### Apollo BBS Archive - November 27, 1991

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    Message: 8709
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:30:18

    Re:  The next time you see a hunk of slimey cheese, think of it going into
    your entrails and rotting there.

    Why Rod, you're turning into a regular Adelle Davis!

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    Subject:Felix, last

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     1:How did you find out about the sex change?
     2:end

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    The message is 8710

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    Message: 32
    Author: $ Zak Woodruff
    Category: About me!
    Subject: moi
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 03:12:59

    I am just a regular guy.

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    Message: 1975
    Author: $ Zak Woodruff
    Category: Chit-Chat
    Subject: Cliff *Kolostow*?
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 03:16:50

    Not too long ago, Cliff would ZAP somebody who called him by the name
    Kolostow. Now he's freely using it himself? Did Cliff's sense of humor
    improve cosmically, or did him and "Sandy Sysop" split up?

    Message: 1976
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Cliff's name
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 09:54:17

    He and Sandy did not split up.

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    Message: 80053
    Author: $ Zak Woodruff
    Category: My Dinner with...
    Subject: Apollo BBS
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 02:44:42

    Wow, lots of new faces around here. New faces having the same old
    discussions. A stinkweed by any other name spells just as rancid. Oh, sorry
    to be negative, it's just that one would think after all this time something
    would change. But nothing changes, it's just a spiraling, vertigoing
    yin/yang cycle with the same gooey, slimy words being slung back and forth
    like primoridial ping-pong balls covered with poop. And speaking of poop,
    how in the hell are you all? I noticed something about censorship--Is
    Clifford (oops, I mean Cliff...sorry Cliff) still doing censorship on here?
    If so, tsk tsk. If not, bravo! Ann Oudin, you're still my cuddly little
    honeybunch. You warm my tummy. Nick Ianuzzi, you're still a turnip-brained
    twink, but love and kisses to you anyway. Beauregard and "Melissa," you're
    like two tasty ding-dongs in a cozy little package, all soft, sugary, and
    edible. And Rod, Rod, Rod...you're the same old veteran hippie, spreading
    the gospel of subgenius incoherence. God bless you, Rod. I am amazed that JT
    is back, and still using that tired old expression...I wish he'd shut up
    you-know-when. I also noticed that Paul Slobber and Mike F-F-..er, Carter
    are still doing their parodies of blind Christians. You have to respect the
    consistency of tone...why, one is almost inclined to believe that their
    intolerance and hatred were actually for real! (But it couldn't be...true
    Christians would never get into heaven if they really acted that way.) Oh,
    lordy, you all know I'm just pulling your collective electronic legs. Who
    are these oh-so-wordy nerdies who engage in the nit-pickingest debates since
    Mark Adkins? C'mon, now...*Archimedes*? He's joking, right? Oh well, the
    Wall is just the same, just the same, for ever and ever and ever and ever...

    Message: 80054
    Author: $ Zak Woodruff
    Category: My Dinner with...
    Subject: Apollo BBSers
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 03:01:31

    Where is Michelle Reynolds when you need her? She could teach you all a
    thing or two. Where is Daryl Westfall, where is James Hawley, where is Bob
    Thornbob, er, Thornburg? Whatever happened to Cervelli enterprises? Remember
    the GT where Christian Williams threw pie at Peter Cervelli's car? How about
    the GT at Golf-n-Stuff where Rod brought his mobile phone, embarrassing
    Cliff? And remember the Falcon Field GT when Cervelli parked his car right
    in the middle of everything, so Peter Petrisko and company kept throwing
    oranges at it, making the alarm go off? Those were the good old days, yes
    sirree... If David Burkhart could see you now, he'd be ashamed, ashamed I
    tell you! Laura Lansberry's voice would go soft. Aster Scott would revoke
    your poetic licenses. But, as Nick Ianuzzi might say, I am babbling.
         Here are a few thoughts:
         * The AIDS hysteria is ridiculously stupid. Just because a welll-liked
    jock dies, suddenly everybody's in another uproar. But nothing has changed
    about AIDS. Heterosexuals are still a miniscule risk group. People who use
    AIDS as an excuse for moralizing should be taken out and shot, as Paul
    Savage would say.
         * I tried to find another debate topic on the BBS, but AIDS seems to be
    the only one getting much attention right now. In the immortal words of Rod
    Williams, o' well.

    Message: 80055
    Author: $ Nick Ianuzzi
    Category: Question?
    Subject: last two
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 03:58:20

    Who is Zak Woodruff?

    Message: 80056
    Author: $ Nick Ianuzzi
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Ann/AIDS
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 04:03:19

    I am not being rude, merely factual.  I don't see anything wrong with a
    little moralizing, either, but face facts --- teenagers are going to have
    sex, AIDS or no AIDS.  They are at an age where they feel immortal, and that
    AIDS will happen to someone else.  Educating them to use condoms may be
    sinful in the eyes of many, but it is far better than a lost generation.

    By the way, I don't think it it necessary to begin AIDS education at age
    six.  That is way too early to inject such complex and fearful thoughts into
    a child's mind.  Perhaps age eleven or twelve would be more appropriate.

    Message: 80057
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Arch's doublespeak
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 09:34:04

    It seems to me that you are the victim of a cruel hoax.  If you give me a
    note, intending to later "demand payment", and these notes are negotiable,
    then I can give the note to someone else, I can fail to present it, I can
    even *destroy* the note.  How are you going to get your payment?

    P.S. Did someone in your group call John Dayl on KFYI yesterday afternoon?

    Message: 80058
    Author: $ Beauregard Dog
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Zak ...
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 09:51:33

    If you think AIDS is the only topic here, or that it is only "the same old
    things" being discussed, perhaps you should take a remedial reading course.

    By the way, Thornbob turned into a Cat; Adkins is now called Matlock.

    Message: 80059
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Paul/no sex
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 13:02:25

    Can you clarify something?  IF the only real "safe" sex outside of a
    monogamous relationship is no sex what is it you would have those not in a
    relationship do to satisfy their hormonal urges, if anything.  Would it be
    OK for them to masturbate?  If not are they just suppose to be horney all
    the time?

    Message: 80060
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Arch/hard money
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 13:17:41

    Hmm, you have me confused..I raised the suggestion that for us today to
    actually use a hard money currency rather then paper (notes and checks) and
    you come back and say we can do it with fax machines and electronic
    transfers.  I may be dense, but that is not my idea of hard money.  That is
    just another way of useing notes and checks.  The fact remains that there is
    no way our economy could function on a "cash" "hard money" basis.
      As to the fractional reserve business, I agree with you that that is one
    of the things that lead to problems.  But, when you get right down to it,
    there really isn't much difference between managing the economy thru a
    fractional reserve system that controlls the value of money and a gold
    standard that can be, and periodically must be, changed to controll the
    value of money.  It all still comes back to having a gvt that is not out of
    control.  If the gvt is under controll then the rest of it is just
    bookeeping.  If the gvt is out of control then you are screwed no matter
    what.  Your position seems to be that the gold standard would somehow keep
    the gvt under control.  I just don't see that since the gvt is the one who
    controlls the gold standard.  For the gold standard to be IN CONTROL then
    the valuation of gold would have to be taken out of the hands of the US gvt
    and put in the hands of a WORLD GVT.  Surely you would not be in favor of a
    NEW WORLD ORDER that would control the value of all money!!!!!!!!

    Message: 80061
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: ARCH/notes
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 13:28:51

    You still have it backwards.  I am not giving the gvt my labor in exchange
    for their notes.  I am giveing someone (my employer) my labor in exchange
    for a paycheck.  I convert the paycheck, in part, to cash in the form of our
    current medium of exchange which is FRNs.  I do NOT get my FRN's from the
    gvt.  I merely use them as a medium of exchange since they are rather
    convenient for that purpose.  And I rarely have more then a few hundred of
    them around.  Most of my wealth is NOT tied up in FRNs.  And anyways, FRN's
    are NOTES, an IOU from the gvt to whoever bought them origianlly (one of the
    Federal Reserve Banks I believe).  It is a promissory note from the gvt to
    the FRBank.  If the bank, or any one demands payment on the NOTE they will
    be paid by the FED GVT with a nice new FRN.  That is the only aspect of the
    situation that is a "scam" since clearly there is no real "money" as you
    view it, available from the gvt in exchange for the NOTE when you demand
    payment.  From the gvt's standpoint the FRNs are just dandy since they can
    expand or contract the money supply with them and thereby "manage" the
    economy and create inflation or deflation.  In a MacroEconomic sense, at any
    given point in time, there is a fixed quantity of REAL WEALTH in the country
    and that real wealth is going to be represented by the amount of MONEY in
    circulation.  MONEY divided by REAL WEATH = value of the money.  If you
    increase the amount of money out their then it's value goes down since the
    total wealth remains the same.  That is what causes inflation; more money in
    circulation for whatever reason with the most common reason being that the
    gvt turns on the printing presses and "sells" some more FRNs to the FRBanks.

    Message: 80062
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Politics
    Subject: Arch
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 13:31:12

    My labor is not worth less and less and less unless my wage inflation fails
    to keep up with my money deflation.  It is only a ripoff if I'm on the wrong
    side of things.  For some situations the kind of inflation you decry is
    wonderful - i.e. you own REAL goods that generate REAL wealth.

    Message: 80063
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Arch/Serrated edges
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 13:38:35

    And the serrated edges just show that ANY money can be devalued.  I have no
    reason to think that we would be any better off with money of intrinsic
    value rather then "worthless" paper money.  Both depend on the gvt for their
    stability.  What makes you think a gold coin's value cannot be easily
    manipulated?  ALl the gvt has to do is change the defined value of it.  And
    as the economy expanded and gold coin, as a medium of exchange, became in
    short supply (it would have to serve more and more people and more and more
    wealth) they would surely change it's value.  Most likely they would have to
    make each ounce worth more so that the coins be be made smaller and smaller
    or alloyed so they contained less and less gold.  It would be no different
    then now except it would be hard to get those coins in our wallets.

    Message: 80064
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: ARch
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 13:47:27

    You mixed up so many different things in your FRNs to apples story that I
    don't think it can even be rationally answered.  For one thing, regardless
    of the medium of exchange, a sale now in exchange for a note ALWAYS carries
    with it the risk of inflation as well as the potential of DEFLATION.  While
    you chose to present the story as if their was going to be inflation in the
    common sense of the word it would also be turned around.  For example, it
    may well be that the house HE paid 10,000 for by borrowing from you will
    have gone down in value to only 5,000 when the note is due.  But he still
    has to pay you 10,000 back.  Now YOU are in a positon to buy TWO houses for
    the same money HE could only buy one with.  Also, if you are that worried
    about the value of the money you could just do an adjustable rate loan to
    the guy and voila, problem solved - peg it at 6% interest plus the inflation
    rate and you are protected.
      As to whether I would be happy if he dumped Apples in my lap, well , why
    not, ?  If Apples were declared the new legal tender and I had to accept
    them then so would everyone else wouldn't they!!! So I could spend them just
    like I spend FRNs.  Now I'll grant you,, no one likes have ing the rules
    changed in the middle of the game but it WAS your example and a fairly
    ridiculous one!!  You are still blaming the money for the failures of our
    leaders.

    Message: 80065
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: ARCH/WHY support gol
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 13:56:17

    d standard.  You didn't even come close to addressing the point of my
    message.  I understand why you want a FIXED standard (good luck), my point
    is WHY GOLD???  If you are so convinced that the gvt is going to pass a
    "GOLD STANDARD" and then actaully stick to the established value and not
    monkey with it, why would you want a GOLD standard, a standard that is
    inherently unfair since it rewards those who happen to own gold mines.  It
    would seem to me lthat the only fair thing to do is for the gvt to REALLY
    control things and simply manufacture a fixed quantity of Titanium coins
    that are somehow not counterfeiterble and put then into cirulation, or
    some similar scheme.  After all, your gold coins would not be
    non-counterfeitable since they could easily be alloyed down, sandwiched, etc
    and to protect oneself you would have to determine the density of every coin
    you took in payment, hardly are reasonable way to do business.  And as I
    pointed out before, it really isn't a practical system to have nothing but a
    coin money supply.   You talk of "rebacking" the notes but if there are
    notes instead of real gold coin they system would not last a decade before
    it was devalued unless you are again unwittingly supporting a GLOBAL GVT,
    NEW WORLD ORDER that will enforce the gold standard on ALL countries.

    Message: 80066
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Politics
    Subject: ARCH/Kitty kitty
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:00:21

    I guess it boils down to the fact that you have not convinced me that you
    understand how the system works or what money is for.  It doesn't matter how
    many books you may have read, your arguments do not, to me, proceed from a
    logical set of premises and lead to logical ends.  That is not a criticism
    or attack on you just a statment of my reading of what you are saying.  I'm
    sure the MANY people feel the same about some of what I post!

    Message: 80067
    Author: $ Fred Smith
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: ARCH
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:05:04

    I should have been more clear about what I meant by "Carried away".  If you
    go into the jury room and start telling the other jurors YOUR interpetation
    of the law, and how the judge is telling them wrong, and how they have this
    right and that right, and possibly comming across as a little threatening to
    boot, you may get in trouble.  One of the jurors may tell the judge about
    your comments and he would very easily simply declare a mistrials on the
    basis of a juror interferring with another juror.  IN the same way that a
    juror who has been told to not read about the case in a newspaper can get in
    trouble or cause a mistrial the same is very likely to happen if a juror
    gets "carried away" in what he says and does in the jury room.

    Message: 80068
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: B Dog
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:11:33

    Re:  The man in question was probably a pederast but *not* a homosexual.

    I'm not sure I understand your point.  Since it was an adult hitting on a
    child, he was a pederast.  Since it was a male hitting on a male, he was
    also a homo.  I guess he could have been bisexual.  Is that what you're
    getting at?

    Message: 80069
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Green
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:15:00

    Re:  What a stupid question. Of course you wouldn't.

    I'm glad you answered your own "stupid question."  I usually don't reply to
    them.

    Message: 80070
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Answer!
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:16:47

    Re:  Okay, everyone pick their favorite way to die and try to stick to it.

    I would like to die of old age while I'm sleeping.

    Message: 80071
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Rod
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:20:13

    Re:  But then again I have shares of National Condom so buy lots.

    With all the recent hoopla about AIDS/HIV, etc, I'll bet your stock is going
    through the roof!  No matter what happens, someone manages to get rich from
    it.

    Now why didn't I think of that?

    Message: 80072
    Author: $ Felix Cat
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Zak
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 14:24:16

    Welcome back Zak; now go away again!

    Message: 80073
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Fred Smith/80059
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 15:16:44

    It would be okay for people to masturbate.....as long as they wear a condom.

    Message: 80074
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Zakey, Zakey, Zakey
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 15:19:47

    Ah, finally someone made some sense on this board.  You've been missed.

    Message: 80075
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: Felix/death
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 15:20:37

    So, you'd like to die quietly in your sleep.  Tis a possibility.  Good luck.

    Message: 80076
    Author: $ Rod Williams
    Category: Chit Chat
    Subject: THE NOW (for Zak)
    Date: 11/28/91  Time: 15:21:20

    In the roots of Capitalism there is an inherit glitch and every so
    often it has to take a dump in order to 'cleanse' itself.  I think we
    are in the early period of that dump.

    The work force exceeds the positions available and it seems that we
    are losing more ground rather fast.  Our society has stagnated itself
    both economically and socially.  Bankruptcies and AIDS are the new
    buzz words of today.

    In a few years contact sports will either be very limited or will not
    exist.  People will not have the funds to go to sporting events and
    the players will be afraid of acquiring AIDS.

    As E.J. Montini said in his Thanksgiving Message, this date, "At least
    we aren't dead."  Yet.

    But what if we were?  Would it REALLY matter?  Isn't it going to
    happen soon, anyway.  Some of us will die of heart disease, AIDS,
    cancer, automobile accident, gunshot wound, having a 100,000 pound
    block of steel fall squarely on our heads.....and so what?

    The important thing, I believe, is to make the very best of it, in
    both living and in dying.  I think that a smile is one of the real
    powerful forces here on earth.  Use it.  Accept that which is to come
    and understand that this trip here on this little planet is just like
    the song says:  "If you believe in forever then life is just a one
    night stand."
                                    Rod

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