### Apollo BBS Archive - July 7, 1991

    Main Menu command:P

    *=* Post Office entered *=*
    Mail from Apollo SysOp
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 17:18:13

    I could use another Van...... Hmmmmmm

    Enter a line containing only an <*> to stop
     1:My 225 slant six can do 0 to 60 in a flat 95 seconds.  So there.  I
     2:installed dual everythings on it.  But the big secret is the 15 and a half
     3:pound radiator cap.  Rod

    Mail from Melissa Dee
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 19:33:11

    Hey, we already stopped by the place this evening, round 5pm.  Looks neat!
    In fact, I remember it from the Art Detours of this and last year.  It's got
    a real nice feel to it.  Probably because it's purple.
    I didn't see any "Life's a Bitch and so am I" buttons, thou...

    Enter a line containing only an <*> to stop
     1:You will see those buttons.  They will be there before the official Grand
     2:opening at the end of the month.  I spent this weekend clearing out a room
     3:for the screening equipment.            Me

    Mail from Apollo SysOp
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 07:08:28

    Does it have 'dual mirrors'?   If so, you have to give me a handi-cap as my
    Cuda has only a single mirror!

    *=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SysOp *=*  <-clif-
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue, [I]nsty-reply or [Z]ap:Insty-reply

    Enter a line containing only an [*] to stop
     1:Yeah, it has dualies plus the one on the windshield.  And I waxed them after
     2:determining in a wind tunnel test that waxed mirror backs allow the air to
     3:pass over faster.  I figure that I've added .00000000000000001 seconds to my
     4:time.  Plus, when I race I try to fart as much as possible.  I always eat a
     5:big bowl of beans beforehand.
     6:end

    Edit command:S

    Saving message...

    As for the message to which you replied...
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue or [Z]ap:Zap

    Mail from Melissa Dee
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 10:01:57

    [A]bort, [N]ew only, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I was only joshing ya.  Peter said something about printing up more t-shirts
    and stuff.  If I get my act together today, I will be able to bring over a
    bunch of stories and poem books, all nicely packaged for reader
    entertainment.
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue, [I]nsty-reply or [Z]ap:Insty-reply

    Enter a line containing only an [*] to stop
     1:We could make a booth in the back of the store, complete with hand towels,
     2:for people to read some of your material.  See ya.
     3:end

    Edit command:S

    Saving message...

    As for the message to which you replied...
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue or [Z]ap:Zap

    Mail from Roger Mann
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 12:35:18

    [A]bort, [N]ew only, [R]ead or [S]kip:Read

    I like the idea of a GT. It's time for one. I live at 82nd Street and Shea.
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue, [I]nsty-reply or [Z]ap:Insty-reply

    Enter a line containing only an [*] to stop
     1:Okay, let's get together for an LSD GT.  Sound good?  Or how about a pot GT?
     2: I'll bring all my pots.
     3:
     4:I work as a locksmith, mostly automotive.  I've been doing that trip for the
     5:past 15 years.  I am also an economic slave.
     6:
     7:end

    Edit command:S

    Saving message...

    As for the message to which you replied...
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue or [Z]ap:Zap

    Post Office command:

    Enter [H] for a list of commands

    Post Office command:S

    To send mail to operator use [SYSOP]
    First name:NICK
    Last name:IANUZZI
    Send mail to Nick Ianuzzi:Yes

    Enter a line containing only an [*] to stop
     1:This is from Cecelia, the Greatest!
     2:I have returned! I am back from a long sojourn in California!
     3:Hey Baby, what's happening?
     4:I understand that you have invited Christian and myself to an art gallery to
     5:see an exhibition by a friend of yours. I accept! When are you planning to
     6:go? If you should happen to want to check this situation out tonight 7/8,
     7:call either Christian or myself. My number is 264-4368. Hope to hear from
     8:you soon. Later,  Cecelia Norris.
     9:end

    Edit command:S

    Saving message...

    Mail from Apollo SysOp
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 16:54:59

    Farting is CHEATING!
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue, [I]nsty-reply or [Z]ap:Insty-reply

    Enter a line containing only an [*] to stop
     1:Cheating is cheating.  You would be cheating if you took me up on the race
     2:because you know that a 225, pulling a lot of weight has very little power.
     3:
     4:I'll even turn on my air conditioner at the starting line.  I'll even pull
     5:one spark plug wire.
     6:
     7:Interesting board.
    Mail from Roger Mann
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 21:54:36

    I'm an economic slave also. I have read many get-rich-quick books. My
    favorite author for a while was Joseph Granville.
    [A]bort, [C]ontinue, [I]nsty-reply or [Z]ap:Insty-reply

    Enter a line containing only an [*] to stop
     1:I've not heard of Granville.  I'm trying to find a way to survive without
     2:taking the sweat of others.  At present I am reading Marx for Beginners.
     3:
     4:                                Rod

    Post Office command:JN

    Late Night Bulletin Board command:

    Message: 2053
    Author: $ Bill Burkett
    Category: Growl.
    Subject: More Bootlegging
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 07:35:17

    > What I think I am trying to say here is that some people stuff
    > is not meant to be copyrighted, even by the Author.

            Then it shouldn't (wouldn't) have been offered for sale in the first
    place.
            Rationalize it as you like, Rod (and Daryl).  It's stealing plain
    and simple.

    This is my last comment on the subject here; I just realized we're in the
    e Night SIG and I really shouldn't be commenting here this time of day.

    Message: 2054
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Bootlegging
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 00:51:31

    I'm not involved in bootlegging.

    *=* Journey to a SIG *=*

    *=* $tatus Club Bulletin Board entered *=*

    $tatus Club Bulletin Board command:$C

    Press [A] to abort

    Message: 7502
    Author: $ Dave Bolman
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Bees of Death
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 18:01:38

    I agree, that it seems like I have been hearing tales of stormtrooper bees
    invading Texas since the late 1970's.  I guess this time they really mean
    it.  I have read the latest articles, and I think this is the first time
    someone in this country (or least Texas) has been killed by them.  If only
    John Belushi were still with us...

    Message: 7503
    Author: $ Dave Bolman
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Marijuana
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 18:15:09

    Agreed!
    In the case of marijuana, the inconsistancy of laws which make it illegal
    yet allow alcohol and cigarettes ( both of which are documented as having
    far more adverse effects on the human system than pot ) are more annoying
    when you consider how many additional and useful products (rope, fabric
    medicine etc.) can be produced from the hemp plant.  I noticed this when I
    was in Europe last year and was impressed by their more intelligent approach
    to the marijuana plant.

    Message: 7504
    Author: $ Dave Bolman
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Dangers of Pot Smoke
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 18:18:45

    I am not certain about this, but my understanding is that since the
    marijuana plant doen't contain tar or nicotine in high proportions, its
    smoke isn't the danger that cigarette smoke is. Can anybody verify..add to
    this..I am a bit curious about this point.

    Message: 7509
    Author: $ Dave Bolman
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Thoreau Babble
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 18:54:38

    I find it more than mildly ironic that most of the people I know who have
    spent years becoming an educated, literate and as a bi-product, urban soul
    now or at some point in their lives sincerely wish to return to the country
    and break free of the cycles of the modern world.  I fall into this catagory
    and am trying to find some way to live outside the urban world. There seems
    to be a lot of fiscal dead ends, and not much in the way of food for the
    soul...ahhh but shouldn't this be on the end of the world sig?

    Message: 7510
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Dave/pot
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 00:44:20

    Smoking pot is less harmful to the human body than eating a cheeseburger.
    At least after one smokes pot they can see damn well in the dark.

    As far as Thoreau and living in the country, yes, I would like to do that.

    Message: 7511
    Author: $ Apollo SysOp
    Category: Question?
    Subject: last on hamburger
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 07:09:30

            I want to see documented PROOF!

    Message: 7512
    Author: $ Bill Burkett
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Dave-Compu Training
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 09:25:49

    > if you are interested in computer based training, get in touch
    > with a book publisher (Prentice Hall, Addison Wesley etc.).
    > Almost all major textbooks now come with courseware, and the
    > publisher can often get them to pass on the names of the
    > courseware developers. You might even be able to land some work
    > with them.

    An interesting prospect.  I'll put it down in my list of markets to try when
    I've got a chance.  (Right now two full-time projects have me hopping.)

    Thanks!

    Message: 7513
    Author: $ Bill Burkett
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Multimedia
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 09:26:08

    > Before this goes back to [COM]puter, What kind of video
    > projects do you use the Amiga for?

    I use it for the programs I produce; the ones that are commissioned (makes
    me feel more like an artiste) by organizations and corporations for training
    and information.  Also for the graphics that accompany the seminars I do.

    Although I'm not a graphic designer by any means, I generally develop my own
    full-screen, static graphics such as titles and charts.  I farm animations
    out to colleague who specializes in those sorts of things.

    Message: 7514
    Author: $ Roger Mann
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Dave/Amiga
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 12:43:48

    It has the Motorola 68xxx family of microprocessors which I think is
    superior to ANY Intel micro --- if only considering the 640K mess the MS-DOS
    environment is in. I just got MS-DOS 5.0 and it moves some of the resident
    programs to High Memory, but doesn't have enough memory between 640K and 1M
    to move everything.

    Message: 7515
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Cliff/proof
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 15:13:52

    You will probably never see proof that a cheesburger is more harmful than
    pot, at least as long as the National Cattlemens Association and the Dairy
    Industry has a say.  You'll just have to take my word for it.

    You don't see labels on supermarket foods showing that meat and dairy
    products are in a less healthy class than fruits and beans.  The government
    was prepared to do just that but was stopped by the powerful forces of the
    meat, dairy and poultry industries.   Smoke and eat pot, it's better for
    you.

                                    Rod

    X-Rated Cosmos Bulletin Board command:$C

    Message: 4909
    Author: $ Melissa Dee
    Category: Answer !
    Subject: Last
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 19:46:08

    Well, since I already have gotten great responces from my erotic writing, I
    didn't think I needed to test the market any further!  Actually, since I am
    selling my stories, it seems pretty silly to post them on here for everyone
    for free.  But, I sometimes do.  I have gotten some fairly mean and nasty
    retorts from others, too.  Once bitten, twice shy.

    Message: 4910
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Cosmos-Chatter
    Subject: Melissa/last
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 00:45:31

    Where were you bitten?

    Message: 4911
    Author: $ Bill Burkett
    Category: Up Yours
    Subject: Art & Capitalism
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 09:27:23

    > Actually, since I am selling my stories, it seems pretty silly
    > to post them on here for everyone for free.

    Ah!  A capitalist pig like the rest of us.  For shame!

    Message: 4912
    Author: $ Melissa Dee
    Category: Answer !
    Subject: Hey...
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 10:03:42

    I've got to make a living like everyone else.  Besides most of my stories
    are only a dollar!

    End of the Universe Bulletin Board command:$C

    Message: 1884
    Author: $ Melissa Dee
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 19:55:28

    Welp, you're too late.  I already had the operation and, besides throwing up
    afterward, I've had no problems.
    As far as rubbers go (or foams, jellies, the Pill, et al), if you want
    something bad enough you may have to deal with it.  I will agree with you
    about the Pill.  I have heard (and experienced) many stories of being sick
    once a month, constantly being tired, headaches, weight gain, etc.  But,
    that is better than having an unwanted pregnancy.  Stop the problem before
    it starts, I say.  I don't even debate the abortion issue anymore but go
    start to debating controception.  THAT is the real problem.  Many young
    girls get pregnant and have the child and they aren't ready, emotionally,
    mentally, sometimes even physically, to deliver and care for a baby.  You
    are ruining two lives, not just one.

    Message: 1885
    Author: $ Melissa Dee
    Category: Question?
    Subject: Paul
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 20:00:50

    So, does that mean that your current wife never had sex with anyone before?
    You've obviously had sex with at least two women in your life so already you
    announcement of " since I am involved in a lifetime monogamous relationship"
    doesn't mean you've  only had one lover (I assume).  You both have other
    partner's history to deal with.
    And, I agree with what Nick said.  Many of this people did not get the AIDS
    virus from being permiscuous.

    Message: 1886
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Melissa
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 00:50:05

    I've wanted every child Jasmine had.  I just could not picture myself with
    out them.

    I've probably had sex with several dozen girls in my life.

    Message: 1887
    Author: $ Paul Savage
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Nick/generalizing
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 05:40:40

     The innocents are always to be pitied. Perhaps my statement would be more
    acceptable had I said that people are dying because SOMEBODY refused to act
    in a responsible manner. In the case of those who got the virus in a
    dentist's chair, perhaps it was the dentist, perhaps another of his
    patients, but somewhere along the line blame can be assessed. Saying that
    everybody is innocent is just as generalizing as saying that everyone is
    guilty, isn't it?

    Message: 1888
    Author: $ Paul Savage
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Melissa
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 05:50:50

    Monogamy doesn't equal celibacy Melissa. The factor that is lacking in the
    present sexually transmitted disease epidemic is, in my opinion, commitment.
     If we have two people, totally committed to each other, and of the mindset
    that commitment to a relationship is a primary function, are those two
    people not far better off and far safer, physically, emotionally and
    spiritually,than, say, two people who have been indiscriminate in their
    sexual practices? I spent 40 wonderful years totally committed to my first
    wife until the day she was killed. I now share a similiar commitment to my
    present wife, as she does to me. I also know that her commitment to her
    former husband was total as well.
     As long as we're getting so personal, can you breathe easily with that same
    assurance and confidence? I have seen posts by you that attest to your
    preference for multiple partners, etc. Considering all the hazards inherent
    in such practices, I would think that you would have much more cause for
    concern than do I.

    Message: 1889
    Author: $ Melissa Dee
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Preferences
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 10:23:10

    Oh really?  When did I ever say that? I always intend for my romantic
    relationships to be  lifetime monogamous ones before I commit myself to
    having unprotected intercourse  with anyone. The stories I write are
    fiction. You may be confusing that with my real sexual history. There is
    little I can do about my father's sexual history and if it will effect me.
    So far, I haven't heard that he's HIV+.
    I applaude your relationships with both your wives and I am sure they are
    very loving indeed.  I was only trying to point out that you cannot say
    you've only been with ONE person in a monogamous relationship and that the
    person you are with now has probably been with someone else (I am assuming
    she was previously married).  You both are probably free of any problems
    because of that but it's hypocritical to say that just because you are in a
    monogamous relationship NOW, that your/her past sexual history won't effect
    you.

    I agree with you about commitment missing in todays relationships and that,
    too, saddens me.  In many of my stories, I try to stress love, commitment
    and caring and show that making love is a very beautiful thing and should be
    done in a caring way.  Young people today seem to think that sex is only
    exciting if it's "wrong" somehow.  Sex between a commited couple, be it
    homosexual or hetersexual (and I know you disagree with me on that one), can
    be even more fulfilling as time goes on.

    Message: 1890
    Author: $ Gordon Little
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Rod/surgery
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 15:33:53

      RW>Stay the fuck away from getting yourself cut up for many reasons.

    There's something in this.  A friend of ours who lived in LA for a time, and
    knows people in the entertainment industry, mentioned the existence of a
    support group for people in those circles who suffer from "Epstein-Barr
    syndrome".  I'm not sure if we even know for certain whether there is an
    "Epstein-Barr virus" or not, but the more interesting question is why people
    in the entertainment industry particularly should suffer from it so much.
    One suggested explanation is that so many of them have had cosmetic surgery
    -- several times -- and the repeated surgical invasions have somehow damaged
    their immune systems.

    Message: 1891
    Author: $ Roger Mann
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Gordon/e.b.s.
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 22:01:41

    That's the funniest thing I have heard all day. Did you make that up ?

    Message: 1892
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: E.B.S.
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 22:26:30

    It is probably passed through casting couches

    Message: 1893
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: last three
    Date: 07/08/91  Time: 01:10:20

    Hmmmmmmmmmm.

    Public Bulletin Board command:$C

    Message: 76401
    Author: $ Gordon Little
    Category: Question?
    Subject: Roger
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 14:26:10

    Yes, what *is* BBB?  All I can think of is Better Business Bureau.

    Message: 76402
    Author: $ Gordon Little
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Paul
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 14:26:36

    Wordy?  I guess I have been worse.  I suppose it's the difference between
    stating a conclusion and trying to expose some of the thinking that led to
    it.  Glad you enjoyed it, anyway.

    Message: 76403
    Author: $ Gordon Little
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Ann/AIDS
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 14:27:39

    Why are all these people wearing gloves?  It's a matter of elementary
    probabilities.  Pick a card at random from a deck.  What's the chance that
    it's the queen of spades?  1 in 52.  Now pick two cards at random from two
    decks.  What's the chance they're *both* the queen of spades?  Multiply the
    probabilities together -- it's 1 in 2704.  Pretty remote.

    But if you pick a card from the first deck and it does turn out to be the
    queen of spades, what's the chance *now* that you're going to end up with
    two of them?  The first event is already a certainty because you know the
    outcome, so taking into account what you already know, the chance is 1 in 52
    -- which is a lot more likely than 1 in 2704.

    Catching AIDS is like this.  It requires the combination of two improbable
    events: one, that the AIDS patient is secreting blood while he's around you
    -- or other body fluids such as semen (saliva gives a much lower
    probability, if any); and two, that the fluid happens to get into an open
    cut or otherwise finds its way into your bloodstream.  Even then, there's
    evidence that infection from a single contact may not be a certainty.

    So just "being around" people with AIDS gives a very tiny probability of
    infection.  However, if you're a doctor or a nurse, you know that one of the
    two events is a certainty, because you're there to deal with blood and other
    body fluids from the patient.  That makes the probability much higher.

    In the case of those police, they were anticipating a possible riot in which
    people might get hurt and start bleeding.  Blood from the AIDS sufferers,
    plus a cop or two with an open cut resulting from a scuffle -- physical
    contact -- all of a sudden the probability goes up.  But practice bears out
    the very low probability of infection.  There's no known case of anybody
    catching AIDS from going to school with an AIDS patient, or even living with
    one.  Sharing razors is a bad idea, though.

    Why did the two dentists' actions invite disapproval?  From other dentists'
    point of view, they might seem to be casting aspersions on the professional
    honesty and health of other dentists.  By publicly saying "see, I'M not
    infected!" they could be implying that other dentists might be infected, or
    might be hiding it.  I can see why dentists would object.

    Why did their trade drop off?  They seemed to be setting a precedent; and
    knowing the political climate of San Francisco, lots of people there don't
    want "the specter of mandatory AIDS testing to rear its head," in the
    journalistic phrase.

    But I think there's a bit of psychology at work also.  It reminds me of a
    truck stop and lodgings on what used to be a major highway near where I
    lived in England.  There was a huge sign outside saying "GOOD CLEAN BEDS".
    Some people might see this as reassuring.  But if I were intending to stay
    somewhere overnight, I wouldn't even think about the beds being clean.

    I would *expect* the beds to be clean.  If somebody suggested the
    possibility that in other circumstances the beds might *not* have been
    clean, I'd wonder why.  Did they have to go to a special effort to clean the
    beds?  Perhaps the beds *used* to be dirty until lots of people complained.
    If so, what else might still be dirty?  More to the point, what sort of
    people are running this place that they could even *think* about beds being
    dirty?  I think I'll go on down the road and try someplace else.

    So why did these two dentists need to have AIDS tests in the first place?
    Are they gay?  Well, (harrumph), even if you've nothing against gay people,
    and even if some of your best friends are gay, maybe you'd better try
    another dentist.  "Nothing personal, you understand..."

    It was suggested that even the Florida dentist who infected patients must
    have been lax in his professional hygiene to do so.

    Funny, I saw an article a few years back about increasing attention to
    fingernail care in some well-bred circles, and how a few men were allegedly
    starting to wear clear nail polish so as to appear better groomed.  The
    article especially mentioned some dentists, whose hands need to look clean
    and cared-for if they're going to put them into their patients' mouths.  I
    imagine that practice went out in a hurry among dentists.  My dentist in
    Massachusetts starting wearing rubber gloves several years ago.  People
    today might think twice about going to a dentist who wore nail polish!

    Message: 76406
    Author: $ Gordon Little
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 14:30:08

    Ted the trash collector's problem is exactly one of competing realities.
    One reality is that Ted is a worthwhile human being doing a very important
    and necessary job.  The other reality is that too much of society defines
    "worth" in terms of money.  Using this criterion it puts a low value on Ted.

    It's useful to reflect on the reasons some people get more money than
    others.  One is luck.  Two is being connected with some person or group that
    has money.  Three is having some marketable skill or something else that
    commands value because of its relative rarity (supply and demand).  Four is
    developing and deploying particular skills at manipulating other people into
    giving you money.  Not having money does cause hardship in practical terms,
    but the "worth" of a human being cannot be defined solely in terms of luck,
    connections, rarity, or ability to manipulate others to one's own ends.

    Is God bored?  I very much doubt it.  If God thinks anything at all like a
    human being, and if He's watching events in the human sphere, I don't see
    how He can possibly be bored -- now of all times.  The last two centuries
    especially have been a period of rapid and enormous change on the Earth.
    Disappointed He may be at times, and elated at others.  But bored?  Never!

    Message: 76407
    Author: $ Apollo SysOp
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Little on Rog's BBB?
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 17:04:49

    Maybe it's Bee Bee Brain?

    *=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SysOp *=*  <-clif-

    Message: 76408
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: tea
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 20:39:47

    puffy, raw, swollen purulent ...

    My basic service is $10.20 (plus $.50 for touch-tone(TM)) service.  Since
    you live "so far" out, you're probably in a different charge area. I doubt
    that your phone bill will go down.  In fact, you may not even get
    valley-wide calling under the new plan...

    I'm actually looking forward to valley-wide calling. It means I'll be able
    to start using Zephyr again...

    Message: 76409
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Ann/dentists
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 20:51:15

    The Man said that the dentists' ad constituted "false advertising", a
    violation of state law.  Presumably this is because having a negative result
    on an AIDS test doesn't mean you're free of HIV, just that you didn't show
    positive at the time of the test (the amount of the virus could have been
    too small to register, perhaps?(even though I'm sure its cultured) or it
    could have since been contracted).

    As to why their business dropped off, perhaps much of their clientele were
    afraid of passing the virus *to* clean dentists?

    Message: 76410
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Religion
    Subject: BBBs
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 20:58:30

    Bible-bashing Baptists?

    Message: 76411
    Author: $ Apro Poet
    Category: Politics
    Subject: Rod #76399
    Date: 07/06/91  Time: 21:35:24

    Our police state problem is not as minor as one state.  Have
    you noticed that the U.S. media no longer use the term
    "police state"?  Is it too embarrassing?

    Intercepted from Radio Netherlands on 1991.07.07.0348 UTC at
    9590 kHz:

    The United States has the highest prison population,
    proportionally, in the world.  And we haven't stopped marching
    toward our apparent goal yet.  Our prison population
    continues to climb -- at the rate of *13 percent per year*.

    Is it that we, as a nation, are more criminal by nature?
    Or are we just more sadomasochistic than any other country
    on the face of the planet?

    Message: 76412
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Apro/last
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 00:56:46

    Evil empire.

    Message: 76413
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: BBB
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 00:57:21

    Big Bertha's bra.

    Message: 76414
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Gordon/bored
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 01:01:04

    You mentioned in your 1 of 5 messages that if we knew everything then it
    would most probably bore us to tears, loosly quoted.

    Well, if this God guy knows everything then why wouldn't he be bored but we
    would?  That doesn't compute.  Is there some special quality that God has
    that we couldn't?

    Message: 76415
    Author: $ Paul Savage
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Roger Mann
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 05:23:50

     Why do you keep harping on things that I must continually deny exist? As I
    have said before, I have NO righteousness. "Christ in me, the hope of glory"
    is righteous, not I. And I set no standards, lofty or otherwise. He is my
    standard, none other. My only wish is that I could keep myself from falling
    so short of that standard, but then again, I have that much more opportunity
    to avail myself of His grace and mercy.
     Sorry about you, floundering out there in your little sea of self pity with
    noone to look to for a lifesaver.

    Message: 76416
    Author: $ Ann Oudin
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Pauley/last
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 07:33:23

     Re: your ... "Sorry about you, floundering out there in your little sea of
    self pity with none to look to for a lifesaver!""

    I can't believe you said that to Roger and in the very same post included...
    "I have NO rightiousness!"

    Why do you come across as self righteous? Because you are assuming Roger is
    wallowing is self pity - which I certainly do not get the opinion he is
    doing and you are also assuming he's looking for a life saver! What ever
    gave you these ideas? If you don't sound self righteous I don't know who
    does. Geeze! *>>> ANN O. <<<*

    Message: 76417
    Author: $ Bill Burkett
    Category: Politics
    Subject: Rod/Police State
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 09:25:00

    > Arizona is a police state.

    My Webster's New Twentieth Century Unabridged dictionary (Simon & Schuster)
    defines "police state" as "a government that seeks to intimidate and
    suppress political opposition by means of a secret police force."

    Do you accept this definition?  If not, why not?  If so, how, specifically,
    does Arizona fit this definition?

    Message: 76418
    Author: $ Roger Mann
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Gordon/BBB
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 12:45:27

    Bible Believing Boob.

    Message: 76419
    Author: $ Roger Mann
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Paul/Goody
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 12:53:04

    I merely was pointing out that for someone who is so humble, you spend a lot
    of time pointing out how good you are. "I have NO righteousness. 'Christ in
    me, the hope of glory' is righteous, not I." is an excellent example. It is
    boasting Paul. If you really had Christ in you you would spend less time
    talking about it and more time letting your "light shine." I do not
    consider bashing others for their unbelief, denigrating homosexuals, and
    other statement slike "little sea of self pity" (has a nice ring tho) as
    letting your "light shine" So, I see little evidence of Christ in you and a
    lot of Paul (and I don't mean Apostle).

    Message: 76420
    Author: $ Apollo SysOp
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Last...
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 13:44:32

            But, if you don't pat your own back...  Then who will?

    *=* the 'Mighty' Apollo SysOp *=*  <-clif-

    Message: 76421
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Cliff
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 14:04:35

    Re:  I did it for you this time...  (Grump, Grump)

    (Thanks, Thanks)

    Message: 76422
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Sorry, (Sniff)
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 14:08:01

    Re:  I was brought into this rat trap by my unsuspecting parents just as I
    have brought forth offspring.

    Maybe that's why some refer to this life as a "rat race."

    Message: 76423
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Question?
    Subject: Mz. Dee
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 14:13:29

    Re:  Recent Cat Fight

    Hey!  Why are you dragging me into this?

    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: PoLICE state
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 15:24:22

    When grown men and women go around hiding in bushes, dressed like hippies,
    just to find out if you are smoking a plant then yes, I would most
    certainaly say that we live in a police state.

    When they come into your home and take all valuables at finding you have
    smoked a harmless plant (they won't take the whiskey cause it's legal) then
    I don't know what else I would call it.  You got a word for it?  Gestapo,
    perhaps?

    If that police force isn't secret then what would you call it?  Certainaly
    not open.

                                    Rod

    Message: 76425
    Author: $ Apro Poet
    Category: Politics
    Subject: Robber Barons
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 18:49:41

      Undoubtedly, Populists, along with most white Americans,
    had racism and nativism in their thinking.  But part of it
    was that they simply did not think race as important as the
    economic system.  Thus, the *Farmer's Alliance* said: "The
    people's party has sprung into existence not to make the
    black man free, but to emancipate all men ... to gain for
    all industrial freedom, without which there can be no
    political freedom...."
      More important than theoretical connections were the
    Populist expressions of support for workers in actual
    struggles.  The *Alliance-Independent* of Nebraska, during
    the great strike at the Carnegie steel plant, wrote: "All
    who look beneath the surface will see that the bloody battle
    fought at Homestead was a mere incident in the great
    conflict between capital and labor."  Coxey's march of the
    unemployed drew sympathy in the farm areas; in Osceola,
    Nebraska, perhaps five thousand people attended a picnic in
    Coxey's honor.  During the Pullman strike, a farmer wrote to
    the governor of Kansas: "Unquestionably, nearly, if not quite
    all Alliance people are in fullest sympathy with these
    striking men."
      On top of the serious failures to unite blacks and whites,
    city workers and country farmers, there was the lure of
    electoral politics--all of that combining to destroy the
    Populist movement.  Once allied with the Democratic party
    in supporting William Jennings Bryan for President in 1896,
    Populism would drown in a sea of Democratic politics.  The
    pressure for electoral victory led Populism to make deals
    with the major parties in city after city.  If the Democrats
    won, it would be absorbed.  If the Democrats lost, it would
    disintegrate.  Electoral politics brought into the top
    leadership the political brokers instead of the argrarian
    radicals.
      There were those radical Populists who saw this.  They
    said fusion with the Democrats to try to "win" would lose
    what they needed, an independent political movement.  They
    said the much-ballyhooed free silver would not change
    anything fundamental in the capitalist system.  One Texas
    radical said silver coinage would "leave undisturbed all the
    conditions which give rise to the undue concentration of
    wealth."

    Message: 76427
    Author: $ Peter Petrisko
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: GRANT NOMINEE
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 22:39:45

         I nominate Mark Adkins, who probably logs on more than many of the
    $tatus users.  He shows a lot of spunk and makes good horse sense.

    Message: 76428
    Author: $ Peter Petrisko
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: DARYL/SERRANO
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 22:57:31

         There was an excellent article in (I believe) ART IN AMERICA awhile
    back, before the "Piss Christ" flap in any case, about the ART of Andre
    Serrano.  I refuse to debate someone who obviously hasn't taken the time to
    research something as simple as the work of an artist but instead makes
    blanket statements that do little more than further confuse the issue.  You
    can make any statement you want to "prove" your point but that doesn't
    necessarily make the statement true.

    Message: 76429
    Author: $ Peter Petrisko
    Category: My Dinner with...
    Subject: METROPOPHOBOBIA
    Date: 07/07/91  Time: 23:06:28

    NOW OPEN AT 128 E. TAYLOR (2 blocks North of Van Buren between 1st and
    2nd Sts.)................ M E T R O P O P H O B O B I A

    We carry: Alternative Press, Artpaper, Earth First!, Factsheet Five, Gnosis,
    Greenpeace, Lost and Found Times, MaLLife, Mondo 2000, Open, Puncture,
    Quayle Quarterly, Re/Search, Scrap, Semiotext(e), Sound Choice, Whole Earth
    Review, WW III Illustrated, Yellow Silk, and many other magazine titles....
    PLUS - experimental music in many formats, cutting edge refrigerator
    magnets, t-shirts and other flotsam from the cultural fringes.

    HOURS:  Wed - Fri, 5pm to 10pm; Sat & Sun, noon to 10pm.

    If you drop by THIS WEDNESDAY at 7ish you can be a judge when we do a live
    video-phone hookup with a space in Washinton DC  (they're having a
    contortion contest and anyone at Metropo is a judge....)

    WHAT IS "METROPOPHOBOBIA"?  The pervasive fear of metropolitan Phoenix.

    255-0668 is the number.

    I'll type with ya'all soon..... (I'm faxing myself to Chicago on Thurs. but
    will be back.)

    Message: 76430
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Bill/police state
    Date: 07/08/91  Time: 01:12:51

    A police state is where there exist organizations out of reach of the
    working class, whose purpose is to enforce laws in which you were not given
    a say nor ever asked.

    In the common courts a suspect is innocent until proven guilty.  In a
    police state the suspect is guilty unless proven otherwise by the
    defendants efforts.

    I would say that there is a secret, from our eyes, police force.  In fact I
    know that there is but I can't seem to put my finger on any one of the
    members.

    A man or woman does not have to be a criminal in order to see this police
    force in action, against them.  Being unpopular with the establishment is
    often reason enough.

    I'll even go so far to say that there is a death squad in existence as part
    of the makeup of the police state.  Whoever rocks the systems boat the
    hardest receives attention according to the size of the wave.

          A police state has a large prison population.  A police state has to
    exist when the working class are being ill treated.  -Rod

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