so much a
    matter of them being "bashed in" from the top, however; and in any case you
    don't expect many skulls to be totally intact after so much time.  What
    these skulls generally have in common is damage to the foramen magnum, the
    large hole at the base of the skull where the spinal cord emerges.  It is
    possible that some damage could be accidental, since this is a thin part of
    the cranium, but it seems very unlikely that similar damage would be so
    widespread.  It looks deliberate.

    Monkey brains are indeed a delicacy in China and other places, but is this a
    case of people eating monkey brains?  Definitely not.

    The first reason for this assertion is circumstantial.  Anthropologists have
    pointed out that similar damage to the foramen magnum has been found in
    other places, but especially in Borneo and New Guinea -- not far from Java.

    The circumstances are remarkable.  Present-day headhunters of Borneo and New
    Guinea cause this characteristic mutilation in the process of ritual
    cannibalism.  They extract the brain through the aperture and eat it
    ceremonially, in the belief that this permits the name of the deceased
    victim to be passed on to the son of the cannibal.  This form of cannibalism
    is practiced as a special ritual; that is, it isn't the same procedure that
    would be followed if they were just eating a creature for food.

    So we're not talking about men eating monkey brains here, but men eating the
    brains of other *men*!  The inference is that whoever ate the brains of
    Peking Man was a cannibal -- in other words, another creature just like him.
    Furthermore, the evidence of "ritual" shows some form of primitive culture -
    - if not a very appetizing one!  The presence of many similar skulls
    together also suggests cannibal practices of collecting human skulls.

    By itself, this wouldn't be very good evidence that Peking Man was "human".
    But the reason I wondered if Dr. Ham has seen pictures of the remains is not
    that I thought he'd seen the cranial damage, but I wondered how anybody
    could *possibly* see a skull of Peking Man and conclude that he was an ape.

    Even to the totally untrained eye, the Peking skulls look immediately human.
    There is just no comparison with the skull of any monkey or ape.  The
    differences are glaringly obvious.  The skull speaks for itself.

    If you look at an ape skull, the entire jaw protrudes way forward from the
    front of the eye socket, so that the plane of the face from the eye down to
    the mouth slants at about 45 degrees.  By comparison, the human face
    protrudes outward only a little -- not more than 15 degrees -- from the eye
    down to the mouth.

    An ape has heavy brow ridges that protrude upward to make great lumps in the
    front of his cranium.  The cranium slopes back at a shallow angle, and the
    top of the cranium is low.  A human has very little brow ridge, and what
    there is of it protrudes forward, because the forehead rises up almost
    vertically, then goes back to form a high-domed cranium.

    The back of an ape's skull appears to be chopped off sharply and undercut at
    an angle of about 45 degrees.  A human skull is much larger and almost
    semicircular at the back, the occiput.  It extends back about twice as far
    from the front of the face as the mandible, the lower jawbone, does.  The
    round back and high dome are there to contain the large brain, of course.

    An ape's jaw is very heavy and receding.  A human jaw is much lighter, with
    a distinct chin.

    The back of an ape's cranium is so short, and its face so protruding, that
    the eye sockets are about midway between the front and back of the entire
    skull.  The human eye sockets are very close to the front.

    This is one case where a picture is literally worth a thousand words.  There
    could be no doubt whatsoever that the Peking skull is close to human in
    proportions.

    However, the differences from a normal human skull are striking also.  The
    mouth does protrude noticeably more than a human mouth does, and the teeth
    are heavier.  The jaw itself is heavy and underslung.  And Peking man, while
    not having the huge brow ridges of an ape, certainly did have remarkable
    brow ridges that protruded very noticeably forward.  While he was
    unmistakably close to modern humans, neither could he possibly be mistaken
    for a modern human on closer examination.

    These are only the gross features.  Experts no doubt found hundreds of
    smaller points to study.  One point about the base of the skull -- also
    corroborated by thigh-bones found at the site -- was that this creature
    undoubtedly walked upright.

    Ever try walking on all fours?  It's uncomfortable.  Your arms aren't long
    enough for a start.  Apes and monkeys can walk erect for a time, and also
    climb trees, but they seem just as happy scampering on all fours.

    If you're going to walk upright all the time, the weight of your body rests
    on a fully extended thigh, and the acetabulum, or hip-joint -- the ball-
    joint between the top of your femur and the pelvis -- has to be adapted to
    carry the thrust of your weight in this direction.

    If you're going to walk on all fours, with the femur carrying a lot of
    weight at right angles, the joint is shaped differently.  Femurs found in
    the cave were at first sight indistinguishable from those of modern man.
    And the arms too, of course.

    Even without the limb bones, a lot can be told from a skull.  If you're
    designed to walk on all fours, your head has to point forward so that you
    can see where you're going.  If you suddenly decide to start walking upright
    all the time, your head is going to want to point at the sky, which is a
    great position for seeking Divine inspiration but not so good if you don't
    want to trip over things.  Likewise, a head like Man's, designed to point
    forward when he stands upright, won't do him much good if he starts to walk
    on all fours instead, because he'll be looking at the ground all the time
    and he won't see where he's going.  So there are differences in skull shape
    and the attachment of muscles that go with these different types.

    Peking man walked erect.  He was classified as a member of a group known as
    "Homo erectus".

    The cranium of modern man has a brain capacity averaging 1350 cc.  An ape's
    brain is somewhere in the region of 400 cc.  The brain of Peking man
    averaged 1045 cc, which is low, but well on the way.  And it varied from 915
    to 1225 cc.  This upper limit is well within the range of variability of
    modern man.

    If this was an "ape", it had to be an incredibly smart one.  With
    competition like that, it's surprising there are any of the dumber apes left
    in the world.

    I asked about creationist beliefs because I honestly didn't know what they
    were, or how this evidence could possibly be wished away.  I did wonder
    about the Australopithecines, but it's clear that if Peking men could be
    classified as monkeys, then the Australopithecines, which were not as
    advanced especially in the skull development, could be consigned to apehood
    without any difficulty whatsoever.

    The Neanderthals, however, were more advanced than Homo erectus.  I'm
    looking forward to hearing what Dr. Ham has to say about them.

    Message: 7982
    Author: $ Gordon Little
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Early Men
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 00:23:55

    You know...

    Putting Reason aside for a moment, and turning to Emotion instead, I find it
    quite sad that Dr. Ham was unable to see just who these creatures were.

    They must have been very intelligent.  Not up to modern standards naturally;
    I don't doubt they'd have a little trouble with the SAT.  But chimpanzees
    are intelligent, and these creatures were easily two-thirds of the way
    between chimps and modern Man.  Maybe the adults were as bright as an eight-
    year-old child, or even a twelve-year old; I don't know.  And chimps have
    even shown the rudimentary capability to structure simple sentences, though
    of course they lack the apparatus of speech.  I don't know what the experts
    think, but at this level of development it seems possible that the creatures
    had acquired elementary speech.  Seeing how intelligent they were, we must
    grant that they had tools, and fire also according to the evidence, lived
    together in small communities and survived by hunting and gathering.
    Perhaps they huddled round their cooking fires at night to keep warm.

    As he is a man of God, it's a tragedy that Dr. Ham missed out on the wonder
    of all this.  He couldn't appreciate that in all likelihood, these creatures
    in their time were the crowning achievement of creation on Earth.  Cannibals
    they may have been, but they were Men!  People!  And he just dismissed them
    as though they were no better than dumb beasts, only fit to have their heads
    bashed in and their brains eaten for dinner.  I think that's terribly sad.

    Message: 7983
    Author: $ Bill Burkett
    Category: Get-Togethers
    Subject: ELVIS (???) GT
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 08:44:50

    Melissa asked on the [PUB]lic BBS about a GT.  It was my understanding that
    Michael (James) was hosting one at his house last Sunday, although I wasn't
    able to attend and didn't see much response.

    How about this from a flyer I picked up a couple weeks ago at the Peter
    Piper Pizza at MetroCenter:

    --------------------------------

    "A TRIBUTE TO ELVIS"

    WHAT:"The Elvis Forever Disc Jockey Show" hosted by Wallace Burford,
    Free-Lance Disc Jockey, in a Tribute To Elvis".

    WHERE:Peter Piper Pizza - 10030 N. Metro Parkway East - Phoenix, Arizona.

    WHEN:Friday Night August 16th and Saturday Night August 17th.  7:00 P. M.
    until 11:00 P. M.

    SCHEDULED PROGRAM
    Each night the D. Js. will be playing Elvis - Elvis and more Elvis music and
    songs.  Your host will be asking "Trivia" questions relating to the life of
    Elvis and those who answer trivia questions correctly will be rewarded!

    Each night twenty-five (25) "Lunch Size Pizzas" will be raffled off!
    Courtesy of Peter Piper Pizza/Peter Piper, Inc.

    Friday Night August 16th -- in memory of Elvis -- will be "TEDDY BEAR NIGHT"

    8:00 P.M. - Contest for the person who brings to this event the biggest
    "TEDDY BEAR".

    Your host is asking all true fans of Elvis -- in memory of him -- to bring
    your teddy bears -- whether or not you have the biggest teddy bear -- please
    bring it.  Thanks!

    9:00 P.M. - Contest based on the following question:

    Where did the phrase "Teddy Bear"
                    supposingly originate?"

    Your host will be giving away some of Elvis"s "Let Me Be Your Teddy Bear"
    records - 45-RPM -- all you have to do -- and be the first one -- after you
    hear the D.J. play that song -- is to run to your host and tell him what
    recording label Elvis recorded that song on.

    Saturday Night August 17th will be "FUN NIGHT FOR EVERYBODY"

    8:00 P.M. - "HULA-HOOP" contest.  Please bring your own hula-hoop.

    9:00 P.M. - "TWIST" contest for the best "Twister of the night".

    10:00 P.M. - Contest based on the following question:

    "Where did the name "Elvis" originate and what is its meaning?"

    --------------------------------
    This is a truly pitiful, yet hilarious, show, folks.  My family and I just
    happened to walk in on it last year as we drove back into town from
    vacation.

    Perfect as an excuse to get together!  (You might want to consider it for a
    month-long engagement at Gallery X, Peter.)

    Anyone interested?  And which night?

    Message: 7987
    Author: $ Michael James
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Bill
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 09:52:18

    That sounds interesting, though true pizza-lovers won't eat Peter Piper's
    "pizza."

    The GT was rescheduled for September 15 after everyone's vacations.  I
    thought I had announced it here already but I must have forgotten.

    Message: 7988
    Author: $ Wild Barbarian
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Ann - SLAM!
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 19:33:18

     2 points for ANN O.!!!!!  Hmmm...think it will penitrate his skull????

    Message: 7989
    Author: $ Wild Barbarian
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: MJ/ I agree
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 19:36:07

     Guess I am just an arguementive person at heart.  I refuse to have him or
    his religion pushed down my throat.  I tend to enjoy ramming it back. GRIN.
    I know it's a tough, dirty, thankless job, but someone has to do it....

    Message: 7990
    Author: $ Wild Barbarian
    Category: Believe it or not!
    Subject: Rod/I'll take
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 19:40:34

    your posts tounge-in-cheek for the most part.  Got a nice chukle.  But for
    the most part I would agree.... (Darn, why is the grey hair beginning to
    show?????)

    Message: 7991
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Wild/hair
    Date: 08/15/91  Time: 00:08:08

    No, my posts were not really tongue-in-cheek.  Do the amount of times that
    one's physical body has traveled around our center star (the sun) have
    anything to do with longevity, intelligence, health, size, grayness or
    baldness of any species of life?

    Yet there is a program that humans have written, traditional and taught, if
    you will but none the less an actual program with line numbers from 1 to 100
    and anything over that is you can name.  Everyone is placed in a box from
    birth and their so called "age", which is how many times your body has
    traveled, better yet, how far your body has traveled determines so much.

    Humans have been brainwashed on so many things.  There are so many stop
    codes that have been placed in our minds by 'authority' that need to be
    examined and are being examined and changed.

    Capitalism and many other 'isms' tend to treat the human animal like a
    machine in order to perform.  It would be better for these systems if we
    were robots.

    When many people reach their 30th birthday, they read that program line and
    usually follow it.

    Biological time, the stages our bodies go through before being discarded is
    real but physical time is all made up for many reasons.

    Early man, our ancestors who developed our time standard could handle it as
    it was new to them, probably novel but this 7 day, repetitious week we gave
    ourselves as well as the entire system needs to be revised before humans can
    completely pull itself out of the mire.

    Clocks are okay but don't take them too seriously.  Know what they are and
    how and why they came into being.  Understand that a humans 40th trip around
    the sun can find them in better health, physically and mentally, with more
    energy than their 15th trip.  Don't allow it to limit you as it tends to do.

    Before we can be totally free we need to understand that on a physical
    plane it is mass in motion changing on a continuum and it is not being done
    by a clock.

    X-Rated Cosmos Bulletin Board command:$C

    Message: 5004
    Author: $ Michael James
    Category: Cosmos-Chatter
    Subject: burning sensation
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 10:10:11

    Be careful if you ever go for a sexually-transmitted disease screening.
    After poking you various ways with needles and fingers, they run a narrow
    metal swab all the way up your urethra while telling you to relax! Then they
    do it AGAIN with another swab! Then they have the nerve to ask if you've
    ever experienced painful urination ("No, but I sure as hell will today!").

    Message: 5005
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Cosmos-Chatter
    Subject: Painful ...
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 20:25:44

    Did you read Lacey's column in NTW about Dr. Marc Baker?  Ouch!

    FILm & Video Bulletin Board command:$C
    Press [A] to abort

    Message: 1764
    Author: $ James Hawley
    Category: Filmography
    Subject: Deep Throat
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 02:17:33

    It's not SUPPOSED to be funny, but it is.  Pretty corny.  Yes, it's
    hardcore, and 15 or 17 years old.  Don't take it seriously...  I mean,
    consider the plot.  A womans clitoris is in her throat, and the only way she
    can climax is by deep felatio.

    Message: 1765
    Author: $ Steven Carls
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Pornos
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 22:02:38

    My favorite title for a porno was the adventures of -ickman and throbbin.
    Unfortunately I never saw it..
     " The ATARI WILDCAT "  Steven Carls " The ATARI WILDCAT "  Steven Carls

    Public Bulletin Board command:$C

    Message: 77538
    Author: Mark Adkins
    Category: Entertainment/Movies
    Subject: B&T's bogus movie
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 03:11:39

    What a stinker.  I blame Dean Hathaway, for his casual use of B&T jargon
    ("non-non-heinous") for tricking me into believing it was worth paying $3.00
    to see.  It wouldn't be such an outrage if I didn't know Dean was spreading
    his leathery black wings, laughing at the havoc he hath wrought, and eating
    homemade bread.  Clearly, some sort of federal regulation is called for.

    Message: 77539
    Author: $ Nick Ianuzzi
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: last
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 04:26:33

    Whoa!  The evil, metal dude returns!

    Message: 77541
    Author: $ Michael James
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Mark
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 09:36:27

    Aha!  So you *DO* have some respect for Dean's opinions!

    Message: 77542
    Author: $ Michael James
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Mychele
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 09:39:58

    Yes!  There is still a GT on September 15 at "my" (actually Renata's) house
    so mark your calendars for that Sunday afternoon.  Some people from the "Can
    We Talk" conference on Zephyr are also attending.

    The kitten and 29 year old unattached female housemate will be on display.

    Message: 77543
    Author: $ Ann Oudin
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Dean on book
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 10:51:15

    Now that sounds like a interesting book. I will purchase it. *>>> ANN O.
    <<<*

    Message: 77544
    Author: $ Michael James
    Category: Vote
    Subject: New Vote Idea:
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 14:38:16

    Over the past few months, what percentage of the time have you enjoyed your
    job?
       [A] 91-100
       [B] 81-90
       [C] 71-80
       [D] 61-70
       [E] 51-60
       [F] 41-50
       [G] 31-40
       [H] 21-30
       [I] Rarely
       [J] Never
       [K] I haven't had a job over the past few months

    Message: 77545
    Author: Tim Gimber
    Category: Bulletins
    Subject: back on line!
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 15:09:57

                    Tim's 386 is BACK ONLINE !!!!!!!!!!!!

       At least temporarily, hopefully permanantly.  Had a small financial
       reprieve, may or may not last, but please do call and find out what's
       going on!

                            Tim

             Tim's 386  (602)246-6285 24 hrs daily HST DS to 19200

    Message: 77546
    Author: Mark Adkins
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: M. James/77541
    Date: 08/14/91  Time: 22:32:57

    Well, enough at least that I am more annoyed by the proposed ban of
    computer-automated phone soliciting than I am by the calls themselves.
    I have always found hanging-up to be a practical and gratifying solution.
    And while it may well be coincidence, I am seldom troubled by such calls.

    On the other hand, I find the notion of a self-policing, self-correcting,
    post industrial revolution corporate America somewhat droll.