### Apollo BBS Archive - September 20 - 24, 1985

    Message: 31389
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Predicted?
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 08:41:20

            Just where in the Bible do you see "Giant quake rips Mexico in
    1985"?  Of course there have been major disasters since the beginning of
    man.  Any jerk can say there is going to be death and destruction in the
    future.....  prophecy-----] Bull$#!+   I just can't help wondering why even
    in the so called houses of God...Children praying are crushed and maimed.
    I seem to feel the pain of these stories now that I am getting older... I
    find it harder to shrug them off as meer numbers.  Where is this heartless
    guy we/? call God?  Surely with all his power...he can protect the people
    that are worshiping him at that given moment of a disaster.  Is he such a
    big shot he is beyond my questions?  I want answers.... Or am I a such a bad
    SYSOP that he is no longer talking to me. (I note you called me a FRIEND
    today Paul, A few days ago I was some slime that slid out from under a rock
    because I left messages with questionable content on line with out censoring
    them.)
            I have not ruled out there is a God, I am just having second
    thoughts.

    *=* SYSOP Cliff *=*

    Message: 31391
    Author: $ MICHAEL JAMES
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Cliff
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 10:16:51

    Don't reject God or the Bible or Christianity because of the faults you see
    in Paul.  There are many other ways to believe in God.

    As for the earthquake, I don't see why people in a church should receive
    special protection.  Are ALL churches "God's houses"?  I friend of mine
    "donates" all his money to the checking account of a church he created
    in order to lower his taxable income.  Then he pays his bills with checks
    from the church account.

    Message: 31392
    Author: $ MICHAEL JAMES
    Category: Question?
    Subject: talk shows
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 10:30:22

    Does anyone here listen to KFYI in the late morning?

    Message: 31394
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: *LUCKY* person...
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 11:26:32

    Her name is Vicky, soon to be Vicky Carter.
    Flatulent? Naww

                            -Wiz

    Message: 31395
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Roddy
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 11:31:16

    Having 'years' in a certain subject is not conductive to understanding.
    I too have often wondered about what makes God tick, but attempting to do
    so only clouds the issue further. It's like attempting to know what everyone
    is thinking all over the world at any given moment. The bible says his
    wisdom is infinite, and our greatest scholar's and understanding is but
    folly to him. I can dig that.
    As for you being an 'ex Christian', there's no such thing.

    "I will NEVER leave you"
    -even though you may leave him.

                                    -Wiz

    Message: 31396
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Thanks guys..
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 12:04:30

    For the well wishing and congrats's.

    Wedding is set for Nov 30, 1986; which falls on a Sunday.
    Boo hiss, I wanted a December wedding.
    Invitations? Hmm....

    I could just see it, 700 attend world's first 1200 baud wedding.

    Mike ("Soon to be Mr.") Carter

     woe unto mine arse

                                    -Wiz

    Message: 31397
    Author: CHARLES LEE
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Michael James
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 13:01:41

    Get serious will you... The churches those people in Mexico were in are
    some of the oldest Catholic temples in this continent (if not the oldest).
    I doubt if they were built by some raving spaniard who wanted to pay his
    bills (??? Who knows, they were into raping and pillaging!).  Well, like
    Cliff said, It kinda makes you wonder... What's going through this "God's"
    mind when such stuff happens.  The Mexicans alread have it bad enuff...
    Anyone heard the latest exchange rate? It's over 300 peso's for 1 dollar.
    Just think 4 years ago when I was in Guadalajara, it was 24/1. Those people
    have enuff problems, now they have to rebuild a city...

    Also, about prophecy, hardy har har... If something is written vaguely
    enough, you can contort anything to fit into place in the story...Especially
    if you're convinced (brainwashed) that it is the "WORD". I say
    hogg-wash, horse-feathers, boulder-dash, etc etc.

    Message: 31398
    Author: $ DAVID BURKHART
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Mexico
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 14:06:03

    First, as Charlie says, they were old buildings. Half of the old buildings
    were destroyed. Somehow the idea that God protect the people who were
    in church, and not those who were out working, seems wrong. God does  not
    intervene, does he? If he did, were is our freewill? In the beginning, God
    created the heavens and the Earth. He then ran out to grab a pizza, and
    he isn't back yet.

     My roommate is from Guadalajara. He has financial troubles, since every
    dollar costs him 350 pesos, and he isn't allowed to convert very much
    money. Luckily, no one in his family was hurt by the earthquake.

       Question: why are we so worried about South Africa, when conditions in
    Mexico are so bad? That's the place to watch, things are getting chaotic
    there, a breeding ground for communism.

       More difficult question: If a communist government does take power in
    Mexico, what do we do?

    Message: 31399
    Author: RICK ARTHUR
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Mr. Carter...
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 15:01:36

    Congrats Mike...

                                        -Rick

    Message: 31400
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Prophecies
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 17:13:18

    Well, seeing as how God has planned
    everything that happens at any time,
    at every place, I suppose it has
    already been decided whether or not
    I will or won't go to heaven. Great!
    I don't have to worry about that
    anymore, now I can get on with some
    serious sinning! God must have
    quite a calendar. Does he ever miss
    any dates? After all, he's only
    human. Or, as we were created in His
    image, we are only Gods. Cliff, do not
    feel bad about having doubts. The
    only good  beliefs are the ones you
    can freely question.

      Ex-Christian? Notin the sense that
    Mike stated, but I know a few also.
    Who wants  to be mediocre? I don't.
    So if  you don't want to  be a mediocre
    Christian, you have to get VERY
    deeply into the Word and abide by it.
    You CAN'T question it, which is a
    denial of freedom. So it's mediocrity,
    blindness, or truth. Choose one.

    Message: 31401
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Cliff
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 17:49:06

    Becuase of an incident like that, you are having second thoughts about God?
    Well, maybe due to his foresight, and our lack of, he could be saving all
    of us in the end.  Everything he does has some (a lot) of good in it.
    We cannot be sure what would have happened if there wasn't a quake at all,
    and we all don't have a link to heaven that entitles us to say, "Well,
    God meant to do this or that.  And so and so would have happened if there
    wasn't any quake."

    Message: 31402
    Author: $ DAVID BURKHART
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: In other words,
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 18:01:04

    Don't judge God. Don't judge Cliff or anyone else, either.

    Message: 31403
    Author: LON NAYLOR
    Category: Bulletins
    Subject: investBBS
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 18:12:06

    I'm looking for people interested in joining a Phoenix area BBS that will
    in (among other things) the weekly offering of real estate
    ut together specifically for investors. These are no-down,
    tax shelters. If enough interest is expressed, we will begin
    investment group to take advantage of the combination of
    omputer communications/data processing and the red hot Phoenix
    market. Please leave E-mail to Lon Naylor or write:

                      InvestBBS
                      P.O. Box 2331
                      Glendale, Az. 85301

    Message: 31404
    Author: GT PLAN
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: GT
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 18:32:21

    Upcoming GT:

                October 13th,Sunday
                1:00 to 5:00pm
                Peter Piper Pizza,Metro

    Invited:
                 All status users and non-status users which means you!

    DON'T MISS OUT!
    BE THERE!
    COME 1 COME ALL!

    Message: 31408
    Author: $ CHARLES LEE
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: GUESS WHAT

    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 21:20:58

    Another earthquake in Mexico.... Same place.... 7.8 or greater.... Fear
    of Sunami(sp, Tidal Wave) in Honolulu!  Well, that's hitting a little
    closer to home (Hawaii).  Maybe all of the people who're worried about
    S.Africa may start paying some attention to this hemisphere (ha ha).
    Things are looking bad down there.  Well, lets get going, Let's all get
    together and make a record to help the people in Mexico.... We could call
    it Mex-Aid, Quake-Aid, First-Aid? Any ideas... I know we must have some
    singing tallent here on Apollo.  Just think, we'd make the local news!

    Did you ever wonder how much fraud is going on in all this fund raising for
    Eithopia?  If there is as much as there is in Religion, boy, are the
    American people suckers...

    Message: 31409
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Mike Carter
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 22:56:02

    Mike, you are glitched.....but you have lots of company so it is normal.
    Do you realize that if you were born in India then you would believe
    their 'taught' religion.  Can't you understand that? There are MANY
    religions of the people of earth.  Because you were born in the USA
    (Australlia)  and among christian people is why you became christian.
    I did also when I was in your period of life.  But because of an
    extra-ordinary event in my life I started 'thinking' seriously about
    life.  Some humans never do.  They don't have to.  It wasn't my faault
    that something happened to me.  The people in church in Mexico are
    probabbly thinking pretty heavy right now.  Some no doubt will think
    that god is taking 'its' revenge.  Other sees it as being punished for
    not having pure thoughts.  But the children of that land who haven't been
    taught the current program will probabbly become thinkers.  Perhaps so,
    but we are evolving and even though our social structure is glitched we
    must pass onto our offspring a better way.

       You are getting married.  A male and a female are accepting each other
    as mates.  Good.....have a child or two and learn from thier innocent minds.

    Have a nice forever, Mike and Vicki

    Message: 31410
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Rod/Last...
    Date: 09/20/85  Time: 23:54:13

    Actually the place where I was born is Los Angeles. I was moved to Australia
    at age 4, where I lived till 17 and we moved back. The people in the areas
    I lived were either Catholic or Hindu, or a combo of both. Like I said,
    when one finds the truth, they will know it, no by faith, works etc, but
    by pure love. And that's something you don't have and therefore cannot
    relate to. I know where I stand.

    As for earthquakes in Mexico, people in church dying, etc etc, does not
    shake my foundations one iota. Those people are now with their Lord, a far
    better state than living where they were. Just because things happen, death
    and killing, does not mean God doesn't care and by no means does it
    conduct that he's cruel. I don't understand 'belivers' who say things like
    that. We're all very quick to deny his love, yet can't help but to point
    the finger at him for earthquakes et al. If people are so glued and rivited
    to the materialistic side of life, hanging on by whatever means crude or
    foul, I pity.  That's where your viewpoint stops. When you die, that'S all
    she wrote. Too bad. My life and viewpoint are quite different;
    I live here to do the best I can and abide by some very rewarding precepts.

    When the time comes for me to go, it's not a time to worry about. Sure, the
    physical side say's "I hate pain in any form", but mental side says it's
    only the beginning, and that, comes from the heart. Faith is a foundation in
    him, to have faith is to know and love him. Sorry, but we obviously cannot
    see eye to eye on this, so why you worry? You all gonna die sometime!
    I've got my ticket.

                                    -Wiz

    Message: 31411
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Breaking a record
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 00:10:20

    What's nice about beinengaged to her is that after all those trophies et
    al, that thin little frame of hers can really lay on a whallop and back
    massages take on a new perspective.

    Cold feet?

    I've got over a year...

    By that time the Chiropractor and I should be good friends heh heh heh

                                    -Wiz

    Message: 31412
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: judging god
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 01:00:19

    To call God good is just as much a judgment of his moral character
    as saying that he is evil.  No Christian can afford to make the claim
    that we cannot judge God.  If God creates the rules by which behavior
    is judged and the rules do not bind their Creator, then there is nothing
    which is improper for God.  Therefore, when God promises that Christians
    will go to heaven and atheists will go to hell, there is no reason to
    believe that he will not break his promise and send Christians to hell and
    atheists to heaven.  In fact, it is just as likely that he will break his
    promise as it is that he will not.  What possible grounds could the
    Christian have for maintaining that God will keep the promise in question?
    God's love for Christians?  But we could not call him unloving if he sent
    Christians to hell, for this would be to judge God.  If, then, we must hold
    that whatever God does is the right thing, then we have no way of knowing
    what he will do.

       Every possible excuse making the actual world consistent with the
    existence of a good God could be used in reverse to make that same world
    consistent with an evil God.  For example, we could say that God is evil
    and that he allows free will so that we can freely do evil things, which
    would make us more truly evil than we would be if forced to perform evil
    acts.  Or we could say natural disasters occur in order to make people more
    selfish and bitter, for most people tend to have a "me first" attitude in
    a disaster (note, for exxample, stampedes to leave burning buildings).
    Even though some people achieve virtue from disaster, this outcome is
    necessary if persons are to react freely to disaster.

    God cannot be both omnipotent and all-loving.  If so, he would be able
    to rescue babies who die needlessly in burning buildings.  A truly
    loving person who was capable of saving a baby in such a situation would
    do so.  God does not, so either he cannot or doesn't care.
    As the child succumbs to the smoke and flames, God may be pictured as
    saying, "Sorry, but if I helped you I would have considerable trouble
    deflating the ego of your parents.  And don't forget I have to keep
    those laws of nature consistent.  Besides, I didn't start this fire,
    so you can't blame me."

      And hell must exist purely for the purpose of vengeance.  Any punishment
    which takes place after the end of all things cannot be for the purpose
    of deterrence, after all, it's too late.

       Something else interesting:  if becoming a Christian is the only way to
    be saved, God is incredibly unjust, as millions have died without ever
    even knowing Jesus existed.  If God only damns those who hear the word and
    reject it, missionaries are perhaps the most immoral people on the face of
    the earth--if they would just shut up and not get the word out, more people
    would get into heaven.

    I found a succinct statement of the hell argument, from Arthur
    Schopenhauer in "The Christian System":

        "We are told that this God, who prescribes forbearance and
    forgiveness of every fault, exercises none himself, but does the
    exact opposite; for a punishment which comes at the end of all things,
    when the world is over and done with, cannot have for its object either
    to improve or deter, and is therefore pure vengeance."

      And another contradiction:  God cannot be both morally superior to humans
    and omniscient.  For God to be truly omniscient, he must know what it is
    like to feel jealousy, hatred, and lust.  Yet he cannot truly know what
    it is to experience these things without having experienced them himself.
    Yet if he has, he is guilty of sin and is not morally superior and should
    himself be condemned to hell.  If he does not have this direct experience,
    he has no basis on which to judge immoral urges in human beings.

       If he is guilty of sin and accepted himself to achieve salvation, that's
    still no good because then the blood sacrifice is not pure and cannot
    atone for the sins of the world.

    Message: 31415
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: last
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 02:41:48

    And I've got mine Mike.  I'm (hopefully) going straight to hell without
    passing GO.   I just wonder if someone is just barely good enough to make
    it to heaven are they treated as well as someone who exerted themselves
    here on earth?

       The person who said that Hawaii was "closer to home" than Mexico should
    rethink that statement.  I understand what context they said it in but
    everyone is related and in that Mexico is closer.

       My wife and I have six children and you are telling me I don't know
    love.   There is SO much you are in error about but thanks to evolution
    there is always hope that you will wake up.  Doesn't mean you will but
    you seem fairly intelligent and I will do my best to spread the work
    so that it will become commonplace and therefore more will accept it.
    After all, what is 'taught' is usually accepted by the masses,  isn't it?
    And as we get closer to the truth bigotryand misunderstanding is done
    away with.

       I love you but I know you do not understand this yet.   When I was
    as inexperienced as you and if someone told me what I am telling you,
    I would probabbly have simular reactions.

       If I am, in you'r view, the devil then not to worry cause your
    god created him and therefore is in total control of the situation.

    I wish I knew what caused you to lock in on the old, glitched religious
    program.   You never did quite say.

                      Peace

    Message: 31416
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: real estate owning
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 02:52:23

    Perhaps we (Apollo) should invest in real estate (as an earlier message
    on real estate) .   Wouldn't it be fun to be a big time landlord?

    We could forclose on families who didn't have the paper money to pay
    rent with.   We would be partially controlling others.   But on the
    bad side we would be causing crime from the ones who didn't have
    the rent and they would rob someone or steal to get it.

       Many people have 'tragedies' (such as medical emergencies; auto repairs;
    robbery or many other things that happen to people.)  When the mortgage
    payments can't be made then the lein holder blows them away and goes
    after a new sucker to sign up for 30 years.   If you work it right you
    could be one of those suckers.   Buy reposessed houses and harvest
    tennents once a month.   Fun, you bet.

                      Hey-sooz loves you all
                      Me

    Message: 31417
    Author: $ MARGARETE HERR
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: roomie needed
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 03:48:04

    Need a roomie for a 2 bedroom unfurnished town house
    with fireplace. Has tennis, pool, jacuzzi, BBQ, very
    nice grounds. 2 miles from ASU. Close to Smitty's, Alpha
    Beta. Have your own Bathroom. $250 per month includes
    utilities, $150 deposit. Refundable.

    Non-smoker, non-doper. No pets, please.
    Call Margarete at 962-4074 (home) or 967-8818 (work). NOW!
    Need to move by October first at the latest!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31421
    Author: $ MARGARETE HERR
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Gee...
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 04:14:00

    Didn't think it was THAT easy to get on Apollo at this time
    of day (night). Usually, whenever I have the time to log on,
    this board is busy. It sure is nice to get back on again.
    But I am missing some of the old guard of the users.

    Oh well, some of them are still here.
    See you all later.
    Got to get ready to go to work.
    Sleep tight...

    Margarete

    Message: 31422
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 09:19:24

    2 things, it states in the bible "thou shalt not lie."
    And Jesus taught that one should never make promises, for one is never sure
    they can be kept.  (Not in those exact words.)

    Now, this doesn't mean God can't break his own rules......but we are not the
    ones to decide.

    Message: 31423
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Burning babies
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 09:21:29

    How do you suppose God would do it?  Put his hand down there, pick up
    the baby, and put him/her in it's mother's arms?

    Parapsychologists (SP) would be swarming around them for the rest of
    their lives!

    Message: 31424
    Author: $ MATT MONTE
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Sports SIG
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 09:36:02

    Hey!  I sports SIG sounds like fun!

    Message: 31425
    Author: $ JAYNE BURGESS
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Metro GT
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 10:16:24

    The GT sounds like lots of fun.  I wonder if they have a T.V. thought so
    I can keep track of the football scores.  Can't miss the games!!!!!  I'll
    be there though -- appetite and all.

    See everyone then.

    Jayne

    Message: 31426
    Author: $ JAYNE BURGESS
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Gemini Store
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 10:20:21

    I finally got over to the new store.  I really liked it and Cliff asked that
    I do a "Review".  How do you review a store?

    It seems much bigger than the old store but Cliff says it's about the same
    size.  It's just arranged differently.  I really liked the blue paint --
    it's soothing and calming.  Gives you the feeling that you can piddle around
    in there for a long time without feeling pressured.

    I liked the window to the patio, too.  The trees give it a "homey" feeling.

    Really, Cliff, you did a nice job.  And there's PLENTY of parking, which is
    quite a change, and real easy to get in and out of the shopping center --
    definitely a change.

    My hat's off, Cliff.  Good Work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Jayne

    Message: 31427
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Simpson/31423
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 12:03:34

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    If he's omnipotent, he could do it any damn way he likes.
    So what about parapsychologists?  Such an event would probably
    convince more people of the existence of God and thus send more
    people to heaven.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31428
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Simpson/31422
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 12:07:24

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Jesus said not to make promises, but God has made promises.
    Therefore he *has* broken his own rules, according to Christians.
    I'm certainly not about to rely on any God who breaks his own rules.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31429
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: last 2
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 13:28:16

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Where did God make promises in the bible?

    How do you know what would happen in the future?  (I don't know eitherr,
    so I am just as wrong.)

    If I were to say that God has a reason for everything, I'd be wrong in
    assessing his actions.  Actually, by saying anything about him keeping in
    mind what the bible says, we'd be dead wrong!
    This is a no-win situation.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31430
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Last
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 13:35:08

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Then why play?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31431
    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Promises....
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 14:48:06

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      I believe God promised to Noah not to flood the world again, if you
    want a promise. Of course, that's a pretty easy promise to keep, although
    modern science has evidence of global flooding... And we're overdue, by
    the way. (Sheer coincidence, I say.)

                                            Dean

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31432
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: promises/last
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 15:31:36

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    That's the particular promise I had in mind.
    John 3:16 is a promise, as well.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31433
    Author: THELAHUN GINJEET
    Category: Question?
    Subject: Answer!
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 17:02:17

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    My name used to be Matte Kudasai but I changed it to Thela Hun Ginjeet. It's
    a nicer, more quaint kinda name.

    Rod, in an earlier message, you stated that something etraordinary happened
    that caused you to give up Christianity and go with your own beliefs. What
    was it that happened? Were you just walking along one day, and were struck
    with realization, or was it a gradual, painful understanding?

    Wizzer, what led you to be a Christian? Why do you think you have a ticket
    to heaven? In your religion, there are more ways and specifics of getting
    into heaven than you can imagine. I'm sure you have a single, explicit,
    belief of what it takes. Yet the Puritanism code  states that for one to
    make it into God's arms, he must experience Grace(cleansing of the soul),
    Plainness(in religion), and believe in Manifest destiny(reach to God for
    guidance in your own, singular divine mission). The code of conduct as
    dictated by lines in the bible tells us that we must be generous,
    self-controlled,  mannered, and act as public servants to the Lord at  all
    times, regardless of ANY circumstances. Can you honestly say you make  it
    in this case?  Not directly out of the bible, but interpreted by the
    founders of the protestant missions during the industrial revolution. If you
    take a close look at history, you'll see how we've shaped and metamorphis-
    ized our religion to fit OUR, not God's, wants and needs. It's a cultural
    revolution, and was the link that led me to believe religion as falsehood.
    The messages Lippard posted held a great deal of validity. Learn them.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31434
    Author: THELAHUN GINJEET
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Question?
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 17:17:33

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    You MUST stop bragging about "having a ticket" to heaven. Don't flatter or
    get ahead of yourself, as God's apparent cheer has been known to swing
    around and envelop destiny towards darkness. Yes, GOD. Can we not say that
    anything which is the work of Satan is also the work of God? This I find to
    be true. When God committs an act, who's good is it for? Rarely ours.
    Most likely His. That is, if He exists... As Christians all like to petition
    the Lord with prayer, they are wasting their time. Any successful "wishes"
    are mere  coincedince. More than often, my prayers to God were NOT answered,
    even when many people were praying with me. I often wonder, did He ignore
    me, did He hear me, did he CARE? This was in the case of my cousin's baby
    who was ill with pneumonia and we had been praying for her for quite some
    time to pull through. She finally died, and that was the start of one of
    the greatest things that ever happened to my life. I wondered and thought
    logically,  or practically, about my God. In time, I had a great deal of
    insight about what makes us want to believe in a God, and I ended up taking
    a course in religions, such as Buddhism, early American Gods, you name it.
    All these Gods have the same thing in common (with a few exceptions, of
    course): They all appear in the image of their worshippers. They all
    promise salvation IF the worshippers will follow the rules. They are all
    omniscient, and omnipotent, yet they rqarely, if ever, give examples of
    their power as  proof (faith driven). (An exception is some arabic/kalhesian
    cults that believe earthquakes, volcanoes, etc are God "flexing"...)
    You should all open your minds up, take as much in as possible, without
    "believing" it all per se, and your perspectives will be priceless...

    Message: 31438
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Question
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 18:57:00

    Time remaining: 02:40

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    TO Robert Simpson,   I do not believe in a god.

    To Thelanun,  Just call it a heavy duty brush with death.

    To Me,  you are an idiot and you are going to hell forever.  Let me
    enlighten you as how long forever is.   The period it takes our entire
    galaxy to go to dust isn't even the beginning of eternity.  A trillion
    times longer than that isn't even a zit in eternity.  Double that,
    times ten, times 1 million, triple that and that isn't even close to
    eternity.  Yet you Rod Williams are going there because you are a a$$%ole.

    To Paul Savage, my apologies for assuming incorrectly  about how you were
    programmed.  Sorry.

    To all,  If you look for gods love and deny human love then you are up the
    creek.

    Time remaining: 02:14

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31439

    Author: $ JOEL GENESYS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Aster's thanks
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 19:17:41

    Time remaining: 02:08

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Its too bad that you're insecure enough about your ideas that you'd
    rather have people agree with you than disagree.  Personally, I prefer
    people who disagree with me.  They tend to be funnier, and sometimes
    I even learn something.

    Time remaining: 01:58

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31440
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: In search of
    Subject: Truth
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 02:23:41

    Time remaining: 01:52

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Many religionists beliefs usually contain hocus-poc

    Shall I continue?
    Sure if you've got the time..I'm all ears and eyes.

    Now what is this "Heavy duty brush with death"?

    I will spell it out....L - S  - D.....but a long story with it.

    Oh, I didn't know that.  Yikes...you should tell me that story in person, if you
     even want to.

    Sure I want to...it was probably the single best thing that happened to me.  My
    father's generation had the big war and when they went into it as young men they
     came out as old men...and my generation had a choice....Viet Namn or LSD, altho
    ugh I was arrested by the FBI and drafted into the US Army in 1962 I did not ser
    ve...I took the latter instead.

    Is that why Roger Daltrey stutters in "My Generation"?
    That's possible.....I had a friend, Tommy, who took so much acid that he couldn'
    t focus his eyes for six months.

    Was he deaf dumb and blind?  (Kidding, damn it, I'm kidding!)

    In a sense he was because he joined 'The Children of God or some such shit organ
    ization.

    I guess people are basically weak...well, I have some stories I could tell but I
     will save them for the public board on Apollo.  Right now I am baking a peach c
    obbler pie and I need to pass time while waiting for it, so I will send you the
    next slab-o-Apollo from 1985.  I was Matte Kudasai and Thela Hun Ginjeet, by the
     way.

    I suspected as much.....go for it........

    Wouldn't it be great if we could talk on the phone at the same time as we typed?
      If my phone line wasn't broken (I'm using my parents' line), we could.
    What is wrong with your phone line and it in the process of being fixed?

    My stepfather works at US West and he said he would fix it, but it isn't high on
     his priority list, it seems.  The line runs out of the wall and goes outside, r
    unning along the side of the house.  I followed it back to the side of the house
     and it is totally ripped apart.  I don't know if a tree branch did it, or if To
    m did it because he was trying to fix it, or if vandals did it.

    Either Cliff or Rob did it.

    Well, Rob must be holding quite a grudge!  I think he'd want to do something a l
    ittle more fun, like turning off all the power while my computer was on or somet
    hing.
    But he is Christian and holding a grudge is a part of that religion, he, he.

    It sure is.  Look at God.  Still won't let Satan come back after all these years
    .  Poor Satan.
    Yeah but the book is the book and it just doesn't up and change, ya know.

    Yeah, sure Robert Simpson.

    Ha. ha.....you might want to do a post with that particular point ...may be fun.

    Which point?

    God holding a grudge.

    You can do it.  I'm sure that Paul Savage and Daryl will have some sort of bibli
    cal explanation, such as "In Exodus 13:34 it says that only when the yuletide co
    tton plants burn during the season of the corn ritual aftermath and ye Savior ea
    ts the cornmeal of the buggers flesh, only then can Satan rise up the holy escal
    ator into the heavenly shopping mall above, amen."  Or something.

    You must be talking about ACTS 2:2: 18-24, yah?

    I haven't got a clue, I don't even own a bible.
    You can have mine?

    Well, you only have 1.  Cliff has 10!  Maybe he will give me one.

    Which version?  Mine has the original Greek and it reads funny as hell.  I had a
     friend who taught Greek and he read it aloud to me and it says nothing that mak
    es a good bit of real sense but hey, that's what religions are made of...so

    I don't grok Greek.  I heard that in Greek, Jesus' name is actually Jesus Christ
    iopolous.

    Jesus was known as Jesus of Nazareth....or later referred to as Jesus the
    Christ because he earned his Christ degree while fasting in the desert for 40 da
    ys and forty nights all the while being tempted by doubts (Satan) and he finally
     understood and overcame desires of greed and such stuff.  In other words he got
     stoned on some heavy shit and saw the universe.  His eyes glowed and he was per
    manetly high.

    So high that he rose to the heaven above, Hallelujah!  You know, they offer a Ch
    rist degree at the U of A.  I thought about minoring in it, but I decided to be
    a humanities minor instead.  I think Christ probably pretended to fast for 40 da
    ys but instead went to a greasy spoon joint and had Eggs Benedict.

    It was Eggs McMuffin.

    Jesus never ate the yolk.  In ACTS 13:23, it said that whenever Jesus had excess
    ive amounts of yolk in his eggs, he would get cross.

    That makes sense.  I believe that it is possible to overcome the flesh, desires
    and all that but I'm afraid that you wouldn't last very long because the redneck
    s would nail your ass real quick like.

    I don't see the point of overcoming the flesh.  We have to accept the fact that
    we have animal desires, and choose to deal with them in a responsible way.  Not
    deny them and pretend we're above it.  People who do that turn into rapists...or
     preachers.

    Arf-arf....you are correct.  However, I would like to crawl the hell permanetely
     out of my flesh because it is such a fucking pain....it is my prison, for now.

    Yep, and you have a life sentence.  I would like to crawl out of my flesh, but t
    here is not an escape route, so I just enjoy the temporary "highs" of dreams and
     really, really good, arousing, sensitive sex.

    Yup.  How is your 'cobbler' cuming?

    It's due to be done at about 3:05.  Let me send you another buffer, or are you re
    ady for the dream world?
    Go ahead..send away, I am fine for now...

    OK.  Here comes more poop.

    SP31440

    Message: 31440
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: In search of
    Subject: Truth
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 02:23:41

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Many religionists beliefs usually contain hocus-pocus, things which are take
     on 'faith' but any good scientists excludes all of that from their
     thinking.  They have to in order to find the truth.

       Down through the ages scientific minds have made many important
     discoveries some of which have caused the discoverer to be put to death or
     banished & all in the name of god.

       Yet religions all over the world have usuallly accepted these ideas at a
     latter date.  In fact religionists haven't made one important discovery in
     all the while that leads them closer to proving a 'being supreme' (hold
     the mustard) exists.  I wonder what this world would be like today if
     science was totally dead.  Thank the daring thinkers, many who have had a
     figurative sword to their head, that we will never know.

       If a person such as Jesus was in this world today he no doubt would be
     picked on and laughed at for his radical ideas.  He would most probabbly
     be condemed by the same people who profess belief in him.  What a pity.P

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31441
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Joel Genesys

    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 02:25:51

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Yes, I totally agree with you.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31442
    Author: ASTER SCOTT
    Category: Religion
    Subject: God, Science, Stuff
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 03:10:14

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    The most basic tenet of Christianity is that "God is good." This is why
    Christians have such a hard time with "The Problem of Evil." Some Islamic
    sects believe that you can't possibly figure out what God is trying to do,
    and that the notions of "good" and "evil" do not apply to Him. All one can
    do, they reason, is to study the Qur'an, the Sunna, and whatever the hell
    that other book is, and constantly practice singing the Qur'an, until God
    finally scoops you up and plunks you down in Paradise. Buddhist sects believ

    But never mind all that. You've probably heard it frequently, and these
    people are all screwed up anyway. Life/Reality is a pattern, and nothing
    more. All this business about God is really senseless. Don't worry about it.

    Incidentally, Rod, eternity is NOT an infinity of time. Eternity is
    timelessness; existence outside of time. Which, of course, is not possible.
    So don't worry about going to Hell (which probably can't exist either). You
    should be careful to realize that Science does not replace Religion, or at
    least, it shouldn't be allowed to. Both Science and Religion, at their best,
    are studies of patterns; and when they deviate from this, they cease to
    serve a useful purpose.

    As for the kids killed in the Mexican church, well of course God could have
    saved them if He wanted, but, quite specifically, He didn't want to. He is
    not concerned with prolonging our lives, or mitigating suffering. What IS
    His REAL purpose? There is none. God is an excuse for meaningless lives.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31443
    Author: ASTER SCOTT
    Category: Religion
    Subject: Heaven
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 03:25:07

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I was lying in bed, reading a book, when this soft white light filled the
    room. After a moment, it faded, leaving an old man with wild eyes, a shaggy
    white beard, and crooked, discolored teeth.

    I said, "Hey, old buddy! Nice of you to drop in!"

    He said, "Oh, so now I'm an old buddy, eh?" He cackled, and dropped into a
    squat at the foot of my bed.

    I smiled. "By the way, when are you going to airlift me to Heaven? Y'know,
    rescue me from all the slime and perversity of human affairs."

    He chuckled at that, and rubbed His eyes. "Well, there's a funny story in
    there somewhere.... But, anyway, you ARE in Heaven."

    I laughed. "THIS is Heaven? Well, I always had a suspicion.... But isn't
    Heaven supposed to be entirely, absolutely, Wonderful?"

    God scratched the oily white hair of His avatar, and chuckled some more.
    "Well, y'know, I never really was very good at this." And He smiled.

    ...And We Are Made in His Image.

    (Doesn't this explain EVERYTHING?)

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31444
    Author: ASTER SCOTT
    Category: Religion
    Subject: The Meaning of God
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 03:50:21

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I am unsatisfied, and am seeking the meaning of life.
    Everything in this life is chaotic...meaningless.
    God is outside of Life and Chaos, and so is meaningful.
    I can attain meaning by becoming one with God; or God is Good, and God has a
      plan for everything, so I may find meaning in the Performance of His Plan.
    Now that I am in the Plan of God, I see that everything is conducted by the
      Hand of God, and what seems to be Chaos and Meaninglessness is simply the
      Divine Mystery. Everything is Copacetic.

    ...And this is the way it usually goes. Some add a final flourish or two, in
    which religious structures are altered or exchanged or rejected entirely
    (leaving the person in a cynical, despairing state).

    The problem is, of course at the root of this simple progression. It should
    look something like this:

    I may act, but I don't know what to do.
    Examining everything, I find that I can understand patterns in most things,
      some I cannot.

    The more patterns I understand, the more I know what to do, for my actions
      are themselves patterns, and they affect other patterns like ripples on
      the water.

    I will continue seeking patterns.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31445
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Lime Street
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 07:34:49

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

            Did anyone see 'LIME Street' with Robert Wagner last night?
    The girl playing his oldest daughter was the one that was recently
    killed in a plane crash.  She played her part well and looked like a
    cute kid.  How sad, she had so much going for her... another sence-less
    death by God....  I tell ya, I do NOT understand LIFE or DEATH?  What is
    it's goal?

    *=* Dissatisfied *=*

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31446
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Noah and the promise
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 09:05:41

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

     I didn't get a chance to read through the noah's ark part, but it did
    happen to be in the Old Tetament, which was definately before Christ.

    As for John 3:16, "For God so loved the world that he gave his only
    begotten (SP) son so that he who believes in him would not perish,
    but have eternal life."

    That wasn't a promise.  It's like "If I tie my shoelace, then my shoe
    won't fall off."

    Jesus had that purpose, and in order for "he who believes in God" to
    have eternal life, Christ had to die.  No promise there.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31447
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Simpson
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 10:27:21

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I thought everyone was familiar with the Noah's ark story...how
    God made the rainbow as his promise that he would never flood
    the world again.

       John 3:16 states quite clearly that anyone who believes in
    the Son of God will have eternal life.  It most certainly is a
    promise.

       PROMISE: an oral or written agreement to do or not to do something.
    to give a basis of expectation.

       My dictionary even gives the following right after the definition
    of promise:

       Promised Land: Canaan, promised by God to Abraham and his
    descendants (Genesis 17:8).

       What difference does it make that it's in the O.T.?  Are you
    claiming that the Old Testament is not the word of God?  If so,
    then how can you say Jesus fulfilled any prophecies and is the
    Son of God?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31448
    Author: MYCHELE NICKELS
    Category: Tales & Tall Stories
    Subject:
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 11:09:38

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      As I look out on to the rubble that once was my home, I cry.  Not only for
    myself, but for my people, my family, my parents.

      It came so suddenly and I don't think Nana understood until it was too
    late.

      I might be able to sleep well tonight.  They took the young children out
    of this side of the church and brought in the others who don't need much
    help.

      Today I was asked to help; I tended to a young mother and her child.  The
    baby, just a lone chicito, was crying and the mother was trying hard to
    clam it down.  She didn't know that the screams of pain from this little
    person were from it's arm.  It was all blue and yellow when I got to it.
    I figure it was broken.  Then I rushed to the red cross lady and told her.
    She told me there was nothing she could do and that it (the arm) would
    probably have to be amputated.  Dios Mio!  Why?  Why not me instead of this
    small creature who can not yet speck of the pain it's feeling.  Then I began
    to remember the others brought in last night and I do realize, sadly, that
    there really is nothing anyone could do for the children.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31449
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Recent Mess
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 13:30:34

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Why is it that I suddenly find this
    board so depressing?  Reality hurts.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31451
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Religion
    Subject: Creator
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 13:56:59

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Everybody's got some kind of
    Belief about creator
    Some say openly, "I don't know"
    Some build elevators
    To take the chosen few
    Who can afford the scenic view
    To the top of some big tower
    Looking out on fields of blue
    Walking clouds on caves of emptiness
    That fall around their minds
    To flirt openly with vapour
    And the trail it leaves behind
    Fences fly and sidewalks cry
    Concerning our creator
    Turning loose  the butterfly
    That ate the alligator
    Picking up its open-ended
    Holographic roots
    It moved out to the tower
    To look down on me and you
    Walking caves of empty water
    In the boring morning rain
    Making love to open windows
    And  the vapour trails refrain

    Message: 31455
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: In search of
    Subject: truth
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 16:47:08

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    The old saying "Give me Liberty or Give Me Death" has changed somewhat to
    "Give me Liberty or Give Me Drugs".  Drugs include Alcohol, Pot, Cocaine,
    Heroin, Valium, PCP and many other things that take away a bit of the
    harsh reality of life.  For everyone to be 'well off' in a capitalistic
    state would be near impossible.  The system sucks but with a few minor
    adjustments it could be made to work a lot better and the benefits would
    include less crime and fewer druggies.   All lifeforms on this planet
    have the basic right as well as the need to a place to live without
    threat of eviction.  Because it just isn't so causes stresses in our
    system which affect virtually everyone.  People are harvested just like
    crops twelve times per annum.  If you are one of these harvesters then
    you are a part of the problem.  Sure you can become 'rich' this way but
    at the expense of some poor sucker and his family who is kept on edge
    and hopping in order to meet the first of the month deadline.  No grace
    period here...either you got the payment or you don't.  Drugs are an easy
    way out.  Also the beleif that you will go to eternal heaven when you
    croak is another.  Both are 'mind soothers' or crutches.  How much longer
    can this be allowed to go on.  A friend of ours finally got his house
    paid off after 30 years but the taxes that are put upon him is equal to
    paying rent.  Give us a break you slimey pig capitalists.  You are only
    putting unrest and crime into this world just so you can vacation in
    Europe each year (and in a socialist system to boot).

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31456
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: In search of
    Subject: truth
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 17:06:15

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Gee, Cliff....looks like you are examining your basic program.  Good for
    you.   Most just lock themselves in to 'their' traditions and stay that
    way for life.  The little children then bring about the changes.
    A very few 'adults' actually keep thinking.   One of those people is
    Timothy Leary and another was Albert Einstein.
    See you later when I get the opportunity to trek to Gemini.

                          Rod

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31457
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Simpson
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 18:39:44

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Let me try and help you out a little here.  The problem you're
    running into is created because you are insisting that God says
    not to make promises.  Why don't you look through your bible and
    see if that's exactly what is said.  I don't know what you're
    referring to, I'd like to see some references.  I don't think I've
    heard the claim before that God prohibited promises.
    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31458
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 19:01:32

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Well, Rod, you seem to believe that
    this world can be made better if we
    eliminate the need for taxes and
    monthly mortgages. Obviously, this
    is easier said than done. The taxes
    we pay seemingly should take care
    of all out problems, but of course
    they don't. These mythical people
    who are millionaires and spending
    their winters in Europe tanning and
    getting fat just don't exist. Our
    taxes on everything are often
    overblown and seem ridiculous but
    are paying for everything that makes
    America what it is. You may not
    think we have paradise, but compared
    to just about every other country,
    we ARE in heaven. We don't have to
    stand in produce lines every day
    after school or work for 5 or 6
    hours just so our families can have
    something decent  to eat, nor do we have to limit our luxuries to bicycles
    and generic magazines. The things we take for granted are unbelievable
    luxury elsewhere. Then again, there are a few drawbacks.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31459
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: More Rod
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 19:14:44

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    What I'm trying to say is that out government isn't THAT corrupt. Sure,
    there may be a few grisly greedy selfish scums in high places that do  us a
    little damage, and most likely out of their own desire for luxury and the
    love of money. The  love of money is inevitable for some, although
    certainly not acceptable. But many politicians are not necessarily trying to
    screw us up and have good intentions.   Reagan has done as much for us as
    he has done unintentionally against us. We might blame him on the heavy-duty
    taxes, but he honestly believes that we need the money for defense. And his
    reasons ARE valid, perhaps leaving some questions, but the integrity is
    there. As for religion, well, Rod, you know how I feel about that. Another
    insecure yet understandable need of man - something to believe in. In time,
    LOTS of time (and I use the word "time" rather loosely), this need will wear
    off for many, but not all.

      Rod, how would you go about alleviating the need for taxes and mortgages
    on one's residence? Surely you would not just take them away, that would be
    like pulling the carpet out from under society's feet. And if I seem a wee
    bit ignorant on some of the more technical aspects of what I'm talking
    about, it's probably because I am. Nobody knows everything at age 16, so
    feel free to clear up anything I am sadly mistaken about. My only purpose
    here is to learn, hence the opposing viewpoint.

                 Trying,

                   Zak

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    Message: 31460
    Author: TARA REYNOLDS
    Category: Joke
    Subject: JOKES
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 19:27:54

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    KNOCK KNOCK
    WHAT A MINATE
    YOUR SAPOSED TO SAY WHO'S THERE?
    WHO IS???????
    ME STUPID!!!!
    YOUR STUPID????
    NO YOU ARE
    YOU ARE?!?!?!
    YEA FOR TELLING YOU A JOKE?
    FOR LINE #2 IT IS WAIT NOT WHAT
    THIS JOKE IS CALLED TELLING A JOKE TO A POLOCK

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31461
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: taxes

    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:09:24

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    It's a good thing we don't get all the government we pay for.
    I estimate that over a third of my income goes to the government.
    Think about it--first there are the obvious taxes and licensing
    fees: income tax, social security, sales tax, drivers' license
    fees, gas tax.  Then there are hidden taxes:  every item and service
    you pay for has a price which is higher than it would be if the
    manufacturers and providers of those things did not have to pay
    taxes and tariffs.  Effectively, everything you get has already
    been taxed multiple times and then is taxed again when you buy it.

       Are there any services government provides which could not be
    provided equally well (or better) at less cost by private organizations?
    History seems to indicate that the answer is no.  Private arbitration
    is far cheaper than going through the court system, and much faster.
    The police are ineffective to the point that private security now
    outnumbers them more than 2 to 1.

       The only sticky areas are those in which a public goods problem
    presents itself--a situation where you can't deny the service to those
    who don't wish to pay for it, such as national defense.
    Yet even those are not unsolvable, solutions have been proposed by
    David Friedman in The Machinery of Freedom, Morris and Linda Tannehill
    in The Market for Liberty, and Murray Rothbard in The Ethics of Liberty.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31462
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Ethics of Liberty
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:12:28

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I recommend that no one read this book without also reading
    "The Myth of Natural Rights" by L.A. Rollins.  TMoNR refutes
    some of Rothbard's basic premises, though does not make the
    theoretical application of his principles any less valid--it
    merely demonstrates that it is not inherently *the* right way,
    as Rothbard seems to claim.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31463
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: TARA
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:45:54

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Tara is my sister.....she's 12.
    She's really nice...
    Welcome her!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31464
    Author: ASTER SCOTT
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Capitalist Piggery
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 22:24:36

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    ...Oh, by the way, "Hello Tara!"

    Was it Zak Woodruff who said the Gov't was staffed with wonderful,
    altruistic persons? Was it Zak who said there are not a lot of rich folks
    (or corporations, or Gov't operations) with greater lobbying power screwing
    the disorganized masses every which way? Very optimistic, Zak.

    One thing we should do is move from the gold standard to the solar standard.
    Gold is a limited commodity; when one person gets rich, he impoverishes
    others. There is no reason for this, except that those in power would like
    to stay in power. With modern technology requiring energy as it does, energy
    has a certain monetary value. Technological societies cannot run without it.
    So how about making energy (symbolized by the sun) our new standard for
    currency? It is certainly abundant enough to enable everyone to lead "rich"
    lifestyles.

    Now, you are probably thinking, won't that just create ridiculously high
    inflation, and better no one's lives? NO. It won't create inflation;
    inflation is where you generate more paper of money, and you devalue
    it, so businesses have to charge what looks like more in order to simply get
    the same value for their product. With the solar standard, mints would be
    solar or kinetic (etc.) power stations; that's a little poetic, but it means
    every dollar would be backed with a stable value. (Doesn't it? Comments?)

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31465
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Jim
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 22:28:36

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I'll get back to you.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31466
    Author: PERRY HORNER
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: TARA
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 22:50:49

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    HI~I TARA!
    Welcome to ~~~~, ~~~~~~~~~~

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31468
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Aster
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 01:06:58

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Was it Aster who said that a form of currency known as "energy", in the
    symbol of the sun, would change our lifestyles drastically so we could all
    be MUCH richer? Was it Aster that said that there are plenty of corrupt
    "J.R. Ewings" out there leeching off of our taxes and obvious ignorance?
    Was it Aster who said that a new form of currency  such as energy would
    always have something backing it up, while ours doesn't? (Gold) Was it
    Aster who said that inflation would NOT go up because the venders could
    still make profits with his new form of  currency but would not corrupt to
    the point where they kept giving themselves a little more profit so they
    could be a little more well off, and when enough people did this the
    inflation wouldn't go up? What I'm trying to say to you Aster, is not to be
    twisting my words like that to make me look wrong, although I agree a little
    with what you said and I did not consider all aspects when I wrote those
    messages. I find your idea very optimistic, too.

    Tara Reynolds--] Hey girl! You certainly did get off to a nice start.
    Funny, Michelle never told me she had a sister, so tell us a little about
    yourself, eh? (Friendliness is a good policy, don't you think?)

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31469
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: In search of
    Subject: Truth
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 01:38:48

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I'll hve to reread your message and get back to you.
    I think I understood the spirit of the message so I will say a few words.
    There are many people that are using the masses to stuff their coffers
    so they or their faimilies NEVER have to work or pay rent again.

    Around the turn of the century Land was taken by those who had the most
    force (or even a printing press; deeds)  and this land has been passed
    on up through the ages, divided and subdivided.  The unlucky ones now
    must cough up a large sum in order to not be kicked out of their
    dwelling even though in most probability the dwelling needs to be
    cleaned with a flamethrower.  Chanches are the dwelling is not environmental
    effecient and reeks with the stench of humanity since the week after it
    was built.

       Believe me Zak, there are real honest to badness slum-lords out there
    just wanting you to worship them with your money.

    And remember on each piece of our currency it says "In God We Trust". (Just
    thought I would throw that in.)  Also Churches are listed in the business
    section of the phone book.  If you could trace down the owners of some of
    the properties we may be suprised.   I will answer more laterZak.

    I basically like your messages......later

                                         Rod

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31470
    Author: $ JAMES HAWLEY
    Category: Joke
    Subject: Mexico
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 01:48:41

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Did you hear that Mexico City elected a new mayor?

    -Barney Rubble.  He won by a landslide.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31471
    Author: $ JAMES HAWLEY
    Category: Joke
    Subject: Mexico
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 01:50:35

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Did you hear that the major religion in Mexico has switched?

    From Catholics to Quakers.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31472
    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Energy...
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 02:47:42

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

       That was attempted around 1840. A group of (so-called) scientists got
    together and created their own political party, with their major promise
    being to convert the country over to a monetary system based on the erg.

       Needless to say, we still buy things with dollars. If you want to have
    a monetary system that provides an unlimited supply of money, just pick
    any system that isn't backed by gold, silver, or other material. Many
    examples exist of systems like this -- and the result is always runaway
    inflation. For an economy to be well managed, it must have finite financial
    resources. Infinite resources can never be controlled.

                                    Dean

    Bulletin Board command ([H] for help):

    God, I was just a bit naive back then.
    Yeah, I certainaly was, that's for sure...I think I've learned a few things too.
       One thing I've noticed is that the faster I type the better I can express ide
    as because they don't get away as fast, eh?

    I know what you mean, I like being able to type fast, the only problem is when y
    ou make errors, eh?  Oh yes look at me go I'm so fast look at me typing fast I w
    ish I could go faster wheeeeeeeee...

    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee...now that was fast.
    When I first met JT I noticed that he was like lightening.  When I first started
     out (i don't make errors, eh) I had to look at every key and that slowed me don
    down and I would forget many a thought in mid-stream...at least now I can usuall
    y finish a thought.   I started getting faster during the debates on religion in
     1985, I think.   Anyway I am sure that we haven't hit peak typing speed, yet.

    Touch typing helps.  I still make mistakes, but I think I am fast enough that I
    could get a job typing if I wanted.  Word processing is the reason that I am as
    fast as I am.  I write practically everything on the WP.  One thing, though, pra
    ctice doesns't necessarily make perfect -- look at Cliff.  You have keep trying,
     though.  Some people just give up, and then they *really* don't get anywhere.
    I am now going to send the next batch, and by the time it's done my cobbler shou
    ld be ready.
    Yum...go ahead and good point about Cliff.

    It will probably be too hot to eat, so I can even send MORE messages!  (Eeek.)
    But I want to get on Apollo tonight and see if Jeff Beck has been on.  He usuall
    y gets on around 1 AM.  Okay, here goes the last batch.  (Note:  I really like a
    nd liked Aster Scott's messages.  Of all the people, he had the biggest effect o
    n me, for some reason.  I wonder what happened to him.)

    ARE Clinic on 40th St. & Indian School....that is (shit) where is was last seen.
      He was interesting for sure and I miss him along with so many others.  I would
     have thought that Cervelli and Lippard would have had the biggest effect, for s
    ome reason...hmmm.

    Cervelli was too self-righteous.  Much of what he said had a certain "look at me
    , look how logical I am and look at my glorious grammar" quality to it.  Lippard
    's messages had a big effect, and were very good, but they lacked emotion and ar
    e basically cold, bland, analytical straightforward arguments (which is good in
    itself).  But Aster really hit the target, what the real issues (in my mind) wer
    e.  The motives for wanting religion, not just the reasons for religion being wr
    ong.

    I'm almost afraid to ask but what about my early messages.....remember I was new
     to tis game.....gee...be a little kind...ugh...

    No, your messages were very interesting.  Your writing style was not polished, b
    ut you had a lot to say.  You were the first radical I was exposed to, and had a
     big effect also.  To this day I don't agree with everything you say, but I defi
    nitely have an idea where you were coming from.  My early messages, too, were un
    polished and I didn't even know what I believed at that point.

    I was an angry (& stoned) person who had a whole hell of a lot to say and I look
    ed forward to saying it....yup.

    I had better go get the pie before it burns.  Here comes data.

    Read

    Give me a kiss

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 171
    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: Zak...
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 14:50:17

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      You've just signed your own death warrant.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 172
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: Referee
    Subject: Kissing
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 18:28:36

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

            Wait a min...there will be NO kissing on this board!!!!
    Go to a LOVE SIG for that....    Oh...we don't have a LOVe SIG...sniff

    *=* Cliff *=*

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 173
    Author: $ CHRIS POTTE
    Category: Zap!
    Subject: The drooling JOKE.
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 19:58:50

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

       On further review, I have found that the drooling episode WAS truly
    a joke.  I mean, who would be drooling over Michelle?

       'Cource, maybe Michelle's the COMPLEAT joke.

                                                        The Twilight Zone lives.

                                                   [-- Chris

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 174
    Author: $ CHRIS POTTER
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: A Statement
    Date: 09/21/85  Time: 20:01:31

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

       When I get to be a GOOD battle zoner, I want
    to be just like Mike Carter.   He gets an A+ from me.
    Haven't seen anything that much thought go into one
    putdown yet.

                         Keep it up, Wiz!

                                              [-- Chris

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 176
    Author: $ DAVE WHITTAKER
    Category: Nuke till it GLOWS
    Subject: MICHELLE RENYOLDS
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 05:36:55

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    MICHELL REMINDES ME OF A FAN.......
    STAND BEHIND IT  AND IT SUX
    STAND IN FRONT OF IT AND IT BLOWS
    STAND BESIDE IT AND IT DOES NOTHING  FOR YOU

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 177
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: Referee
    Subject: WHY?
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 07:42:05

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

            Whats all this heavy assalt on poor little Michelle about?
    She is not attacking you guys nearly to generate all this.  Are you
    trying to frighten her away from the GT?

            By the way.... If all this hate keeps up...I may not attend the
    upcoming GT.  I hate the sight of blood.

    *=* Cliff *=*

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 178
    Author: $ JACK FLASH
    Category: Zap!
    Subject: Zak
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 09:38:24

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I get a "0", huh?  Thanks, bud.  By the way, `zak` is the same sound a
    camel turd makes when it hits the ground from five feet up.  I guess I'll
    just consider the source.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 179
    Author: $ JACK FLASH
    Category: Referee
    Subject: Carter
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 09:48:31

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Is there someone out there with enough dead brain cells that they could,
    perhaps, act as a translator for Mr. Carter.  I must confess that I have
    great difficulty understanding the majority of his posts.  It's not so
    much the missspellings heaped one upon the other, or the sentence frag-
    ments, or even the imaginative meanings he gives to the words he uses;
    no, if this was all I think any of us could figure the posts out.  I DON'T
    THINK EVEN HE KNOWS WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT HALF THE TIME.  It seems like
    he's high on St. Joseph's Baby Aspirin or something.  I don't trust
    anybody who, over the course of his life, has written more than he's read.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 180
    Author: $ JIM SCHRAVEN
    Category: $@&#%$!
    Subject: phrase

    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 11:41:07

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    What Cutaneous Profundity blah blah blah mean???

    The unknowing  AQUALUNG

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 181
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Pow!
    Subject: Jacker's Flesh
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 13:50:36

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    No, actually, "Zak" is the sound
    camel dung makes when it hits
    people by the names of "Jack" SMACK
    in the face! So, butt crack, don't
    turn your back, for when you give
    Zak slack, don't be surprised if a
    big pack of black plaque is your
    next snack...

              Rhythmatically yours,
                  Zak

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 182
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: $@&#%$!
    Subject: Gezzer
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:22:43

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    No matter what the hell happens..i will be at that gt!
    Vickie...sounds like a slutish nerd!
    If she likes you...she must be a slut or fat and ugly!
    Well gezz i will be there!
    I'll always have Cliff there!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 183
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: $@&#%$!
    Subject: Matt
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:24:14

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    First of all...i hope you know there is alot of
    $h!t going around about you..as in..well you shall see!
    And second of all...KISS MY ASS

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 184
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: $@&#%$!
    Subject: Steve
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:24:56

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    You are really an ass..
    First you want to be friends..and now no..well i don't need you!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 185
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: Zak..
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:25:58

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    SMACK!
    SMACK!
    ZAK....GIVE ME MY TONGUE!

    Opps...people on here don't know what that is yet Zakker!
    Call me!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 186
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: You Nerd
    Subject: Dean
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:27:19

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    LEAVE ZAK ALONE!YOU STUPID NERD...FOR HE IS MY FRIEND!
    AND NO...HE IS NO NERD!
    HE'S C-O-O-L!
    HE'S F-I-N-E!
    HE'S MICKEY MOUSE!
    OPPS...NO ZAK..YOU KNOW I LOVE YOU!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 187
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: Declaration of war
    Subject: CHRIS/FRIENDS!
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:28:22

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    LOOK AT YOU!
    IN E.MAIL YOU ARE ALL FRIENDLY AND NOW THAT YOU ARE IN
    'PUBLIC' YOU ACT LIKE AN ASS...WHAT IS IT?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 188
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: Declaration of war
    Subject: DAVE W.
    Date: 09/22/85  Time: 21:29:32

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    OHHH NERD....YOU JUST TOLD US WHAT YOU
    DO ON SATURDAY NIGHT....OHHH KINKEY!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 189
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Nuke till it GLOWS
    Subject: Michelle
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 01:19:48

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I think I found the perfect word
    for Michelle. It's:

            *cyclothymic*

    Look it up. Gee, I hardly expected
    that sort of response from her.
    That might give  us all some sort
    of insight as to what makes her
    tick. Hmmmm...I  talk to her nicely,
    logically, etc  and she hates me
    and calls me names.  But I say 4
    simple words, "Give me a kiss", and
    it's *SLURP* *Smack* and licklick.
    Maybe we should all ask  Michelle
    for a kiss. Whadda ya say, guys?

                     Zak

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 191
    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: Michelle...
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 02:57:31

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Do you do anything beyond kissing?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 192
    Author: $ STEVE MACGREGOR
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: [Comment]
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 10:29:46

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      Looks like the "teen sceen babe" has finally found a friend.  Let's all
    pray that it works out this time!

    -- Pascal   #(@,@)#   MacProgrammer

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 193
    Author: $ ALAN HAMILTON
    Category: Nuke till it GLOWS
    Subject: Cyclothyme
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 12:31:03

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      Yes, I must admit, Michelle is certainly one!

    +-------]Al

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 194
    Author: $ MATT MONTE
    Category: Nuke till it GLOWS
    Subject: Michelle.....
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 16:36:38

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    No thanks Michelle....  I don't really feel like kissing your a$$!!

    If I did, I'd probable get Typhoid, and if not that, I'll get Hepititis!
    And if I don't get Hepititis, I'd get Herpes!  And if not Herpes, I'd get
    Aids!!!!!   Ugh!!!    And if I don't get Aids, you know what comes next....

                                     DEATH!!

    or maybe just a little poop on my tounge!  Ugh!!!!!!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 195
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: Zak,Dean
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 17:24:11

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Zak -] I was being nice...i was just jiving!I love u!
    Dean -] WE SHALL SEE  RE:191

             LOVE YOU ZAKKER!!!!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 196
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: $@&#%$!
    Subject: Steve!
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 17:25:21

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    HE'S ALWAYS BEEN MY FRIEND!!!!
    I HAVE TONS OF FRIENDS!!!!!
    MAN...JUST GO **** OFF!!!!
    GOD..I HATE U!!!

    [ZAK AND DEAN...I LOVE U!]

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 197
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: You Nerd
    Subject: Matt
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 17:26:45

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    You are a ass!
    You wouldn't know what to do if you even *had* a girlfriend.!
    which may i add...you do not!
    ha!ohh some people...

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 198
    Author: $ DOUGLAS STEPHENS
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: Wow!
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 22:44:03

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      I thought I was out of telecommunicating for a short time......Whew!!
      It sure has changed!!!
      Poop, (can I actually type that word?) ([-- Ha!), wow!!

      New again........
      (But slightly improved)
      [**-] Little
             Dougy [-**]

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 199
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Pow!
    Subject: Zak on Flak
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 01:21:09

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Great God of come-back.
    I was on the floor after the plaque...

    In tears..

                                    -Wiz

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 200
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Nuke till it GLOWS
    Subject: The BEAST
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 01:35:01

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Cutaneous Profundity: i.e SKIN BEAUTY.

    BEAST:

    RE: My Fiancee;

    Obviously your referring to your slut-mother who wasn't pregnant when she
    had you, rather quite constipated with complications of dirrehae. After
    consumating her marriage with three winos, four heroin addicts and an
    unwilling transvestite male prostitute, she apparently dropped you with
    the rest of the deafication down the nearest street drain where you have
    grown and thrived in your festering way, ever since. Submitting your
    depraved, canker infested personia on this board is an abomination and
    insult to the grade and intelligence of this board's usership.
    Continued ejaculation of your macabre opinions on this board only solidifies
    our common loathing for the appearance of your rotting corpse, ad nauseum.

                                    -Wiz

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 201
    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: Short times...
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 02:31:59

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    in telecommincation.
      Don't make me remeber how long I've been doing this!
      If I can't handle my short--hahaha--time, poor MacProgrammer's in dire
    trouble.

                                    Dean

    Really, Michelle?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 202
    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Zap!
    Subject: Cyclothyme.
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 02:33:28

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      Just say "manic," please...

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 203
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Zap!
    Subject: Cyclothymia
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 02:38:03

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    It's in there with the best;

    Hebephrenia, Cachexia , Dementia praecox and Involutional Melancholia...

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 204
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Referee
    Subject: Jack's Cracks
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 03:04:25

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Boardering on semi-literate with a flash of delerium.
    Perhaps I should paraphrase [] for Spastics and certifiably brain-dammaged
    idiots who, depraved in their larval stages, failed to vacation from
    'Scooby Doo' and Gilligan's Island and got stuck with a marvel comic
    vocabulary....

                                    -Wiz

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 205
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Declaration of war
    Subject: hey!
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 06:12:06

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Gilligan's island is COOL!
    hahahahahaha

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 206
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: You Nerd
    Subject: Gilligan?
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 07:29:07

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

            Gilligan and the Skipper are NERDS!!!!  Now Mary Ann is COOL!
    and maybe even Ginger......  The professor sucks...  Mr Howl is ok however.

    *=* The SYSOP *=*

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 207
    Author: $ STEVE MACGREGOR
    Category: You Nerd
    Subject: Gilligan?
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 08:51:31

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      Gee...I always liked the professor.  Probably because he reminds me of
    myself.  And Mary Ann is DEFINITELY cool, but Ginger...

    -- Pascal   #(@,@)#   MacProgrammer

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 208
    Author: $ STEVE MACGREGOR
    Category: $@&#%$!
    Subject: Friends?
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 08:53:47

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      I wonder how long "always" is going to last.

    -- Pascal   #(@,@)#   MacProgrammer

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 209
    Author: $ ALAN HAMILTON
    Category: Pow!
    Subject: Scooby Doo
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 10:38:21

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

       Hey!  That's a cool show!

    "If it hadn't been for you *kids*, I could'a gotten away with it!"

    +------]Al

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 210
    Author: $ DAVID BURKHART
    Category: Referee
    Subject: Calls
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 14:13:45

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Zak is far ahead of the pack on this board, and doing great.
    Matt, on the other hand, gets disqualified for using the nerdish word
    "poop" and for being incoherent and mindless.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 211
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: You Nerd
    Subject: GEZZER
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 15:23:22

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I heard from someone...[no names] that Vickie is very nice and
    pretty and that 1 person doesn't know what the hell she's doing with u!
    HAHAHHAHAHAHHA
    I'm not the only one who hates you...ass!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 212
    Author: $ MICHELLE REYNOLDS
    Category: Make love not war
    Subject: Cliff

    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 15:25:12

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    ALRIGHT CLIFF!
    NERDS...I AM GLAD MY DEAR FRIEND WHO CARES FOR ME VERY MUCH FINALLY CAN
    MAKE A SIMILIARITY FROM GILLIAN AND MIKE CARTER!
    A HAND FOR MY MAN!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 213
    Author: $ CHARLES LEE
    Category: Pow!
    Subject: Michelle
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 16:07:16

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Where do you get off calling someone a slut (Vickie) that you've never
    met.  I've got a sister that's 15, and, an under-achiever in school, but
    she has never been known to stoop soooo lowww as to say shit like that
    about anyone she doesn't know.  As far as Mike goes, I think his only
    mistake is lowering himself to your obviously inferior juvenile mentality
    level.  You know the old saying, Ignore something and it'll go away
    although, I don't know if that applys to a virus like yourself, which has
    managed to contaminate a large number of bbs's in recent weeks.  I think
    that about sums you up...

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 214
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Referee
    Subject: Sniff...I confess
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 17:08:25

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I was over at Matt's house when he made his "poopy" post.  And, I thought
    of that one.
    It sounded appropriate at the time.
    (having to do with the rest of his message.)

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 215
    Author: $ ZAK WOODRUFF
    Category: Pow!
    Subject: Then it's YOUR fault
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 19:14:15

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    The word "poop" just doesn't cut it
    on a board like this. I'm sorry
    Robert, but you are disqualified,
    and so is Matt, as he was an
    accessory. "Pack of guano" would
    have been more appropriate, write it
    down and commit it to memory.

       On Michelle, lately, she has put
    me in a very strange position. BY
    being nice to me, I would not feel
    right cutting her down, but I don't
    want to look like I've sold out to
    the rest of you guys. Should I stick
    up for her, or should I leave it be?
    I choose the latter, as I will try to
    just observe from now on. Michelle
    has her faults, but don't we all?
    I think when she called Vicky a slut
    she only meant to tick off Wiz.
    Looking back, I see he called Michy
    a slut in a message concerning
    Vicky, so it wasn't exactly un-called
    for. I heard Vicky was a very sweet person, too. Bring her to the GT, Wiz!
    David:  Thank you. I appreciate it.

    Ground Zero Bulletin Board command ([H] for help):

    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Energy...
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 02:47:42

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

       That was attempted around 1840. A group of (so-called) scientists got
    together and created their own political party, with their major promise
    being to convert the country over to a monetary system based on the erg.

       Needless to say, we still buy things with dollars. If you want to have
    a monetary system that provides an unlimited supply of money, just pick
    any system that isn't backed by gold, silver, or other material. Many
    examples exist of systems like this -- and the result is always runaway
    inflation. For an economy to be well managed, it must have finite financial
    resources. Infinite resources can never be controlled.

                                    Dean

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31473
    Author: $ PAUL SAVAGE
    Category: Question?
    Subject: Robert Simpson
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 05:45:07

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I too would like to see a scriptural reference prohibiting promises.
    That's a new one on me, and I thought I was reasonably familiar with the
    Bible.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31474
    Author: BOB JILES
    Category: Tales & Tall Stories
    Subject: The Robin
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 06:07:46

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    The Robin (turdus migratorius)

    Introduction aux lieux d'aisance

    Disquietude, in the luxurious period after food, marks the
    original thought of the day.  Experienced, one sits expectantly
    and awaits further reformings in alphabets until recently
    drowned.  The spirit begins to move, giving rise to preliminary
    surface disturbances, its work producing uranic ripples tracing
    what further destinations!  Which in the event soon follow:
    plump raniform proofs.  What remains behind is committed to
    paper and checked.

    Then there is no further probation; it's all sent out with a rush.

    C.C. "Chuck" Festoon

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31475
    Author: $ DAWN DREWRY
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: TARA
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 06:51:35

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    HOWDY, TARA!
    WELCOME!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31476
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: The SYSOP Speaks
    Subject: upcoming GT
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 08:32:36

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

            I want as many users as possable to show up for the BIG OCTOBER 13th
    GT that can possably make it.   So far, several of the GIRLS said they would
    come.   All BBS users are invited.... be there or be de-validated...(just
    kidding...sort of)  We have not had a BIG GT in a while.... we have a chance
    now to "DO IT!"

            The GT is at Peter Piper Pizza (Metro) on Oct 13th @ 1:00pm.
    I will be at the NEW Gemini Store (1512 West Bell Rd) @12:00 noon to meet
    anyone that wishes to join up with us at that location first.

            You users that use other systems...please POST about this GT where
    ever you and your modem travel.... all BBS's are WELCOME!!!!!

    *=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SYSOP *=*

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31477
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: Vote
    Subject: Oct 8th S/Election
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 09:08:47

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

            On October 8th there is going to be a special election.
    Known as the "Maricopa County Transportation Excise Tax Resolution"
    The bottom line is to raise the sales tax another 1/2 percent.
    And it all suppose to be used for the new "Regional Transportation Plan"
    This TAX is only suppose to last ...20 years...hahahahaha, has any one ever
    heard of them removing a tax...  As in the TEMPORARY one cent they added to
    the 5 cent sales tax 2 years ago?  I am still paying the 6 percent, even
    after they had sworn it was only going to be for a short time.

            Well, how do you feel about the new proposed addition of the 233.5
    miles of freeway?  Is it worth it?  Will it do us any good... or will it
    be like so many other highway programs in this state and end up in court
    for 20 years as to the exact route...because of indian burial grounds etc?

            Personaly... this state is a FARCE!

    *=* SYSOP Cliff *=*

    P.S. How do you Vote?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31478
    Author: $ ALAN HAMILTON
    Category: Vote
    Subject: Why not...
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 12:26:51

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    ... put up the issue as a [V]ote, Cliff?

      My views:  Sure, I don't like more taxes, but I like sitting in traffic
    even less.  The proposed freeway system may not solve all our problems, but
    alternative, inaction, would be deadly.

    +------]Al

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31479
    Author: $ ALAN HAMILTON
    Category: Question?
    Subject: Roddy
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 12:32:25

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      Somehow, you seem to expect everything to be given to you, free of charge.

    +-------]Al

    The capitalistic pig -- OINK!

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31480
    Author: $ ALAN HAMILTON
    Category: Politics
    Subject: Power of Money
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 12:37:18

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      Somehow, I can't see myself walking into Smitty's and pulling out a few
    dozen kilowatt-hours out of my wallet to buy my groceries.

      Okay, so we use some sort of certificate or token to *represent* the
    energy.  That still won't work, for the same reason that using leaves or sea
    shells for money won't work: it's too plentiful.  Too large a money supply
    brings on ramapent inflation.  You might as well just print unlimited
    numbers of dollar bills, and save the trouble of changing the monetary
    system.

    +-------]Al

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31481
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: traffic problems
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 12:50:37

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    The freeway is choked up at two times during the day.  At night,
    it's practically empty.  If everyone didn't work 9-5, and we had
    overlapping shifts throughout the entire 24 hours of the day, there
    would be no such thing as rush hour.

      I'm against the .5% sales tax increase.  First of all, how am I
    supposed to calculate 6.5% sales tax in my head?  Second, they
    never got rid of the so-called temporary 1% increase.  Why not use
    the revenue from that, since it isn't even supposed to be there now?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31482
    Author: ERIC HOLLOWAY
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Michelle/Tara/Others
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 13:23:02

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Michelle, I'm not going to welcome that sister of yours if she keeps telling
    jokes like that last one...here's one that'll make people think:

    Why did the fatalist cross the road?

    Why not?

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31483
    Author: $ DAVID BURKHART
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Zak
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 14:08:16

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I agree.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31484
    Author: $ CHARLES LEE
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Zak
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 14:49:26

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    If I'm not mistaken, the United States hasn't been on the gold standard
    for years and years...  I believe we left the Gold standard, went to gold
    and silver, then dropped both.  If what I'm saying is true, the only reason
    a dollar is worth a dollar is because it says so...  And I'm almost positive
    that I'm not mistaken.

    As far as the .5% tax increase, What Jim Lippard said is true... The raise
    to 6% was only supposed to be temporary.  So much for that, those damn
    politicians are sly though.  They inact something as temporary, then wait
    until everyone forgets (except for a couple of people on Apollo BBS), the
    n have the gaul to ask for more. Hey, wait a minute, am I just Imagining
    this, or wasn't all the money the state rakes in from the lottery supposed
    to go towards the same thing this new tax is supposed to do?!?!?!?  Also,
    since the lottery was started, I've seen more and more roads torn up and
    re surfaced, the only problem is, they're no better than they were in the
    first place!!!!

    I've got an Idea? How about a .5% increse in taxes to go towards giving all
    the car owners in Phoenix (and where ever else they use the stuff) a new
    paint job because of this half assed attempt at making the roads better,
    affectionatly called "Chip Sealing"?  And, what if any of that money that
    was left over could go to a fund for re-allignment of your car, and new
    shock absorbers, which both get screwed up when you hit these pot-holes and
    so called "street repairs" ha ha ha. You're right about this state Cliff!!!

    Message: 31486
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: gold standard

    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 18:05:39

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Quite right, the gold standard has been out for some time.
    There were silver certificates issued for a little while, but no more.
    The dollar only has value because the USG insists that everyone accept
    it.  (BTW, have you ever seen a business with a sign that says "no bills
    over $20"?  They *have* to accept bills over $20 unless they can't make
    change.)

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31487
    Author: $ DOUGLAS STEPHENS
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Foot 'L'
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 19:52:16

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      That's right folks!! I am the proud Father (& Mother) of a foot tall
     blue L...(It's stands for Little).  For some reason, though I haven't
     figured it out yet, Cliff (The MIGHTY Apollo Sysop) could not get a letter
     'D' out of Apollo Computer Inc.  (FOR 'L'ittle 'D'ougy)

         Oh! well,  life goes on!!!

         Nice to be back all!!  Hope to be talking to alot of you soon!!

      [**-] Little
             Dougy [-**]

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31488
    Author: $ DOUGLAS STEPHENS
    Category: Question?
    Subject: Dr. Who
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 19:54:16

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

      Did anyone happen to Video tape Dr. Who last night???
      (Sunday 9/22)....I forgot to set my tape machine, and
     naturally, It did not get taped!!
       Please, someone.....
       Thanks...

      This message is brought to you by your local TV newstation...

      [**-] Little
             Dougy [-**]

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31489
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Various
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 22:16:03

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    ALAN HAMILTON:  You do not understand.  Try screwing your head on one more
    turn.

    Charles Lee.....yes you are correct....in fact counterfeit money is  backed
    by the same stuff as Govt. money.  Aster may have a good idea at that.

    JIM LIPPARD:  I agree 100% (with apologies to Joel Genesis) with your
    'shift idea'.  In fact Phoenix in the summer would be a good time to
    start some workers at 4:30 a.m. so they could be home by 12:30.  After
    all at that time it is light and equilevant to 8:am back east.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31490
    Author: ROD WILLIAMS
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Zak
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 22:19:20

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Zak, I don't know if you watch Tv or not but in the past several months
    there have been QUITE a number of real estate seminars shown on many of
    the channels and given by many different 'experts'.  There have been so
    many on cable that I have contemplated cancelling the service.   Now,
    most of these millionaire experts look like your standard evangelist
    minister, some with curly white hair.  They basically tell the people
    how to make a killing by purchasing 'forclosures'.  They explain how you
    can 'get rich' and harvest tenents of your very own.  They even have
    raduate seminar students give testimonials on how they made their
    killings.  Unreal.  They neglect to point out the hardships involved
    and just show large monetary figures that can be made.  I suspect that
    the real estate sales in this system is so hurting that they are
    putting on these shows in order to get suckers to take over the
    'forclosers' and get them off the banks hands.  In order for the average
    Joe to 'own' (haha) their home nowadays it takes both a mother and
    father working to make the payments.  Can you believe that?  When you
    consider that EVERY lifeform has a right to a piece of this earth just
    as much as anyone, but NO, it is rented, taxed, or mortaged and usually
    it is substandard housing thats provided.  If ALL people had a free
    place to dwell crime would go down at least 95% overnight.  I believe
    it. (cause the book says it, eh?)

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31491
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: the vote
    Date: 09/23/85  Time: 23:40:48

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    OK, you people voting for the tax (and maybe some freeways will
    actually get built someday), why did you vote that way?  I've only
    seen arguments against here on the board, let's see some arguments
    for.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31492
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Money
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 00:48:25

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Ultimately, when you boil all the horsemanuer an frontal facades of pride
    and ego, legal talk and lawyerisms, mortgages and checking accounts it all
    boils down to one simple fact:
    The economy reflects how much we value ourselves.

    And you said you couldn't be 'bought'...

                                    -Wiz

    Message: 31493
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Roddy
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 01:00:22

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    No, me thinks Alan Hamilton hit the spot with his observation;
    Your eventual summary of 'filthy greedy rich slum lord et al' boils down
    to "I WANT IT FREE".

    To Hamshack with you kiddo. If you think for one moment that'll work you're
    sadly mistaken. You have grossly overlooked an important factor, apparently
    all yer life; Humans are naturally un-cooperative and extreemly greedy.
    That's what separates us from God. We're UN-Godly. And never will be unless
    you get with it and accept his forgivenss and grace. Without that, you're
    subject to the afterformentioned problems in the millionth degree. Being
    a Christian doesn't separate you from all this, but it provides a cure.
    An antidote. Without it, greed hatred and despise flower and grow spreading
    roots wherever,whomever or whatever you come in contact with.
    One of the benefits of being Christian is clear sight. Through all the
    grime and filth of wants, despise and lust for material goods/posessions,
    you can see the outcome, the start, the end. Unfortunately, being human
    tends to interfere and Christians (like me too) take only as much of this
    'antidote' as they feel THEY need.

    But I know, you've been there, right?
    Enjoy your misery and wants too much that you gave up clear sight and went
    back to all this?

    Typical.

                                    -Wiz

    Message: 31494
    Author: $ MIKE CARTER
    Category: In search of
    Subject: Hardware Nuts!
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 01:11:56

    Ok you silent wire-wrapping, chip-smashing, L.E.D - lusting hardware
    jolts. Speak up! Cliff's deciding wether or not to put up a SIG:
    That's Special Interest Groupies board just for deliberating such enjoyable
    pastimes as discussing ways to create the perfect computer and open answers
    to your hardware/interfacing problems.

    Just imagine [NER]dhaven, the utopia for engineering students and the like
    to hash out problems with alike kin. The language we speak makes this
    funky electronic world spin and all der lights blinken. Get out of that
    closet and VOICE yer nympholeptic craving for a large closet where we can
    all mumble such things as Anti-terrorsit countermeasure devices for home
    burgular systems in your neighbourhood, Proximity triggered claymore charges
    for car-park door bangers, Electrolysis methods for embalming your first
    floppy program disk, how to create massive blackouts with experimentation
    with 'railguns' and what to do when you send your living room into orbit
    with afterforementioned device.

    Com'on.....

    A Mad Phd Scientists board for us!

                                    -Wiz

    Message: 31495
    Author: $ DEAN MCCARRON
    Category: Question?
    Subject: GT

    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 02:18:21

      How about a well-planned, organized December GT this year? I recall one
    of the best GT's was the one at Frank Lopinto's old place... This was about
    two or three years ago, but still.

      Another quite successful GT was the Kielsky GT. It managed to have a
    multi-BBS draw to it, as well. (I think we can live without CommuniTree's
    sysop, thank you... (no offense if you're out there...) )

      Avoid holding it at a resturant or business. A home is ideal, as long as
    the owner doesn't mind a little mess.

      Well, anyone agree?

                                            Dean
    Message: 31496
    Author: $ NICK IANUZZI
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Dean on GT
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 04:27:52

    Yeah, I agree with Dean. I really enjoyed the GT at Savage's house. I
    think he should do it again. How about it, Paulsy?

    Message: 31497
    Author: $ PAUL SAVAGE
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Nicksy

    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 05:15:29

     I'd love it, but the lady I chose to spend the rest of my life with would
    get more than a little upset, methinks. The idea's great, but we'll have to
    come up with a different location.

     I'm basically in agreement with Dean and Nick though. The best GTs by far
    have been home GTs. Less formal, and everybody seems to be looser.
    Any volunteers?

    Message: 31498
    Author: $ ROBERT SIMPSON
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: GT stuff
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 06:34:34

    Get the press!  if it works out great, lets make it annual!

    Message: 31499
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: The SYSOP Speaks
    Subject: Sports/Hardware SIG?
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 07:39:40

            Ok...you guys seen to be soooooooo LAZY that soon I will post a
    [V]ote as to your interests on a [SPO]rts SIG and a [EGG]head SIG (hardware)
    Or....maybe you just do not want another SIG/s ?????

            As soon as the current [V]ote is over...  so think! (if you can)

    *=* SYSOP Cliff *=*

    Message: 31500
    Author: $ APOLLO SYSOP
    Category: Politics
    Subject: Proposition 300
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 07:59:19

            Do you people reallize the added .5% tax is not only on that
    computer magazine you buy....but on EVERYTHING nearly.  As in ELECTRICITY
    that is going to sky rocket....and now it will even jump faster since a
    .5% tax increase adds to it.  Then there is the Phone bill, Mining (oil &
    gas), Amusement places, Interstate transportation, and much more that adds
    to cost of goods plus that the end user pays for plus the added TAX.
    Not soooo bad if we really got the added freeways....but how much will
    be deverted to other projects?  Do you really think you will live long
    enough to see the super highways built? (if ever)  What about that TEMPORARY
    1% they added a few years back....  Have they lived up to that promise to
    remove it.....NO, they sure have not...  It quietly became permanent!!!
    Tax and re-Tax is all that they want to do...  they will of course all get
    raises....and find yet another reason to raise the Taxes for HIGHWAYS...
    Gas Taxes, Lottery, Sales Taxes...and still not enough!!!  When are you
    guys going to WAKE up!  Why does it cost $22 million to build ONE MILE of
    freeway.....  Because they say so!?

    *=* the Apollo SYSOP *=*   GT Oct 13th  @ Metro Peter Piper [-- be there!

    Message: 31501
    Author: BILLY IDOL
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: MICHELLE
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 08:27:39

    I KIND OF MISS HER AND HER MOROT CYCLE
    STORYS

    ** BILLY ** IDOL **

    Message: 31503
    Author: $ ALAN HAMILTON
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Roddy
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 10:46:16

      Great!  If everybody is entitled to a bit of the earth, I want yours Rod.
    Gee, thanks a lot for it!

    +-------]Al

    Message: 31505
    Author: $ STEVE BASS
    Category: In search of
    Subject: ASU BBS
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 11:48:52

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    IS THERE A BBS AT ASU ? I'VE HEARD THAT THERE IS A COMPUTER THAT CAN BE
    LEGALLY ACCESSED, CAN ANYONE TELL HOW OR WHO TO CONTACT ? *

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31506
    Author: $ TED MALONE
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: [EGG]heads
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 12:42:29

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Humm, not a bad name for us, "wire wrappin' feinds", however, what would
    we do??

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31507
    Author: $ JIM LIPPARD
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Prop. 300
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 13:22:37

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I did a little calculating.  They claim the county needs about 200 miles of
    freeway at $15 million per mile.  This comes to $3 billion.  However, the
    .5% sales tax increase is expected to bring in an additional $5.5 billion in
    revenue--that's $2.5 billion extra! In addition, this means the "temporary"
    1% sales tax nets the gumint $11 billion over the same time period.  And we
    already have one of the highest gas taxes in the country supposedly paying
    for roads.  I think Prop. 300 is a fraud.

    [A]bort or [C]ontinue:Continue

    Message: 31508
    Author: $ DAVID BURKHART
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Alan
    Date: 09/24/85  Time: 14:04:53

    [A]bort, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    Alan, you misjudge Rod. If you had no where to live, Rod would share his
    peace of land with you. He did it with JT, and Joel, and others. He let
    a homeless person sleep in the shelter of his porch (it is surrounded by
    trees and bushes and is very nice.)

    People like Rod are perfecHowever, my vote was uneducaLEAVE. We cawe become an
    ov!!

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