

#: 4597 S8/BBS Systems/TSMon
    24-Jun-90  10:00:00
Sb: #4588-#login
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

Everett,

There area several logins in the library already that far exceed the
capabilities found in the stock utility. Have you had a chane to look?

Steve

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4620 S8/BBS Systems/TSMon
    24-Jun-90  21:30:57
Sb: #4597-#login
Fm: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366
To: Steve Wegert 76703,4255 (X)

I have All of these BUT all have more than I need!

NEED THE STOCK ONE!



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4631 S8/BBS Systems/TSMon
    25-Jun-90  07:53:38
Sb: #4620-login
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

Gee Everett,

THe Login I reference is about as stock as they come. The only diference, as I
recall, is Peter encrypted the password ... as it _should_ be.

Steve

#: 4598 S8/BBS Systems/TSMon
    24-Jun-90  10:10:30
Sb: #4588-login
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

Everett,

The file LOGIN.AR in LIB 9 is a pretty hardy replacement for te stock stuff.
Play with that and see what you think.

Give a shout if you need more info.

Steve

#: 4599 S7/Telecommunications
    24-Jun-90  11:26:56
Sb: #4584-#Bitnet
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: BOB GLAD 71046,1134 (X)

Hey, T Bob!

I think you meant Bitnet for those files from Frank. Being out of town as much
as you are, you'd probably better not sign up (it comes in thru CIS Mail, so
you'd need to read it every day, almost).

No idea about Y-Modem vs CIS B. Probably close to same speed, I'd guess.
Someone will correct me if not <grin>.

Glad to hear you may be able to start on the hard disk route.

Going to the meeting this week? You in town?

Kev

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4622 S7/Telecommunications
    24-Jun-90  22:57:07
Sb: #4599-#Bitnet
Fm: BOB GLAD 71046,1134
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kev-usual. I had been using Y-Modem and noticed as far as I could see not much
difference in speed.

I am also following Frank's lead and advise and probably will get a Seagate 42
MB "N" series.  Probably will take a little while to put all the pieces
together.  I also probably will replace my floppies also.

Frank downloaded the whole thing from BitNet and it looked downright
interesting.  Didn't know how it works tho.

Before I forget-- Does the Disto upgrade conflict with the Tandy 512?

Well gotta run.  Will drop by some weekend.

Trucker-Bob



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4626 S7/Telecommunications
    24-Jun-90  23:38:00
Sb: #4622-#Bitnet
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: BOB GLAD 71046,1134 (X)

Okay, Bob.

On the Disto 1meg thingie; I suppose it just happened that it didn't work with
that one guy's Tandy board. Hadn't heard otherwise yet. Hmm.. unless there's
some kind of physical problem? Not sure. I'll ask.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5037 S7/Telecommunications
    10-Jul-90  00:34:09
Sb: #4626-Bitnet
Fm: BOB GLAD 71046,1134
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Hey Kev..

Sorry that it took so long to read your message.  I've been out of town more
than usual.  When I read your first message reply I thought you might have
ducked this question. <grin>

I, at this point, don't know how I will spend the money that I have saved.
Getting a little confused by all the hardware options as well as the new
products that are coming out.  I would like to reread your message that you
posted on the cost comparison of the MM1 verses a competetor like IBM ect. I
might keep on saving my money until I can afford one of these machines.

Let me know if you find out anything on the compatibility problem on the Disto
if there is one.  I still might go this route as a stopgap.

Talk to ya later.

                                    T-Bob

#: 4600 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    24-Jun-90  11:27:01
Sb: #4265-#Am I crazy?
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Pete what is it at the far west end of the Ssan Fernando Valley (near where I
live) that has to do with Gimiz or OS9 ?

TC

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4624 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    24-Jun-90  23:16:49
Sb: #4600-#Am I crazy?
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony -

Admittedly I'm out of context, but I haven't a clue as to what you're talking
about... care to give it another shot?

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4627 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    25-Jun-90  00:35:48
Sb: #4624-#Am I crazy?
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

I read a message that you sent to ?? recently, and it said something about
Gimix, OS-9 and heading to the West SanFernando Valley. I thought that maybe
there was a store that sold Gimix or other OS9 systems in the area. So I
thought I would inquire.  Don't woory about it if it doesn't ring any bells.
Curiosity got the better of me. Thats what I get for reading sombody else's
messages !

TC

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4629 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    25-Jun-90  03:27:14
Sb: #4627-#Am I crazy?
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony,

I was the one who wrote the obscure reference to the far west end of the San
Fernando Valley. By far west end I was referring to Newbury Park - where Pete
lives.

Admittedly, that's stretching the Valley a wee bit to the west. And I should
know better! I'm a columnist at the Daily News in
... ah ... Woodland something (grin). But, I don't live in the Valley. I do all
my writing via the modem. (I know. I know. What a poor excuse!)

By making a pilgrimage to the far west end I was referring to a proposed visit
to Pete's home - one time abode of the now departed GIMIX Ghost. My computer
wouldn't read a single density disk. His GIMIX could. And did.

I hope that clears up any confusion. And, yes, I am crazy! (grin)

Wendell Benedetti

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4862 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    04-Jul-90  02:18:42
Sb: #4629-#Am I crazy?
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)

Thanx for the info. For a while there I think Pete thought I wuz the crazy one.
I've talked to him a few times about making the journey to see his Gimix
system, but we have never solidified any plans. I've been really buzt with
school and such. Interesting idea journalism via modem ! What do you write
(type) about ? Are you still running a Gimix system ? The closest thing I 'v
ever come to seeing a Gimix wuz on the back cover of Color Computer News
(REMEMBER THAT ONE COCO VETERANS !!!!!!!!). You and Pete may not have heard of
that magazine if you are strictly Gimix users, but it was another of the
thousands (just kidding Lonnie !) of Color Ccomputer magazines to come and go
since day 1, and yes I do beleive Rainbow is on it's way out too. Staples this
month !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So if I don't get to see Pete's Gimix system maybe I
could convince you to give me a tour if you have the time. Thanx.

TC

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4865 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    04-Jul-90  04:11:30
Sb: #4862-#Am I crazy?
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony -

Ahem.... I was getting Rainbow when it was printed using an Epson MX-80 (with
the Graphtrax option!), and duplicated on a copier and stapled together. I
started out with an 'E' series (possibly 'D'?), and had the hot rodded piggy
backed 32k hack. I have been a 6809'er for a loooong time. (g)

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4938 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    07-Jul-90  01:11:03
Sb: #4865-#Am I crazy?
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Ssorry. I din't know that. Anyway, it wasn't intended as an insult. I just
thought since I usually hear you talking about Gimix systems, that it was your
first system. I still have a gray dinosaur myself, but my Rainbows don't go
back as far as yours. Guess you been round longer. Ok you win. Maybe not. I
forgot, I have Thunder Ram on my CC 1. It was a 256K ram board that allowed you
to have 4 separate 64k basic banks running. But only 1 bank would actually be
running a program at a time. The other 3 would just sit there waiting to be
mapped in . Wwhat a neat idea WAY back then, but the true applications for that
were somewhat limited ( actually it wuz just our imaginations that were
limited). Thanks to Chris Erving, Thunder Ram wuz made possible. I wonder what
happedened to him. I used to see him at the Color Aamerica meetings, but then
he defected to the Amiga crowd. I guess he was entitled to it. He helped
stretch the coco 1's capabilities several times. Aanybody know where Chris is
or what he is doing ????? TC

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4942 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    07-Jul-90  01:27:34
Sb: #4938-#Am I crazy?
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony -

Nope.... I checked in waaaaay before Thunder Ram.... circa 81. We use to share
neat tech tips like inverting the cassette recorder for better reliability.
Chris Irving was a young fellow here in the LA area. I don't know what became
of him.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4977 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    08-Jul-90  11:33:56
Sb: #4942-#Am I crazy?
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Pete Wwhen you said you inverted the cassette player did you mean you
physicaaly turned it upside down, or did you mean you inverted the signal that
comes from the player during playback. If you did mean physical inversion, how
ddid that make the cassette player more reliable ? TC

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5003 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    08-Jul-90  17:13:05
Sb: #4977-Am I crazy?
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Upside down.... held the tape closer to the  head better.

Pete

#: 4870 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    04-Jul-90  10:23:07
Sb: #4862-#Am I crazy?
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

**Staples** ????

Now there's a step backwards in time.

Steve

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4940 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    07-Jul-90  01:18:47
Sb: #4870-Am I crazy?
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Steve Wegert 76703,4255 (X)

You got it. Next thing you know the Rainbow will be shipped, as a kit and you
have the option of binding it yourself ! TC

#: 4634 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    25-Jun-90  09:39:11
Sb: #4627-#Am I crazy?
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Oh - okay. I have been in the air most of this week (literally - Boston,
Washington, and Fresno), and was caught off guard. Actually, there used to be
an SS50 manufacturer here in Westlake Village, but I believe they've closed
their doors (Smoke Signal Broadcasting).

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4863 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    04-Jul-90  02:21:23
Sb: #4634-Am I crazy?
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Yep. I remember Ssmoke Signals adds in 68 Micro Journal (I think) ? There is
are hardware/software guy that used to do some work for them working at the
company I work for (Micropolis). He was the ORIGINAL author for Dircopy. TC

#: 4601 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    24-Jun-90  12:18:32
Sb: #4582-#TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Robert Heller 71450,3432
To: Steve Wegert 76703,4255 (X)

FTP is indeed File Transfer Protocol.  It is part of "TCP/IP", the network
protocol used on the old ARPANet and now on the InterNet.  Many nodes on the
network have libraries of files (programs, data, etc.) which are publicly
available.  Rather than give accounts to everyone who wants to get this or that
file, these nodes have set up a "guest" account called "anonymous". People can
then login with FTP as anonymous to fetch the files the want.
                        Robert

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4632 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    25-Jun-90  07:56:21
Sb: #4601-TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Robert Heller 71450,3432

Thanks for the reply, Robert.

Steve

#: 4611 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    24-Jun-90  15:24:49
Sb: #4578-TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Robert Heller 71450,3432

Yes, they do - let me get that address and message back to you.

#: 4651 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    26-Jun-90  09:19:30
Sb: #4572-TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Steve -

In the event nobody's given you a solution for  packaging and compressing
groups of files with subdirectories, the best bet is:

  1) use 'tar' to create a tar file of the files/dirs

  2) compress it using 'compress'

So, if you wanted to package and send all the files in /dd/TOP as one unit,
you'd do something like this:

  chd /dd/TOP
  tar cvf /dd/tmp/topstuff.tar .

That would make a unix compatible TAR file called topstuff.tar in the directory
/dd/tmp (the TAR arguments 'cvf' tell it to 'c'reate a new tar file,
'v'erbosely show all the files being stuffed into it, and to use 'f'ile
/dd/tmp/topstuff.tar as the repository.) To break it out, you'd do the inverse:
chd [directory of your choice]; then tar xvf /dd/tmp/topstuff.tar ('x'tract).

I'd also recommend compressing the files using the compress command in DL9.
It's a unix compatible LZ compression tool that uses a 12 bit compression
scheme (i.e. if creating a file on unix for later decompression under OS9, you
should use 'compress -b12 filename' to keep unix from using a 16 biy
compression map). Anyway, under OS9 you'd just type: compress topstuff.tar.
This would create a called topstuff.tar.Z. You would upload that file.

To get it exploded back to normal, you'd just 'compress -d topstuff.tar.z', and
then use 'tar xvf topstuff.tar' to break it all back out.

Pete

P.S. I'll make sure that we have a copy of TAR in DL9 if we don't already.

#: 4618 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    24-Jun-90  19:44:58
Sb: #4556-#TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Dwight D. McKay 75776,1521
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

The TOP package contains an OSK version of the UNIX "tar" facility.  It will
preserve the directory structure.  You might want to consider uploading "tar"
first, followed by a tar file containing docs.  A person downloading could then
get tar and whatever tar files and extract the files needed.

FYI: The TOP tar files are compatible with UNIX tar.  The FTP-able copy of the
TOP stuff is one 10 Meg. tar file.  I was able to extract the OSK tar from that
file and then transfer it and the tar file to my ST for further extraction...

--ddm

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4695 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    27-Jun-90  19:28:44
Sb: #4618-#TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: Dwight D. McKay 75776,1521 (X)

Hi Dwight!

Following your advice (see my message to Pete Lyall).

How long ago did you download?  And, is there source code for mmon, password
and the rest of the login package?

The transfer time for kermit is not surprizing - it's not too swift but it is
reliable.  I'm using Sterm and B+ protocol to upload.  Much faster.

Ed

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4703 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    27-Jun-90  21:53:02
Sb: #4695-TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Dwight D. McKay 75776,1521
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

I downloaded TOP about two weeks ago.

Scanning through the list of files, I don't see sources for mmon, password or
login.

Yeah, I know kermit is slow, especially the "small block" kermit that I had
handy.  On the other hand it works well and was already on my Sun at work.  All
I did was cart my Atari to work, hook it up to the Sun and let it run over
night.

Top certainly has enough goodies to be well worth the download time.  I'm
really happy with the version of the Bourne Shell (sh) that they provide.  It
allows you to write shell scripts, has command recall with editting, etc.  Very
nice! They also provide two of my favourite UNIX utilities, sed and awk.

--ddm

#: 4617 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    24-Jun-90  19:44:46
Sb: #4542-TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Dwight D. McKay 75776,1521
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

The download time for the TOP disks will be pretty bad.  I FTP'd them to my Sun
at work and then kermit'd the files down to my ST over a direct connection.  It
took 13 hours at 9600 baud!

--ddm

#: 4610 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    24-Jun-90  15:24:07
Sb: #4575-TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

If you know what area that these updates have been posted to, I can acquire the
files.  I don't have a proper rn working, but I do know where to find usenet -
but can't go through the whole set of areas looking for something.

StG

#: 4603 S1/General Interest
    24-Jun-90  12:56:36
Sb: #Looking for a Terminal?
Fm: Jay Truesdale 72176,3565
To: Steve Wiegert

Steve:

Are you looking for a used terminal?

Try "The Electronics Exchange" on St. Charles Rock Road about a half mile west
of I-170.  They're on the left side of the road (while going west) next to
Floyd's Tire and hard to see.

Last time I was in there they had some Televideo 925s, DEC VT-52s, Freedom
100s, and some other oddball stuff.  In the back room (back left corner as
viewed from the front door) buried on the bottom of a shelf they had a bunch of
recent Wyse (?) and Esprit terminals but I didn't see any keyboards for them,
doesn't hurt to ask though.

They've got some real garbage in there but sometimes you can find something
useful, I bought an all but new Televideo 955 for $85.00 for the company I work
for.  Stock varies a lot from month to month sometimes.

Good luck!




There are 2 Replies.

#: 4604 S1/General Interest
    24-Jun-90  12:58:26
Sb: #4603-Looking for a Terminal?
Fm: Jay Truesdale 72176,3565
To: Jay Truesdale 72176,3565 (X)

P.S. I though that I had posted this message before but I never saw it in
subsequent reads, nor can I find it with the scan command so here it is again
for possible future reference.

-J

#: 4633 S1/General Interest
    25-Jun-90  07:58:46
Sb: #4603-Looking for a Terminal?
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Jay Truesdale 72176,3565 (X)

Thanks Jay .... I was begining to wonder if I was gonna hear from you! :-)

Sounds like another great place to spend an afternoon digging!

Steve

#: 4605 S10/Tandy CoCo
    24-Jun-90  13:14:01
Sb: #os9 to Dos
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: all

Is there a file that converts a os9 disk to Dos ? such as "Dosor9" converts
from Dos to os9? I have a midi file on os9 disk that I need to ge a dos disk to
use my dos based termqNlyi?lv~Mi=3}|

terminal pakage to upload with

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4608 S10/Tandy CoCo
    24-Jun-90  15:20:36
Sb: #4605-os9 to Dos
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Denise,
  Check the file PCDOS.AR in LIB 10. It runs under OS9, and will do the job for
you (with a few adjustments via a patch file). You'll need a freshly PC-DOS
formatted diskette to do the job.

   Dan

#: 4619 S10/Tandy CoCo
    24-Jun-90  21:07:21
Sb: #4605-os9 to Dos
Fm: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

There are a couple of utilities in the libraries here for copying files from an
os9 disk to a rsdos disk.  In lib 9 you'll find rsdos.ar which requires a patch
to CCDisk to work and in lib 10 you'll find idcpy.ar which doesn't require the
the patch but which in consequence can't access track 0 on the rsdos disk. 
Take your choice.

#: 4606 S13/Atari ST
    24-Jun-90  15:16:17
Sb: #4553-Atari Comm Programs
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Steve Wegert 76703,4255 (X)

Yes, my initial intention was to make all the StG modules interact with the
original stuff so that you could use either login or tsmon for instance - but
I've had to drop that idea somewhat.  You can use the old tsmon or the old
login, but you loose net transfer capabilities.  But the new modules act the
same and use the same format password file etc, for the most part.

StG

#: 4609 S13/Atari ST
    24-Jun-90  15:22:17
Sb: #4561-Atari Comm Programs
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: David George 72240,134 (X)

How about this - you can help me with the V4 development.  Although I
personally am against having utilities such as SU laying around (one can just
log into sysop no?), I haven't yet written a chown.  We couldl work out a swap
of a set of my library utilities and full package for some additional routines
to be added to it.  I have already completed the majority of the library
routines, including the new password file read routines.  It does not as yet
have the key index stuff in it yet, but programs written to use these calls
will work when recompiled with the change in password routines.

It would be nice to have a chown (as well as other utilities) that are
integrated into the package.

Call me at (317) 241-6401 to discuss it further.

StG

#: 4612 S7/Telecommunications
    24-Jun-90  15:40:51
Sb: #4592-#UUCP Beta testers wanted
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Yes, I do want to test the uucp port.  I have multiple machines, and can run a
test on a different one.  I can also interface my mailer to any format.

I want to get the source code for the protocol so that I can rig it to function
from within the StG login package.  This would allow my StG nodes in the
netherlands and australia to hook into a local uucp node instead of calling
major long distance.  It would also help for within the country too.

The StG login package is a commercial package (barely).  But whatever small
modifications/additions to the UUCP software will be placed in the PD.  I have
no interest in selling UUCP, only allowing people who are using StG to hook
into UUCP.

I may not even need the actual G protocol source - all that I am interested in
is the bare routines necessary to implement a transfer.  In essence, something
I can pipe a pre-formatted list of messages into, run to do the transfer (I can
write my own handler for calling in), and which outputs a list of messages to
be posted.  I can take it from there.  Depending on how modularized your set of
modules is, I may not even need any source at all.  But it would be silly to
sit down and write my own G driver.

If you wish, I would even relinquish docs and libraries on interfacing to my
package and you or someone else can do the interface and post it pd.  But as I
wrote the stupid thing, I could handle it much faster.

My intentions in obtaining your UUCP driver are simply to enhance an already
existing network of OS9 people across the country (and world).  I have no want
to make money from this, or even to steal your coding and use for my own
purposes.  All I want is to improve communications between OS9 people by
hooking together networks.  Surely you can understand that.

Let me know what I must to do convince you.

StG

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4642 S7/Telecommunications
    25-Jun-90  22:07:20
Sb: #4612-#UUCP Beta testers wanted
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335 (X)


Scott,

If you write out the work files in the format that uucico expects them, you
might not have to write any code at all.  You need to transfer several files at
once? Pretty simple, just write out the list in the right format, giving the
file a name that uucico will recognize and it will go on its own.

You don't need to convince me, just that I'm always a little leary when someone
asks for the source code and mentions porting to his/her special environment. 
Not that I didn't "steal" lots of my routines from Steve Sampson who did a port
of uucp for UniFlex.  Don't know how he got it to work right tho....I had to
work it over pretty good.

Anyway, I'll send you the source code along with the rest of the uucp files.
I'd appreciate it if you would let me see what you do with it.

Mark

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4664 S7/Telecommunications
    26-Jun-90  19:34:18
Sb: #4642-#UUCP Beta testers wanted
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Hey, thanks!  It will take me a bit to get to it (spending the next two weeks
solid on getting OSKer out), but I will get it working and send you back what I
have accomplished.  You can send to me via StG@hummer.iupui.edu if that would
be easier/cheaper.  Or any StG-net machine.

Yah, it will be a lot easier to understand how it works if I have some source
to glance at... I figure I won't have to change anything, just add whatever
interfacing necessary.  You want a free copy of the StG sw?  You might want to
wait till I get V4 done - it doesn't 'take over' your machine like the current
V3 does.  And conforms more to the 'standards'.  Well, sort of. Let me know if
you'd like a copy.

Again, thanks - I really appreciate this.  And I know the rest of StG-net will
especially.  I will mention your assistance on the net when I get it working...

StG

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4712 S7/Telecommunications
    28-Jun-90  05:43:29
Sb: #4664-#UUCP Beta testers wanted
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335 (X)

Scott,

I'll send you the stuff via internet mail at the address you gave.  I'll be in
CUTS format.  If you don't have CUTS, it is available here in DL10, I think.

Mark

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4755 S7/Telecommunications
    29-Jun-90  22:37:56
Sb: #4712-#UUCP Beta testers wanted
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

I can't find that CUTS in DL10... If anybody knows where it is, please speak
up.  Otherwise, could you send me a copy of some source for it...

StG

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4764 S7/Telecommunications
    30-Jun-90  05:14:32
Sb: #4755-UUCP Beta testers wanted
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335 (X)

Scott,

CUTS.AR is in DL9.  Do a "bro cuts*" and you'll find it.

Mark

#: 4613 S3/Languages
    24-Jun-90  17:54:26
Sb: #4590-#Maybe another C bug
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Mark,

Oops, of course I meant the OSK compiler. I forget you are not YET using OSK!

BTW, we should talk on the phone again RSN.

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4982 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  11:54:12
Sb: #4613-Maybe another C bug
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

Thats only because we don't have MM1's yet. HINT HINT ! TC

#: 4644 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  01:04:59
Sb: #4591-#Maybe another C bug
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Well, I have uploaded my new version into the applications library. You will
need the dictionary from the old version. Hope it helps someone.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4713 S3/Languages
    28-Jun-90  05:43:34
Sb: #4644-Maybe another C bug
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

Bob,

I downloaded your hacked dictionary and am impressed with the speed increase.
Thanks for doing that.  BTW...are you interested in a larger dictionary? This
one only has about 80,000 words.  I can get and MAYBE upload a dictionary of
over 120,000 from one of the systems at work.

Mark

#: 4614 S15/Hot Topics
    24-Jun-90  17:59:24
Sb: #4594-#Special deal
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: JOHN R. WAINWRIGHT 72517,676 (X)

John,

Yeah, we have a "kit" -- the populated board with software. You have to get
your own case and PS and HD floppy. Cost is $659 -- a good deal if you already
have your own case, PS, and HD floppy!

Hard drives require the second board, but the second board gets you NOT ONLY
the hard disk host adapter, but a ton o' stuff, including stereo sampling/
playback ports, mice ports, parallel ports, serial port, etc. Think of the
second board as stereo music/voice synthesizer expandable to 9 meg -and just
incidentally a hard disk interface that allows you up to seven SCSI devices.

You CAN use the B & B if you 1) backup your B & B 2) get a SCSI controller card
(cheap at $80) 3) reformat the drive 4) put your stuff back on the drive. How
you put the drive in the case depends on a few things -- give me a call.

Best,

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4700 S15/Hot Topics
    27-Jun-90  20:43:25
Sb: #4614-#Special deal
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

Paul, how come you have to reformat the hard drive when converting from B&B to
SCSI?  Is that 'cuz MSDOS does it differently than OSK?

Say, your kit is just over $100 less than the ready-to-rock-it. I think I'll
just get my case, PS, and floppy from you. (P.S.: Our OS9 Club meets tomorrow
nite.  Guess what they won't see. Oh well...mike k).

There are 3 Replies.

#: 4758 S15/Hot Topics
    29-Jun-90  22:53:43
Sb: #4700-#Special deal
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111 (X)

Interjecting reply for Paul:

It's necessary to reformat the hard drive because B&B uses the 512 byte sector
format since it's a PC controller, whereas it is more common to use the 256
byte sector format with OS9, because SCSI does support it.  If the driver is
written to handle it, it is possible to set up SCSI to use a 512 byte format
under OS9 using the same 2 sectors in every 1 on disk format that the B&B does.

However, I personally would suggest against trying to convert a B&B drive to
use on the MM1.  It requires you obtain a SCSI controller, and steal the hard
drive from your CoCo.  Imbedded SCSI drives (that is, with a controller built
into the drive) are much faster and more reliable.  And, they're not all that
expensive anymore, as they are fast becoming the preferred type of drive (even
amoung PC'ers) because of their speed, reliablity, and large sizes.  My
recommendation to people is to leave your CoCo intact and invest in a better
drive for the new machine...

StG

There are 3 Replies.

#: 4759 S15/Hot Topics
    29-Jun-90  23:08:29
Sb: #4758-#Special deal
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335 (X)

The SCSI hard disk on my MM/1 prototype uses 512-byte sectors... no tricks
needed these days as RBF handles whatever size you specify. Does mean that
software relying on 256-byte sectors (dEd for one) doesn't work, tho.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4799 S15/Hot Topics
    01-Jul-90  11:44:03
Sb: #4759-#Special deal
Fm: Doug DeMartinis 72245,1400
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kevin, Just read your note about dEd and SCSI and 512 byte sectors. I was under
the impression that despite using 512 byte sectors at the hardware level, the
logical sectors were still 256 bytes. Here is the dmode of the SCSI drive I'm
using now:

DD ctrlrid=1 lun=0 cyls=2510 hds=7 sectrk=36 sectrk0=36 alloc=64 ilv=1 step=7
park=2510 secsize=512 trys=7

dEd has no problem with this. I'm using OSK 2.2. Did 2.3 change some of this?




There is 1 Reply.

#: 4804 S15/Hot Topics
    01-Jul-90  14:11:12
Sb: #4799-#Special deal
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Doug DeMartinis 72245,1400 (X)

Doug, I haven't kept up that well, but I was under the impression that I'm
using a variable-size RBF which doesn't break up the LSNs into 256-byte
sectors.

That's what I was told by a friend, after I tried using dEd on my 512-byte
sector HD (on MM/1)... it kinda worked, kinda didn't... and almost lost LSN 0
it seemed. Maybe not. I'm afraid to experiment any more <grin>.

Hmm... if you read/write 256 bytes at a time, why shouldn't it work? Seems like
it oughta, no matter what the sector size is. Strange. I shall ask. - kev

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4820 S15/Hot Topics
    02-Jul-90  01:33:13
Sb: #4804-#Special deal
Fm: Doug DeMartinis 72245,1400
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

I can understand you being leery after LSN 0 problems. I have had it
overwritten 3 times when somehow a file descriptor got partially zeroed out so
it pointed to LSN 0 as the first file sector. That was the impetus behind
re-writing dEd. Let me know if you find anything else out. I had some problems
with the version a sent you earlier, but nothing like overwriting disks.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4822 S15/Hot Topics
    02-Jul-90  01:54:55
Sb: #4820-Special deal
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Doug DeMartinis 72245,1400 (X)

Yah, I should keep an alternate LSN0 around with appropriate offset in some
descriptor. Not a perfect solution, but would at least let me navigate parts if
need be.

I should be getting a HD for my MM/1 soon (got one on the prototype), in which
case I won't mind screwing with the prototype so much <grin>.

thx - kev

#: 4840 S15/Hot Topics
    02-Jul-90  19:59:33
Sb: #4758-#Special deal
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335 (X)

OK Scott, that sounds like the right attitude -- along with not trying to steal
your floppies, 1 Meg, GIME, and ohther things from your Coco as the Tomcat
board requires.  Well, we'll see how the bank account holds up. --mike k PS:
Yeah, I've been watching for SCSI drives in the COmputer Shopper.

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4857 S15/Hot Topics
    03-Jul-90  22:33:07
Sb: #4840-#Special deal
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111 (X)

I wonder how many GIME chips are left around? Last I checked with National
Parts, it wasn't that many.

Interesting.

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5048 S15/Hot Topics
    10-Jul-90  20:15:49
Sb: #4857-#Special deal
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

Well, considering you're likely to scrounge your Coco3 for everything else, why
not.  Me, I'd rather save it for the kid (or whoever plays games around here,
he he).  Oh yes, and Umuse3 support too!

Actually I'd have exprected Tandy to have a whole warehouse full of GIMEs
somewhere.  But they'll just grind them up for cement out of spite.

Say -- Coco Club meeting this Thursday here, wonder what's on the program.
--mike k

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5073 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  12:22:00
Sb: #5048-Special deal
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111

Mike -
If you're having a club meeting on a given date, at least give us TWO WEEKS --
we're cranking out development machines as fast as the chips come in, and an
MM/1 doesn't sit here more than a few days before it's out the door. That whole
machinery would have to be rearranged to get you guys a loaner for a club
meeting.

Would your club consider a special meeting?

Paul

#: 4888 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  06:33:55
Sb: #4840-#Special deal
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111 (X)

Before you buy one (SCSI drive) from the Shopper, give me a call.  I can
probably get it for less through my wholesale connections.

StG

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5049 S15/Hot Topics
    10-Jul-90  20:17:03
Sb: #4888-Special deal
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335

OK Scott -- thanks for the info.  --mike k

#: 4987 S15/Hot Topics
    08-Jul-90  12:07:33
Sb: #4758-Special deal
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335

True Paul, but an ESDI drive would be faster, less command overhead, but you
can usually only connect two ESDI drives to one contoller, instead of 7 scsi's
TC

#: 4760 S15/Hot Topics
    29-Jun-90  23:10:49
Sb: #4700-#Special deal
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111 (X)

Mike - different controllers put data on disk in different ways. There's no
standard, because after all you can't move the hard disk platters.

So it's because the controllers are different that you'd have to reformat.
Kinda like VHS vs Beta tapes... both record, but in different internal formats.

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4767 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  08:07:46
Sb: #4760-#Special deal
Fm: Colin Smith 73777,1360
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kevin,

     Would you happen to know if a Magnavox monitor with the model number
CM8764074G would work on the MM-1?  Right now it's being used on a Commodore
128.

Thanks in advance.

  --Colin



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4780 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  17:08:58
Sb: #4767-#Special deal
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Colin Smith 73777,1360 (X)

Colin - I don't recog that number. If it's an analog RGB monitor then it should
be able to work. Do you have any other info on it? Pinouts, etc? The CM-8's are
on sale right now pretty cheaply, I hear, also. best - kev

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4794 S15/Hot Topics
    01-Jul-90  02:45:32
Sb: #4780-Special deal
Fm: Colin Smith 73777,1360
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Hmm.  I'm not really sure if it is analog.  My friend said it had a covered
port labeled LIN RGB, but I'm not sure if that is analog, or even if there
really is a port under the punch-out area.  Thanks for the help.

   --Colin



#: 4786 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  21:36:56
Sb: #4760-#Special deal
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Dear Kevin Darling (sir);

 I have a question for you regarding that dataCASE project we discussed in
conference the other night... what is the specs for the floppy drive the MM/1
uses? (5.25 or 3.5?) is it PC compatible? Could I share the drive with my
Amiga/bridgecard drive? Y'all are discussing using SCSI drives with the MM/1,
so I assume it's possible? Any advice on how I could get a SCSI drive to work
with the Millenium (snuck it in there :)?  Say, for example, a 65 meg Seagate
ST277N?                    Awaiting Breathless Reply;
                                      --Eet--


                                   Director of Mayhem
                                  Extra Terrestrial Imports, Ltd.



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4791 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  22:29:17
Sb: #4786-Special deal
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Jim Williams 72157,3524 (X)

DoM Eet,

You can use either 3.5 or 5.25 PC-style floppy drives, normal or hi-density. Up
to four of them, I believe. It comes with one 3.5 hidens drive (useable in
normal density mode also, of course).

Switching those between two computers would involve the "usual" stuff... like a
17-pole switch or so. Accessing MSDOS disks will be possible, so you could
manually move the disk from one drive to another, too.

SCSI should be easier. I could see sharing a HD between the machines... altho
that would mean partitioning it into PC/OS9 sections to prevent trouble. Hmm.
There is a PCDOS file manager for OS9, but I cringe at the thought of using it
for normal OS9 HD operations.

So personally I'd put two HDs on there: one for the Bridgeboard side, the other
for the OS9 side. If you have the second (I/O expansion) board on the MM/1,
it's just a matter of using a 50-pin cable to hook a SCSI drive to the
computer's SCSI header. Any size HD is fine. I know of people with two
1-gigabyte drives online. Did I answer what you meant? best - kev

PS: a friend noticed that a place called the Treasure Chest (?) in Computer
Shopper had 85meg SCSI hard disks for about $370! Sounds like a deal!

#: 4985 S15/Hot Topics
    08-Jul-90  12:05:39
Sb: #4700-#Special deal
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111 (X)

Mike Wwhere does your os9 club meet? I have been looking for a group to get
involved with here in LA, but no dice. ANyone know of any groups in the area
(Os-9 only ) ? TC

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4990 S15/Hot Topics
    08-Jul-90  13:43:47
Sb: #4985-#Special deal
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Unless Mike has moved since the last time I saw him, clubs he attends are
probably in the Chicago area. <grin>

There's an RCIS BBS in Huntington Beach--is that near you?  (Don't know my CA
geography, as you can no doubt tell.  Sigh.)

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5026 S15/Hot Topics
    09-Jul-90  19:18:44
Sb: #4990-Special deal
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

Jim Yes, Huntington Beach is very near. I'll have to give their BBs a ring.
Thanx. TC

#: 5050 S15/Hot Topics
    10-Jul-90  20:18:51
Sb: #4985-Special deal
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104

Unless you work for United....well, we meet in a library near CHicago. I know
of active grtroups in Oklahoma City and N. Carolina. But none in the Land of
Multi-Media -- mike k.

#: 4615 S13/Atari ST
    24-Jun-90  19:44:33
Sb: #4508-UUCP & OSK 2.1
Fm: Dwight D. McKay 75776,1521
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Perhaps.  What I see if I start up kermit after UUCP has given up is the same
as I would see if I had the port set to 8-n-0.  I can tell this as the login
banner on the UNIX machine I'm calling gives the same set of "cracker"
characters. They look like they have the 8th bit set.  Running "uucico -x9"
gives me the impression that uucico is reading the first character which has
the 8th bit set and giving up.

Sigh...

--ddm

#: 4616 S13/Atari ST
    24-Jun-90  19:44:40
Sb: #4543-UUCP & OSK 2.1
Fm: Dwight D. McKay 75776,1521
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Thanks, Ed.  I'll send Frank a note via the internet and see if he can
enlighten me.  I would not be surprised if I have something setup wrong as I'm
more of a UNIX person then an os9'er...

--ddm

#: 4621 S10/Tandy CoCo
    24-Jun-90  21:37:24
Sb: #PLAY sound files
Fm: STEVE FRAVEL 73327,3602
To: James Whitaker 70355,431 (X)

Thanks!  I'll be digitizing some of my favorite sounds, and if they're pretty
good, I'll probably upload 'em...

--Steve

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4636 S10/Tandy CoCo
    25-Jun-90  17:42:49
Sb: #4621-PLAY sound files
Fm: James Whitaker 70355,431
To: STEVE FRAVEL 73327,3602 (X)

Lonnie wants me to bring my Betamax and a few tapes to his house. So probably
after the July 4th holiday I will have a few more to upload myself.

#: 4625 S10/Tandy CoCo
    24-Jun-90  23:34:51
Sb: #Sculptor tutorial
Fm: Al Fleagle 72527,1354
To: John Dickey 76537,2631 (X)

John, I'm very interested in your comment about a SCULPTOR tutorial.  I think
I'm very much with SCULPTOR like I was in the early years of OS9, I have the
package and I use only about 10% of its capabilities.  One problem I've been
trying to work out is multiple to one relationships between data files.  For
example, I call on several offices in the Northeast, each one having its own
information which I might need to recall.  No problem there. However, each
office might be working on several different projects and when I access the
data on the projects I need to be able to reference the information from the
office data.  To further complicate things, I might need information from the
files of an individual from that office, again one of many individuals at each
office.  The point of all this rambling is simple:  Need a beta tester for your
tutorial?  <hint, hint>.

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4630 S10/Tandy CoCo
    25-Jun-90  06:31:17
Sb: #4625-Sculptor tutorial
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Al Fleagle 72527,1354 (X)

Al,
  To my knowledge, there isn't a SCULPTOR tutorial in the LIBS, but if you want
to check out a few examples, Barry Bond (a sculptor user) as uploaded a few
examples in LIB 2. Scoot on up there and type: BRO /KEY=SCULPTOR     and the
first two hits you get are example files.
   Dan

#: 4637 S10/Tandy CoCo
    25-Jun-90  20:22:22
Sb: #4625-Sculptor tutorial
Fm: John Dickey 76537,2631
To: Al Fleagle 72527,1354 (X)

Art,
 Could be on the beta tester... but I'm afraid that point is down the
 road a little bit.  :->  However... Let me look at this message off line
 and study it for a second or two or three or ... What it looks like is
 you need to learn how to use cross-reference files and that will take
 a bit of trial and error and a couple of files I have on hand to do.
 First though I'll upload a "trial" outline of what I understand you need
 If it looks good we will go from there if not we will rework it until
 it works, and see if we can solve your problem for you and get you
 further hooked on what is becoming one of my favorite Fourth Generation
 Language Programs.
 John

#: 4628 S7/Telecommunications
    25-Jun-90  02:35:08
Sb: #4589-#Sterm
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Mark,

Do you have any inkling where the termcap code fails?  I'm running a level two
box similar to the Gimix. Everytime I run Sterm the keyboard locks tight after
giving the current baud rate.

Wendell

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4641 S7/Telecommunications
    25-Jun-90  22:06:53
Sb: #4628-#Sterm
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)


Wendell,

Sorry....no clue.  All I know is if you play around with the termcap entry it
either works or it crashes.  I'm really disapointed in it.  Are you giving the
port name when you run Sterm?  Currently, Sterm defaults to port t2 unless you
give it another name on the command line like:

    sterm -f /t3

You think that might be it?

Mark

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4646 S7/Telecommunications
    26-Jun-90  01:50:54
Sb: #4641-#Sterm
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Mark,

Here's the problem: When I run Sterm (command line: Sterm -f /t9) the standard
input path appears to shut down. Nothing from the keyboard makes it to the
program. However, if I switch to a second virtual terminal window and send the
appropriate Hayes code to the output port (t9), the modem will print out its
menu to the Sterm screen (when I switch back to the virtual terminal that's
running Sterm). In other words, Sterm will not take anything from the keyboard.
But, it will print what comes to it from the T9 port. I've tried to get the
terminal to unlock the keyboard and just about anything else that sounds
vaguely similar, but no-go. And changing Termcap doesn't do anything.

This is a strange one.

Wendell

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4654 S7/Telecommunications
    26-Jun-90  09:45:03
Sb: #4646-#Sterm
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)

Wendell -

Hmmm.... like your other questionable device drivers, I wonder if your serial
port drivers support sending signals on data available (i.e. SS.Sig)... betcha
that's it.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4657 S7/Telecommunications
    26-Jun-90  15:22:44
Sb: #4654-Sterm
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Pete,

I think you're right. From my very limited view (grin) the serial port driver
looks like it will send a signal to wake up the process, but won't do anything
with the keyboard. That's probably why earlier versions of Sterm (and Xcom9)
work while the latest Sterm won't. The new Sterm polls the keyboard
differently. Right?

Of course, you must realize that I don't have the slightest idea what I'm
talking about.

Wendell

P.S. First day of summer heat here in LA: had to turn on air conditioner to
keep computer from flipping out. It must be over 100 outside.




#: 4711 S7/Telecommunications
    28-Jun-90  05:43:26
Sb: #4646-#Sterm
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)


Here's the problem: When I run Sterm (command line: Sterm -f /t9) the standard
input path appears to shut down. Nothing from the keyboard makes it to the
program. However, if I switch to a second virtual terminal window and send the
appropriate Hayes code to the output port (t9), the modem will print out its
menu to the Sterm screen (when I switch back to the virtual terminal that's
running Sterm). In other words, Sterm will not take anything from the keyboard.
But, it will print what comes to it from the T9 port. I've tried to get the
terminal to unlock the keyboard and just about anything else that sounds
vaguely similar, but no-go. And changing Termcap doesn't do anything.

This is a strange one.

Wendell,

I think Pete hit on the problem for you.  However, I'm not sure as to why since
Sterm 1.2 also used keyboard signals to get a character.  You say that 1.2
works fine and 1.3 locks up on the keyboard?

Hmmm....very strange.

Mark

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4719 S7/Telecommunications
    28-Jun-90  13:00:05
Sb: #4711-#Sterm
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Mark,

By older version of Sterm, I was referring to a really OLD version (9232
bytes). Perhaps just a prototype of today's Sterm. The current version that
won't work has 31561 bytes and is labeled The OS-9 User's Group Universal
Terminal Ver. 2.0. I assume that's equivalent to version 1.3

Wendell



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4763 S7/Telecommunications
    30-Jun-90  05:14:29
Sb: #4719-Sterm
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)

Wendell,

Well, if the oldest version on STERM works for you, then I'd say the problem is
the keyboard signal since all the later versions use it.  Can't help you much
with that.  New drivers maybe?

Mark

#: 4635 S3/Languages
    25-Jun-90  10:55:15
Sb: #4562-Help 'c' problem again
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Scott,
 Bruce MacKenzie gave the correct solution to your problem in msg # 4581. Just
replace your line:
 c=getchar();
 with:
 read(0,&c,1);
 and you will get the results you are looking for.
 Mrk

#: 4652 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  09:29:31
Sb: #4562-Help 'c' problem again
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Scott -

I'm sure you've had multiple responses at this point, but I see a couple of
things:

  a) There's a semicolon after your test condition, which in effect
     causes a 'null' statement (i.e. while(c == 'd'), do nothing -
     including not getting any other characters, so the results
     of the test never change.

  b) What is c initially? If it's a typical automatic variable,
     it could contain anything - no promises here unless it's
     a static variable. You could either shift the position
     of the getchar(), and alter the logic, or you could stuff
     a NULL or something into c so you know your starting point.

Pete

#: 4771 S3/Languages
    30-Jun-90  12:04:20
Sb: #4581-#Help 'c' problem again
Fm: Tom Breton 71141,3433
To: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376 (X)

Bruce, thanks for message 4581. I've been trying to figure out why getchar()
wouldn't let my program continue until it got a <CR>. Being a beginner, I
didn't realize it was so dependent on the buffer.

But when I tried read(fileno(stdin),&c,1) it *still* waited for a <CR>
before it would recieve a character. Do I have to go to an even lower level
keyboard scan or something to get it to respond to a single keypress?

    Tom

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4790 S3/Languages
    30-Jun-90  22:14:02
Sb: #4771-#Help 'c' problem again
Fm: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376
To: Tom Breton 71141,3433 (X)

You've got me Tom.  It doesn't work like that on my system--a COCO III, LVL II
with the Microware C compiler.  Not knowing exactly what you've coded, compile
and run the following program.  It should return the ascii value of a key
immediately after it is pressed.

 #include <stdio.h>

 main()
 {
      char c;

      do
      {
           read(fileno(stdin),&c,1);
           printf(" Key = %x/n",(int)c);
      }while(c!='/n');
 }

(the slashes above in /n should be backslashes--the terminal program I'm using
doesn't have them)

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4897 S3/Languages
    05-Jul-90  12:06:28
Sb: #4790-#Help 'c' problem again
Fm: Tom Breton 71141,3433
To: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376 (X)

Just so you know, your program still waits for a whole line on my sytem.
[IBM XT, DOS 3.3, tried both QuickC and MS Codelink 4.00]

    It does nothing until I have typed in an entire line, then executes as
if I just typed it. It works fine, just too late.


    Do you - or anyone else reading - know how I can get around my buffer,
or read from it when it hasn't got a complete line? (And since I've only
programmed in C for two weeks, remember I might not know stuff that's
obvious to everyone else)

 
    Thank you,
       Tom

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4900 S3/Languages
    05-Jul-90  13:17:41
Sb: #4897-Help 'c' problem again
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Tom Breton 71141,3433 (X)

Tom -

[butting in..]

Are you using low level (read()) or high level (fread(), gets(), getchar(),
etc.)?

If high level, try setting buffering off, i.e.

  setbuf(stdin,0);

Also - in MSDOS land, they distinguish between text a binary file types (at
least when reading/writing the files)... Try setting your file type variable to
O_BINARY (check your docs)...

Pete

#: 4907 S3/Languages
    05-Jul-90  16:36:37
Sb: #4897-Help 'c' problem again
Fm: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376
To: Tom Breton 71141,3433 (X)

Sorry, Tom.  I don't think I can help much with your problem--looks to be MSDOS
specific.  I never touch the stuff (MSDOS) myself.

#: 4638 S10/Tandy CoCo
    25-Jun-90  20:37:02
Sb: #Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To:  73007,2473 (X)

in reference to message # 4605, in switching a os9 file over to Coco Dos, using
PCDos.ar. After downloading the file to my rsdos disk, should I use Dosor9 to
get it over to os9 before I unarc it? or should I use Tccoco3.bin to unarc it
before using Dosor9? Also what format should I save a downloaded file that is
arced on the disk? Ascii, Binary, ETC. Thanks, Denise

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4639 S10/Tandy CoCo
    25-Jun-90  20:43:52
Sb: #4638-#Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Denise,
  Whoa! <GRIN>  What exactly is it you want to do? (Now we've got RS-DOS
involved in this...and there are separate utilities to take RS-DOS to MS-DOS as
well OS9 to MS-DOS...and reverse as well.) Explain a little further what files
you have and in what format they currently are, and then what you want to take
them to.
   Dan

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4647 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  02:24:03
Sb: #4639-#Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

Dan - I think Denise first mentioned rsdos, not pcdos. Not positive tho. Better
go back and check the first msg, eh?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4650 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  05:47:36
Sb: #4647-Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kev,
  Just tried. It done scrolled off the system.    Dan

#: 4659 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  17:24:35
Sb: #4639-#Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

I have a Coco 3 512k under os9, but use RSDOS terminal hardware and software to
access compuserve. I have used Dosor9 to download os9 files and convert them to
an os9 disk for execution. I also have Ultimusic, and have created a music file
that I would like to upload to compuserve. It is presently sitting in a pure
os9 disk. I want to move that file to RSDOS and use my terminal
software/hardware to upload it to Compuserve. I don't use a terminal pkg under
os9 because I don't have an rs232 pak. I use the bit banger port and ultimaterm
under RSDOS. Sorry I confused you, (sounds like a woman don't it) Thanks,
Denise

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4666 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  20:49:32
Sb: #4659-#Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Denise,
   Good enuff...now I know what you want...check out the file RSDOS.AR in LIB
10. It will do the transfers back and forth between OS9 and RSDOS.
   Sorry about the confusion (and I probably helped confuse the matter, too!)
   Let us know how it goes!    Dan

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4747 S10/Tandy CoCo
    29-Jun-90  17:23:41
Sb: #4666-#Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

It is in Arced format. Should I download and unarc it with a RSDos arc program
or should I transfer over to os9 with "Dosor9" and then unarc it with a Os9 arc
program. If so, what is a good os9 arc program?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4752 S10/Tandy CoCo
    29-Jun-90  20:27:12
Sb: #4747-#Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Denise,
   Go ahead and download under RS-DOS, but before you do have DOSOR9 handy and
a freshly formatted OS9 diskette.
   Go to LIB 10 and download RSDOS.AR, -AND- to LIB 9 and download AR09.BIN.
   DOSOR9 BOTH files over to your formatted OS9 disk.
   Now...let's take care of the de-archving file first. You will need to reset
the appropriate attributes to get the thing to fly, so, in ALL following
examples, replace the "/d?" with the drive you are using. You will need to type
the following, to change the attributes:
   ATTR /d?/AR09.BIN PE PW PR E W R
   Next, rename the file to get rid of the .BIN extension, type:
   RENAME /d?/AR09.BIN AR
   Bingo, part one is done. So next, we have to change the attributes to
RSDOS.AR so we can do things with it, type the following:
   ATTR /d?/RSDOS.AR PW PR W R
   Bingo, part two is done....and now to extract the files, you can do this by
typing the following:
   /d?/AR -x /d?/RSDOS.AR       and it should extract the files.
   Keep in mind, if you get any errors, it's likely because OS9 doesn't know
where the programs (like ATTR, RENAME, or AR) are located, so don't be afraid
to give full path descriptors (ie... /d0/cmds/ATTR /d0/RSDOS.AR) to where ever
the programs AND files you need to changes or extract are located.
   Good luck!

   Dan

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4770 S10/Tandy CoCo
    30-Jun-90  11:22:28
Sb: #4752-Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

Thanks for the info. I have used dosor9 before, so I am familar with resetting
the attribtes and error problems. Denise

#: 4669 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  22:01:00
Sb: #4659-Downloading pcdos.ar
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Don't sell yourself short, Denise, that was an excellant explanation of your
situation. I haven't read the reply to your message yet, it probably fills you
in on what you need to do. Basically, all you need to do is snatch a copy of

[D RSDos with it's acompaning patch to CC3Disk (unless you use a Disto SCII),
and you can copy files to/from DECB formatted disks. Good luck!

Zack

#: 4640 S7/Telecommunications
    25-Jun-90  21:55:33
Sb: #Uploading messages
Fm: Al Fleagle 72527,1354
To: all

Is there any way to compose a message so when I upload it Compuserve simply
takes it without asking me for the user number or name?  I've tried the View
program but Compuserve still asks for the user ID and/or name.  Any ideas? I'd
like to just upload a file of seven or eight messages all at once but I haven't
figured out how.  Any help will be appreciated.

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4649 S7/Telecommunications
    26-Jun-90  05:45:05
Sb: #4640-Uploading messages
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Al Fleagle 72527,1354 (X)

Al,
  Yes it is possible, although your uploading may go faster than CIS sends it
back to you. Your script should look like this (and keep in mind, I am going
one char over in this example, because the slashes would actually do this if it
were flush left...grin).

At the Forum prompt:

 L   <---stands for Leave (a message)
 {this is the body of your message.}
 /ex <---flush left...as you know this exits the editor
 POST;{TO UID};{SUBJECT};{SUBTOPIC AREA}

 The {TO UID} is who the message is to: ie..Dan Robins 73007,2473
 The {SUBJECT} is what it is about: ie.. Leaving A Message
 The {SUBTOPIC AREA} is the section you want: ie.. 10

 Here's a short example...and remember, everything would be flush left, if I
were doing this for real:

 L
 Leaving a message for Dan Robins to show how and uploaded ASCII text file
 could take care of leaving a message for me.
 /ex
 POST;Dan Robins 73007,2473;An Automessage;10


 Now..there is a way to upload messages here, but, I have found out from
experience, that when I had more than one, this was the quickest way to get the
job done for me. Mind you though, it will all look garbled because CIS falls
way behind in echoing the info back to you.

  Dan

#: 4673 S7/Telecommunications
    27-Jun-90  00:35:20
Sb: #4640-Uploading messages
Fm: Jim Peasley 72726,1153
To: Al Fleagle 72527,1354 (X)

Al;

  The next revision to VIEW incorporates <L>eaving messages (starting a new
thread) as well as storing all replies in one file for transmission to CIS.

  I'm still having some minor problems with getting the 'editor' function to go
back and correct a previous line, but should be done sometime RSN.

  Are you still getting stray chars before the "#:" ?  I've tried several
different methods of determining message start, and so far, haven't come up
with anything more reliable than the present method.

  In addition to Dan's reply, you might check out a file called FAST.CIS
ineeither LIB1 or 2.  It's got a lot of info on just what you're a

..Jim

#: 4643 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  00:34:04
Sb: #window
Fm: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366
To: all

I would like to see t2 in a windo ins't there a program called tee on here??

Any help?




There is 1 Reply.

#: 4648 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  03:01:25
Sb: #4643-window
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

Ev - "tee" comes from L-I or the DevPak, I believe. Wouldn't help you tho, not
for what I think you want it to do. Some BBS's have custom aciapak drivers
which will echo to a window... I believe the Alphasoft package is one, for
instance.

PS: BESTOF.TXT is still there in Lib 10. Just looked and did "bro bestof"...
and there it was. Yell if you still can't find it. - kev

#: 4645 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  01:06:17
Sb: #dungeons
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To:  72500,2572 (X)

to: Floyd Resler 72500,2572 subject: Dungeon Depths

Floyd, I downloaded your game the other day (for my kid!) and he's been having
a blast with it. But in level 7 he gets an "error 56 in mapcheck" message. This
is your latest version. Any idea for a fix? If you want I can shoot up the
idents of the modules...

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4660 S10/Tandy CoCo
    26-Jun-90  18:37:41
Sb: #4645-dungeons
Fm: Floyd Resler 72500,2572
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

The problem you are having is a very common in the game.  It crept up after I
uploaded the game.  It is a memory problem as a result of recursive
programming. To correct it, boot the game this way: OS9: load depthsmod <ENT>
OS9: dungeon #24k <ENT>

That'll take care of it for you.

#: 4653 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  09:37:55
Sb: #4564-"C" programming
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Rodney Harper 75130,1321 (X)

Best textbook I have seen/used on learning C by yourself is the Waite Group's
'C Primer Plus'. It's thorough, example based, non-lofty, and even sprinkles
some humor in an otherwise dry subject. Others have also reported a similar
reaction to it.

Pete

#: 4655 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    26-Jun-90  14:06:04
Sb: #problems compiling tar.c
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: all

I was unable to compile the 'tar.c' program found in tar.ar in DL9. When
compiled using cc -qi tar.c it gave me several undeclared identifier errors and
several errors related to pointers. All in all it was several pages worth of
errors.
        According to the instructions in the listing it said the program would
work under os9/68k.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4661 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    26-Jun-90  19:05:50
Sb: #4655-#problems compiling tar.c
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Scott -

It'd probably help to see the first few lines of the error messages.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4733 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  03:15:54
Sb: #4661-#problems compiling tar.c
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Here are the first few error messages I had while compiling
Tar.c on my PT68K.

tar.c line 346 **** warning - 'return;' on non-void function ***

I had several 'warnings' during compilation, and here are the errors!!

"tar.c", line 537 **** operand expected ***
  u_char *sip = (u_char*) st.fd_fsize;


"tar.c", line 537 **** undeclared identifier ****
  u_char *sip = (u_char*) st.fd_fsize;

I had several 'undeclared identifiers throughout compilation on several
different lines..

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4737 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  06:41:42
Sb: #4733-problems compiling tar.c
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Sounds like you may be missing a header file, or somehow not hitting a typedef
that should read something like "typedef unsigned char u_char;".

#: 4743 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  11:04:46
Sb: #4733-#problems compiling tar.c
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

I think JJ may have nailed part of it... the u_char may not be defined. Try
inserting a line to the effect of:

   typedef u_char unsigned char;

near the top of the code (before main()).

Also, the 'return on non-void function' is a new one, but I have a guess. A
function declared as a 'void' means that it 'returns' nothing. If the function
that's complaining obviously returns something, try declaring that function  as
returning that type, also up in the beginning of the code, i.e.:

   int foo();

or

  char * woof();

Depending on the type being returned.

It does sound as though these should have been addressed in a .h file.

Pete

There are 3 Replies.

#: 4744 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  12:42:33
Sb: #4743-#problems compiling tar.c
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Should I have gotten a .h file included in my tar.ar file. If so I need that
header file. I will check out the u-char variable.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4748 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  19:21:42
Sb: #4744-#problems compiling tar.c
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Scott -

The originator may have forgotten to include such a file. Do the #include lines
at the top make any such references?

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4761 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    30-Jun-90  00:30:01
Sb: #4748-problems compiling tar.c
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

The only #includes that are mentioned are the 'standard' includes you find in
'C' compilers.

#: 4745 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  14:49:27
Sb: #4743-problems compiling tar.c
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

The 2.3 c compiler now checks this (ansi, here we come!) - that a function
declared int (the default) has to return something - an int. Many PD programs
have this "bug". I always note files with the return warning in them and
globally replace "return;" with "return(0);" just to get rid of the pesky
warnings. They *are* only warnings, BTW. It is very rare that anyone delcares a
function as type void. (I didn't say never, did I? <g>).
 Mark

#: 4749 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  20:03:24
Sb: #4743-problems compiling tar.c
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

That warning tells you that you have a function that is supposed to return
something, but it contains a plain old "return;" statement.  This typically
shows up in code written in the days before the "void" type.

#: 4656 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  14:10:09
Sb: #thanks to all
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: all

Thanks Everyone!!!!
        I finally worked it out with the read(0,&ch,1) combined with a
strcmp("q",ch). One funny thing though is that strcmp returns a FALSE if the
strings match so the while guard looks it will break out if you press anything
other that 'q'.

There are 4 Replies.

#: 4658 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  15:53:48
Sb: #4656-thanks to all
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

strcmp() requires string pointers for both paramters. You are using a char
value for the second parameter. &ch won't work either cuz that's a pointer to
type char, not string. Try using strchr("q",ch)  or if you don't have the
Krieder lib use index("q",ch).

Zack

#: 4662 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  19:09:26
Sb: #4656-thanks to all
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Scott -

It doesn't return a FALSE, per se. It returns a difference of 0. If the
characters mismatch at some point, it'll return a positive if the difference
was positive, and the same for negative.

For clarity, some people like to declare a MACRO to take care of the logic:

 #define STREQ(x,y) (strcmp(x,y) == 0)

This way, you could use:

    if STREQ(onestring, theotherstring)
      blah_blah(blah);

Pete

#: 4665 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  19:44:59
Sb: #4656-thanks to all
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Whoa! Wrongo!

read(0,&ch,1);   - puts char in (char) ch

BUT!!!

strcmp("q",ch);

is TOTALLY wrong.  1) assuming ch is declared 'char ch;' you have only one byte
allocated.  Strings are multiple bytes... AND strcmp expects a pointer to
string.  A char is not going to work!

strcmp("q",&ch);

would be closer, but still wrong.  You must have a zero terminator to both
strings, and you have no idea what follows the char ch in memory!

There are two alternatives:

char ch[2]; ch[1]=0; read(0,ch,1); strcmp("q",ch);

OR

char ch; read(0,&ch,1); if (ch=='q') ...;

Of course the latter makes more sense.

Want some additional help on C?  You can call me at (317)241-6401, or mail me
here or any StG-net node at sysop@root.

StG

#: 4668 S3/Languages
    26-Jun-90  21:33:44
Sb: #4656-thanks to all
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Be careful.  Two things: (1) strcmp expects to be handed *pointers* to
characters, and those pointers had better point to NUL-terminated strings, so
that even if you changed that to strcmp("q", &ch), it might not do what you
want. (2) strcmp() is documented to return a negative number if the first
string is less than the second, zero if the first string is equal to the
second, and a positive number if the first string is greater than the second. 
It always pays to read the documentation.

#: 4663 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    26-Jun-90  19:10:44
Sb: #Hot Summer
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)

Yup - I hear you on the heat... and my a/c compressor has a leak (oof).

Pete

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4672 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    26-Jun-90  22:51:34
Sb: #4663-#Hot Summer
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Pete,

By all means, get your a/c fixed! Can you believe the 112 degree
 heat in LA today?

Wendell

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4690 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    27-Jun-90  14:54:49
Sb: #4672-Hot Summer
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)

Haha! We have it easy.... I saw CNN when I got in from school last night
displaying an actual egg FRYING on the siedwalk in Phoenix!

Pete

#: 4679 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    27-Jun-90  07:46:54
Sb: #4663-#Hot Summer
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Pete - same here. For the last coupla summers we've needed a new main
compressor (read: might as well get a whole new unit at $1200+). So far we've
been getting by with adding a window a/c in the kitchen (where the main a/c
intake is). But boy, on those 95+ degree days it just slowly gets hotter
inside!

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4723 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    28-Jun-90  19:37:11
Sb: #4679-#Hot Summer
Fm: JOHN R. WAINWRIGHT 72517,676
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Hey Guys!
   All that terrible heat just might allow THIS air conditioner repairman to
buy the 68xxx system of his choice this summer. For every cloud .......
(hehehehehe)
  JohnW

The{re are 2 Replies.

#: 4725 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    28-Jun-90  20:58:03
Sb: #4723-#Hot Summer
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: JOHN R. WAINWRIGHT 72517,676 (X)

AHA! You're an HVAC repairman?? Care to replace a compressor in return for an
MM/1? <heh-heh>

Almost kidding, and sweating it out - kev

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4754 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    29-Jun-90  21:46:53
Sb: #4725-Hot Summer
Fm: JOHN R. WAINWRIGHT 72517,676
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kinda long drive for a service call, but it is a tempting thought. I sometimes
feel a little like a vulture, making money from other peoples misfortune, but
the fact is, in summer my income goes up with the temperature.  One shop where
I worked several years ago had a poster of two starving vultures.  One of them
said - "Patience my a**, I'm gonna go KILL something!".
        Good luck with your air conditioner.
  JohnW

#: 4837 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    02-Jul-90  19:02:49
Sb: #4723-#Hot Summer
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: JOHN R. WAINWRIGHT 72517,676 (X)

John,

I gues you mean "OSK 68xxx computer of choice, eh? No need to waste time with
those MACS and ATARIS!

Paul

(subliminal suggestion: mm1, mm1, mm1, mm1)

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4845 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    02-Jul-90  20:50:47
Sb: #4837-#Hot Summer
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

Speaking of MM/1--one of the matters under discussion on the BITNET mailing
list is whose picture should come up (a la the three folks in front of the
Microware "fuzzy M" on the CoCo 3).  I suggested you, Kevin Darling, and Kevin
Pease, dressed as the Three Musketeers, with the caption "One for all, and all
for MM/1!".  What do you think? <grin>

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4847 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    03-Jul-90  01:19:22
Sb: #4845-Hot Summer
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

Oh. Wait! NOW I remember what a club member here suggested should come up on
the MM/1 on reset:

 DinoWars!! (OS-9 version of cuss)

<grin>

#: 4856 S14/misc/info/Soapbox
    03-Jul-90  22:32:01
Sb: #4845-Hot Summer
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

How about as Moe, Larry, and Curly?

Or as Chewbacca, Luke, and Han. You can pick whom you wish for each role.

Paul

grin



#: 4670 S9/Utilities
    26-Jun-90  22:21:45
Sb: #Copy
Fm: Paul Hanke 73467,403
To: Anyone

  Is there a disk file copy utility with wildcards?   -ph-


There are 3 Replies.

#: 4688 S9/Utilities
    27-Jun-90  14:50:06
Sb: #4670-Copy
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Paul Hanke 73467,403 (X)

Paul -

Carl Kreider's 'cp' is based on the Unix copy command, and should either be in
DL9 or the UGLIB DL (5)..

Pete

#: 4696 S9/Utilities
    27-Jun-90  19:30:37
Sb: #4670-Copy
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: Paul Hanke 73467,403 (X)

Hi Paul!

Contact D. P. Johnson.  He sells a utility pak which gives that kind of
capability and more.  His address
        D. P. Johnson
        7655 S.W. Cedarcrest St
        Portland, OR 97223
        503-244-8152

Ed

#: 4782 S9/Utilities
    30-Jun-90  17:30:37
Sb: #4670-Copy
Fm: Lee Veal 74726,1752
To: Paul Hanke 73467,403 (X)

There's a file called MCOPY.AR in DL10 that does wildcard copying.

Lee

#: 4684 S10/Tandy CoCo
    27-Jun-90  11:54:58
Sb: #4524-#Dungeon Depths Fix
Fm: Tom Napolitano 70215,1130
To: Floyd Resler 72500,2572 (X)

Floyd,
   thanks a lot.  I'm not too good at games, but they do provide a respite from
the usual edit-compile-test session.
   tom n

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4691 S10/Tandy CoCo
    27-Jun-90  15:55:04
Sb: #4684-Dungeon Depths Fix
Fm: Floyd Resler 72500,2572
To: Tom Napolitano 70215,1130 (X)

I know what you mean about the edit-compile-test sessions.  Thankfully, with
BASIC09, it's mainly just edit-test!

#: 4685 S1/General Interest
    27-Jun-90  13:49:58
Sb: #OS9
Fm: Robb Swanson 72567,1335
To: [F] All

I am a software engineer with a company in Halifax, Nova Scotia (up in Canada
for those of you who should know better, but don't) that is involved in the
development of a VMEbus based image and digital signal processing system. 
Unlike most DSP applications, this is commercial and not military, and can be
discussed in an open forum.

We are currently in the design process for a real-time version of a system that
we have developed to this point in DOS.  To operate at the speed we require,
the system will employ extremely high data rates (on the order of 10Mhz), and
use a pipe-lined architecture.  We expect that the final system will have 4-6
single board computers (680x0 based CPUs), an array processor (probably CSPI's
SuperCard), and a suite of image processing boards from Datacube.

We are in the process of analyzing real-time operating systems, and are
considering OS-9 as our target environment.  I would like to solicit comments
or suggestions from anyone who has used OS-9 for real-time VMEbus based
systems. I am especially interestee suitability of OS-9 for use in a
multiprocessor environment.

Questions such as :

- Will OS-9 consume too many resources in a system where RAM and MIPS are at
  at premium?

- How does OS-9 perform in a multi-processor environment?

- Do you suggestping on the target, or is using either a DOS or UNIX
  based host the better method?

- Are the development tools adequate, both in terms of performance and ease
  of use?

- Are there many OS-9 drivers for such things as array processors and other
  external devices?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.



There are 4 Replies.

#: 4692 S1/General Interest
    27-Jun-90  18:43:28
Sb: #4685-OS9
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Robb Swanson 72567,1335 (X)

You might wish to call Microware; they may be able to refer you to users with
similar applications.  It's interesting that you should mention Datacube; I
believe they use OS-9.

#: 4709 S1/General Interest
    28-Jun-90  01:14:18
Sb: #4685-OS9
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Robb Swanson 72567,1335 (X)

Hi Robb,

With luck, some of the VME developers around here will spot your message and
reply (I'm not one, altho I do a fair amount of driver writing on personal
machines). I assume you've talked to Microware already (515-224-1929) and
gotten some info from them... I'd also ask them for names of other developers
you could call for opinions and/or help. You can also stop by their CIS display
area ("go msc").

You might also talk to Mike Burgher (I believe) at Microware west coast
(408-980-0201)... I think he helped develop their DOS/Uni-Bridge environments,
and he'll give you a fair opinion on whether or not to develop on the target.
[If you have more than one prototype, many people do. Kinda keeps you in the
feel of things, and also helps you to notice any problems quicker]

OS-9 is pretty resource conservative... perhaps not quite as much from first
glance as some other systems, but then you usually have to write less extra
code to handle things OS9 already has, for example.

Never used OS9 in a multiprocessor setup, altho I've heard of machines that
did. No idea about array processor drivers.

Developers tell me the tools are quite adequate, altho perhaps not as fancy
from the viewer's standpoint (no blazing colors/borders like on DOS computers).
Function over beauty.

Oh. If you're researching and got some $$, you can stop by COMPLIB here on CIS
and search for articles/references with keywords such as "microware", "os-9",
"realtime", and "multiprocessing" to find more info on most OS's.

#: 4718 S1/General Interest
    28-Jun-90  09:38:41
Sb: #4685-OS9
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: Robb Swanson 72567,1335 (X)

Robb,
 I am on the trailing edge of developing a VME-based system using OS-9. We have
a Motorola MVME147-s (68030, 8mb) in slot1 and MVME333's (68010, 512kb) in
slots 3-20, all running OS-9. It is not "multiprocessor" in the sense that I
believe you want - each slave is a special block device (we had to do a custom
file manager) to the master (eg: /slot3, /slot4, etc) and vice-versa (eg:
/host).
 I believe you will find OS-9 to be as good as any other "Real-Time" O.S.
(psos, pdos, vrtx) in terms of performance on a target, where performance
measures the drain on processor bandwidth and memory usage by the kernel and
the size and speed of final binaries generated by the compiler. You can (as we
did when porting Unix message queues to OS-9) compile to assembler source and
then tweek that as needed. During development, however, OS-9 really shines over
all the rest because you can get a shell on your target and get a lot of
debugging help.
 I cannot tell how OS-9 will behave in *your* multi-processor environment. We
are happy with ours, but, as I said, it is not what you probably mean by
mulit-processor.
 I would strongly suggest using a Unix host for development. While OS-9 has all
the basics - shell, editor, etc - I just got lots of complaints from the other
developers about missing things - a good version of "vi", the shell they were
used to (csh, ksh, sh) with scripting, slow disk i/o (making for slow compile
times), no uucp (although TOP is supposed to fix theirs), etc.
 You will most likely be writing your own drivers for custom things. Microware
was very good about getting sample code to us for ours.
 Mark

#: 4734 S1/General Interest
    29-Jun-90  03:22:23
Sb: #4685-OS9
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Robb Swanson 72567,1335 (X)

Hey Robb, what company are you working for in Halifax.
Sound very interesting what you are doing

#: 4693 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    27-Jun-90  19:25:06
Sb: TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To:  76703,4230 (X)

L Hi Pete!

Thanks for your advice.  I going to follow your suggestion and use 'tar' and
'compress'.  But, I'm going to use the 'TOP' versions - I think they're
slightly different than UNIX (at least the options for 'tar' are different).
I'll also upload the TOP 'tar' and 'compress' utilities as an 'ar' file.

Ed /ex POST;Pete Lyall, 76703,4230;TOP Munich Release 2.0;12

#: 4694 S10/Tandy CoCo
    27-Jun-90  19:26:05
Sb: Sculptor Tutorial
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To:  72527,1354 (X)

L Hi Al:

I assume your reference to 'multiple to one relationships' is really how to use
cross-reference files.  In both dl2 and dl3 are some demonstration programs
some of which will show you how to use cross-reference files.  Of special
interest is the one from Brad Masters in Australia - you'll find that one in
dl3.

In reality, cross-reference files are trivial to implement in Sculptor. The
real problem is determining exactly what is wanted.  Before you start writing
code, determine what info is going to be needed for output and what input data
is available.  Then you can start playing with file structures and
relationships.  This phase usually takes lots of time (and paper and pencil). 
Done properly and thoroughly, this process often ends up almost writing the
code itself.  (NOTE - this is good programming practice no matter what language
you're using.)

Ed /ex POST;Al Fleagle 72527,1354;Sculptor Tutorial;10



#: 4697 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    27-Jun-90  19:47:31
Sb: TOP Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: sysop (X)

Hi Wayne!

I just uploaded 'tar.ar'.  This contains the utilities 'tar' and 'compress'
which will be necessary to 'burst' the TOP files.  It's in dl12.

Ed

#: 4698 S10/Tandy CoCo
    27-Jun-90  20:15:15
Sb: #"C" compiler
Fm: Rodney Harper 75130,1321
To: All

I would relly like to find the Tandy "C" compiler for the COCO 3, OS9 level 2.

If you have it, or can direct me to a supplier, I would be most appreciative.

>>Rod<<

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4702 S10/Tandy CoCo
    27-Jun-90  21:51:41
Sb: #4698-"C" compiler
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: Rodney Harper 75130,1321 (X)

Try Tandy! You local Radio Shack can special order the C compiler for you, or
if you have a credit card, you can call a toll free number and order it
yourself. It is available from the "Express Order Software Buyer's Guide".
Stock number 26-3038 CMC. Toll free number is 1-800-321-3133. Base price is
$99.95.

Zack

#: 4699 S4/MIDI and Music
    27-Jun-90  20:35:58
Sb: #4577-#MORE MUSIC
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

For the automatic screen printing, crescendo, and articulation, we're shooting
for this October.  Articulation is working now. Then there's the Lyra
trtanslator, and transposing instrument clefs. Recording hand play is in the
works, but no time frame for that yet.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4701 S4/MIDI and Music
    27-Jun-90  20:55:29
Sb: #4699-#MORE MUSIC
Fm: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111 (X)

Thank Let me know when anything happends! OK?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4839 S4/MIDI and Music
    02-Jul-90  19:56:10
Sb: #4701-MORE MUSIC
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

OK.  Try to bug me around September to remind me.

#: 4710 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    28-Jun-90  03:49:40
Sb: #TOP-Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: [F] Wayne Day 76703,376 (X)

Hi Wayne!

Just uploaded the first TOP disc to dl12.  Question - I tried to name it
top1.t.z.  That name was rejected.  I had to use top1.tz.  Can you change it to
top1.t.z?  That follows the convention for this type of file (at least as used
by TOP).

Ed

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4721 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    28-Jun-90  17:59:41
Sb: #4710-TOP-Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Wayne Day 76703,376
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Nope... that'd be an illegal filename on the DECs.

Six alphanumeric characters, followed by one delimiter, and then up to three
letters for the extension, is all that the system allows.

Wayne

#: 4714 S7/Telecommunications
    28-Jun-90  05:44:38
Sb: #UUCP Port
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Dwight McKay, 75776,1521 (X)

Dwight,

Thanks for your reply concerning testing the UUCP port.  Unfortunately, this
port is for OS9/6809.  I don't have an OSK machine yet so the OSK port will be
coming out a little later.

Mark

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4756 S7/Telecommunications
    29-Jun-90  22:39:13
Sb: #4714-#UUCP Port
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

I can do that for ya - got an ST I'm using for development that needs something
to do...

StG

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4765 S7/Telecommunications
    30-Jun-90  05:14:35
Sb: #4756-UUCP Port
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335 (X)

Scott,

I will be doing OSK development soon myself so I'd like to port UUCP to OSK. I
have some more I want to add for that environment.

Mark

#: 4965 S7/Telecommunications
    07-Jul-90  20:51:56
Sb: #4714-UUCP Port
Fm: Dwight D. McKay 75776,1521
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Okdokey.  Let me know when you are interested in an OSK port, maybe I can help
you then...

Good luck with the 6809 port!

--ddm

#: 4715 S10/Tandy CoCo
    28-Jun-90  05:48:32
Sb: #Shell+ Path variable
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Ken, 71750,551 (X)

Ken,

I'm afraid that you can't set a path in the startup file and have it stay
current when you exit it.  That path is only good for the shell that it was
created in, which is the shell running the startup file.  I do understand that
Ron Lammardo is working on another version of Shell+ that fixes this little
problem.

Mark

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4757 S10/Tandy CoCo
    29-Jun-90  22:43:14
Sb: #4715-#Shell+ Path variable
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

If one fixes that "problem", doesn't that create incompatibility with OSK?

I don't see it as a problem so much.  There are many ways of getting around it.
For example, I have a program that goes in the .login script (does shell+ have
this?) that sets the TERM environment variable, after asking the user what he
wants.  It works because shell runs the .login before taking input from the
user.  Unfortunately, the program only works when you first log in.. if you
switch terminals, you can't run the program from the command line.  So you log
out...

StG

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4766 S10/Tandy CoCo
    30-Jun-90  05:14:42
Sb: #4757-#Shell+ Path variable
Fm: Mark Griffith 76070,41
To: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335 (X)

Scott,

By setting a TERM environment do you mean setting writing a line in some sort
of environment file?  Sure, you can do it that way.

The problem with Shell+ is not the shell really, but OS9 itself.  Same problem
exists in UNIX also, if you want to call it a problem.  Setting a directory
path is only current as long as that shell is running.  Setting the shell's
PATH variable in the startup file works fine as long as that shell is running. 
When it goes away, so does all the parameters for that specific shell.

UNIX environment variables as well as with OSK are not the same....they stay
around.  A pity that OS9/6809 does not have the same thing.

Mark

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4887 S10/Tandy CoCo
    05-Jul-90  06:32:44
Sb: #4766-Shell+ Path variable
Fm: Scott t. Griepentrog 72427,335
To: Mark Griffith 76070,41 (X)

Yes, I know.  Unix has separate global vars and local/passed vars.  My point
however was that as OSK does not have globals, adding such to OS9 Shell+ would
be a mistake (in my opinion) as it would open up incompatibilities.

StG

#: 4717 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    28-Jun-90  08:02:03
Sb: #PT68 & Modem
Fm: Jim Chapman 72557,1120
To: Scott Howell 70270,641 (X)

Scott;

I have been following the correspondence as you tried to get your modem working
with the PT68. I have not yet been as successful. Could you give me the
connections you finally ended up with.

I am trying to use the program TUBE that I downloaded from the OSK library but
I am not even sure that works.

Thanks,

Jim Chapman 72557,1120 sb:

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4732 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  03:00:34
Sb: #4717-PT68 & Modem
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Jim Chapman 72557,1120 (X)

Yes I can sympathize with you!!!!! What I did was to swap pins 8 and 20 in the
RS232 side provided that you have a jumper from pin 1 of the board connector
(J11,J12,J21,J22) to pin 8 of the RS 232 connector. I had to get these jumpers
from Fred, but they are just simple wires with prongs for connecting them into
the sockets. Here is a diagram of the connections.

        Jumper                           RS232
       6 *-----------------------------* 2
       5 *-----------------------------* 3
       3 *-----------------------------* 7
       4 *-----------------------------* 8
       1 *-----------------------------* 20
        You may want to check out STERM and Kermit communication programs in
DL9 or DL12. They are archived so you will need 'AR68.BIN' found in DL9 to
burst them.

        What kind of PT68K board do you have: PT68K-1 PT68K-2 or the new four
megabyte board PT68K-4.

#: 4724 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    28-Jun-90  20:06:00
Sb: #vi-like editors
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Mark Wuest 74030,332 (X)

Speaking of a good version of "vi"...you know, of course, that someone ported
"stevie" to OS-9/68K.  Just today I saw a message on comp.os.os9 from someone
who says he has a *very* good vi-like editor, called "elvis", that he wants to
get ported to OS-9/68K, and was seeking volunteers.  I believe the intent is
for the result to be freely-copyable, though one should probably talk to the
original poster about that.  So...any volunteers out there?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4741 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    29-Jun-90  09:09:41
Sb: #4724-#vi-like editors
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

I can volunteer to do the port - I had to fix a few bugs in the OSK port of
stevie (bad pointers that non-memory protected systems did not notice). The
problem with stevie port *I* had was that they used their own termcap library
which did not handle fill characters properly. It worked fine with terminals
that had no fill charcters.
 Mark

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4772 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    30-Jun-90  13:32:03
Sb: #4741-#vi-like editors
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: Mark Wuest 74030,332 (X)

Hi Mark!

Re your reference to 'fill' characters {ssume your referring to the padding
necessary for delays for some terminals.  Question,  how do you know when you
need padding and how do you determine how much padding?

Ed

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4829 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    02-Jul-90  09:39:07
Sb: #4772-vi-like editors
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Ed,
 You look in the manual for the terminal in question. I have done this only
once. Your best bet is to steal a termcap entry from a Unix machine for the
terminal you want. Termcap entries that work will have the padding info in them
already and Microware's termcap library handles them automatically.
 I can visibly perceive the faster screen fill using uMacs on two of the
terminals at work (AT&T 5410 and 5425). If you don't do padding, the terminals
want to do flow control, which is not good if your editor uses ^Q and ^S!!
 Mark

#: 4838 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    02-Jul-90  19:18:57
Sb: #4741-vi-like editors
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Mark Wuest 74030,332 (X)

Go for it, Mark! If you do it, and it works good, I'll be glad to stick a flyer
about its availability on the nets with each MM/1! I find OSK umacs quite
usable, and now with a vi, we should be getting a little closer to being The
Lean, Mean, EveryPerson's UNIX.

Paul

#: 4746 S1/General Interest
    29-Jun-90  17:03:01
Sb: #Help for Paralyzed
Fm: ALLEN COX 70745,1044
To: All

Can anyone give me some advice on where to look for software and hardware to
help my paralyzed cousin?  He's slowly recovering from Legionaire's Disease,
and can move his mouth OK, but he can't talk.  Thanks!

There are 4 Replies.

#: 4750 S1/General Interest
    29-Jun-90  20:05:36
Sb: #4746-#Help for Paralyzed
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: ALLEN COX 70745,1044 (X)

There's been recent traffic on the BITNET CoCo mailing list, I think, asking
about puff-and-sip interfaces; there's also a FIDO echomail conference on
issues concerning the disabled.  I'd bet there's a CIS SIG covering this ground
as well, but I haven't ever had the need to chase it down; the FIND command
would probably serve here.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4891 S1/General Interest
    05-Jul-90  08:02:27
Sb: #4750-Help for Paralyzed
Fm: ALLEN COX 70745,1044
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

Thanks, James.  That's exactly what I was looking for--some leads.  I'll check
'em out.

#: 4753 S1/General Interest
    29-Jun-90  21:32:15
Sb: #4746-#Help for Paralyzed
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: ALLEN COX 70745,1044 (X)

Allen - The Circuit Cellar Ink magazine (Steve Ciarcia of BYTE fame) has noted
that the most interest shown has been in handicapped applications for micros.
If you get that magazine at a local Walden's, you might write or call their
BBS, too.

Some old Rainbows had hardware/software also. I'll try to find them. Can your
cousin move his head, also?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4892 S1/General Interest
    05-Jul-90  08:04:59
Sb: #4753-Help for Paralyzed
Fm: ALLEN COX 70745,1044
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Thanks, Kev.  Not sure on head movement, but will find out & get back. I'll
grab Circuit Cellar Ink (interesting!  I never heard of it...)

#: 4762 S1/General Interest
    30-Jun-90  01:56:35
Sb: #4746-#Help for Paralyzed
Fm: Donald R. Spoon 76417,1302
To: ALLEN COX 70745,1044 (X)

Allen,
     I am sending this note to give you a starting point.  Look in the July
1990 issue of OMNI magazine on page 22.  There is an article entitled "Power
Tools" that describes an eye controlled computer program called ERICA designed
by a biomedical engineer called Thomas Hutchinson at the University of West
Virginia.  It sounds very much like what you are looking for.  I also recall
reading an article about a guy here in Dayton, OH who is into working computer
interfaces for paralyzed victims.  I think he is working with Wright State
University, but am not sure.  It would take a bit of tracking for me, and
unfortunately, I will be out of town next week.  If the U. W. Va. lead doesn't
pan out, then drop me a note and I will be happy to do some snooping around
here.  Incidently, I am a M.D. working in a USAF Medical Research lab.  We do a
small amount of this sort of stuff for Air Force personnel, but do not have
anything to offer of a general nature.  Our work is usually highly specific to
the individual, and very limited in its ability to be generalized.  Also
because of leagalities that I don't pretend to understand, it is limited to AF
personnel on a case by case basis.  Hope this helps and good luck!!
 Don Spoon

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4893 S1/General Interest
    05-Jul-90  08:08:09
Sb: #4762-Help for Paralyzed
Fm: ALLEN COX 70745,1044
To: Donald R. Spoon 76417,1302 (X)

Thanks a heap, Donald.  I'll check out your leads and get back to you. It would
be good to catch up with things in the USAF for an ex-C141 jockey! You guys are
great!

#: 4796 S1/General Interest
    01-Jul-90  06:26:59
Sb: #4746-#Help for Paralyzed
Fm: MOTD Editor..Bill Brady 70126,267
To: ALLEN COX 70745,1044 (X)

'Lo Allen. Try VME (Volunteers in Medical Engineering). They are in Baltimore
MD. I can get you a phone number... but they are in the book.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4894 S1/General Interest
    05-Jul-90  08:11:06
Sb: #4796-Help for Paralyzed
Fm: ALLEN COX 70745,1044
To: MOTD Editor..Bill Brady 70126,267 (X)

Hi, Bill!  And thanks to ALL of you for your tremendous input.  I'll check out
all of these leads, get them to my cousin's mom, and let you know the outcome.
I knew a lot of these things existed, but didn't know where to find them. Hope
to catch up with you guys again soon!

#: 4775 S6/Applications
    30-Jun-90  13:48:46
Sb: Two RS232's
Fm: Richard Ries 76057,3534
To:  76370,1366 (X)

Everett-
  I don't know if anyone repl'd to yr. msg. #4480 (6/18/90) re using two RS232
paks. You'll run into trouble because both paks will have the same address
built into their hardware. Unless you are REALLY good at hacking and jumpering,
and have the schematics, you may be better off contacting Ken-Ton Elec. ; (187
Green Acres Rd. Tonawanda, NY 14150 718-837-9168) for their Dual Comm Pack for
$89. Rich

#: 4776 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  13:53:07
Sb: #Woe is 9
Fm: Richard Ries 76057,3534
To: Kevin Darling

Kev-
 I just got back from my honeymoon and see all types of dreadful things coming
from the UG newsletter. To wit, Microware has discontinued OS9 Personell, and
the Coco has a shaky future. (The second is nothing new.) Could you let us
Coco-ers in on what the OS9 Professional is like? How does it compare with LI
&& LII ? (Specifically does it have windowing like LII ?) Thanks a lot, Rich
Ries

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4788 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  21:48:25
Sb: #4776-Woe is 9
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Richard Ries 76057,3534 (X)

Rich - Congrats on your marriage!

Actually, things are looking pretty good. Microware has taken an increased
interest in seeing OS-9 used on personal computers, and we have neat hardware
upgrade paths becoming available soon.

I think MW discontinued Personal OS9 simply because buying it with Basic was
cheaper than buying Basic by itself. Marketing musta freaked out <grin>. But
the OS-9 version for the new machines includes the C compiler and Basic, which
is good news.

The windowing I'm working on right now. Started from scratch only in March, so
it's still got a ways to go; and I'm sure we'll see additions posted here as
time goes by. But I think you'll like it.

I'm sure others can give their own impressions of OSK, but in general the main
feeling is "fast" and "lots of room" <grin>. For example, I just os9gen'd a 57K
bootfile onto a floppy disk, from a hard disk modules dir and bootlist, in
under 15 seconds. A circles gfx demo which takes 30 seconds on a CoCo takes
under 5 seconds on the MM/1. Etc.

You'll feel right at home, too, with the commands... altho they have more
options. Like I use Dsave a lot with:
   dsave -er /d0/backup -d=900627

which means copy the current dir, Execute the generated commands, and Rewrite
any files with the same name, to the /d0/backup directory. And only do this on
files with dates equal or greater than June 27, 1990.

In other words... you'll be excited, I promise. kev

#: 4779 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  16:06:31
Sb: #IMPORTANT- MM/1
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Kevin Darling

Please send me some information on the MM/1 computer. The company I work for is
starting a special project which I cannot reveal at this time involving the use
of a
 low-cost 68000 computer. The market that we are aiming at really needs, and
wants, these devices

        To give you an example they tried to use an Amiga for this system but
found it to be TOO EXPENSIVE for the market that wants this device.

        Please send me information like technical specs, graphics capabilities,
costs, and the like. SEND TO:   SCOTT HOWELL
        107 Winchester Tr.
                Smyrna, Ga 30080.

I will forward it to the necessary people in charge.
                                        thanks/

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4781 S15/Hot Topics
    30-Jun-90  17:13:11
Sb: #4779-IMPORTANT- MM/1
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Hi Scott - take a look in Libary 15, and download the news releases... in those
will also be the makers, whom you can contact for more info if you need it
(their number/address is in there).

Good luck with the project! Can you say anything about it? - kev

#: 4783 S10/Tandy CoCo
    30-Jun-90  17:55:16
Sb: #gfx2 error 195
Fm: PHIL SCHERER 71211,2545
To: ALL

I recently downloaded the new gfx2 by Kevin Darling and I typed in the program
<MVFINANCE> <much typing> from April 1990 Rainbow. When I run it I get a 195 on
the line which follows line 6000. It reads: RUN gfx2("WNset",WT_DBox,Finwin).
I've checked for typo's and I cant figure why I get the error. I'm not all that
familiar with the new gfx2 commands which adds to my problems. HELP!!

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4789 S10/Tandy CoCo
    30-Jun-90  21:56:41
Sb: #4783-#gfx2 error 195
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: PHIL SCHERER 71211,2545 (X)

Hmmm. I think Dale was gonna upload that program when he got a chance.

Illegal window definition, eh? (err 195). Is WT_DBox dim'd and set up at the
beginning? Has Finwin been set up also? An earlier version I have here seems to
work okay. I'll mail it to you and you can check for diffs. - kev

PS: if you want?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4807 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  15:20:11
Sb: #4789-#gfx2 error 195
Fm: PHIL SCHERER 71211,2545
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

THAT'SIT!!!!!!! Hey thanks a bunch Kev there was an error in the dim
statement--Thanks also for the new GFX2.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4817 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  23:31:15
Sb: #4807-gfx2 error 195
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: PHIL SCHERER 71211,2545 (X)

Great! Glad it was an easy fix!

#: 4784 S10/Tandy CoCo
    30-Jun-90  20:40:23
Sb: #RSDOS.AR
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Sysop (X)

I can't find "RSDOS.AR" in library 10. I know its in there somewhere. Maybe Im
using the wrong extension, but it won't allow me to use wild cards. Does anyone
know where it went to Thanks, Denise

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4785 S10/Tandy CoCo
    30-Jun-90  20:48:43
Sb: #4784-RSDOS.AR
Fm: Mike Ward 76703,2013
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Check DL9, it's in there alive and well.

#: 4797 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  06:47:19
Sb: #4784-#RSDOS.AR
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Denise,
  Oops! I guess I'm the culprit! When RSDOS.AR was originally uploaded, it had
been in LIB 10, and it was moved over to LIB 9. Sorry to make you go looking in
the wrong area.     Dan

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4800 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  12:35:12
Sb: #4797-RSDOS.AR
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

Thanks, Ill give it a try again. I believe I checked in lib9 just to be sure
thinking there was a mixup in librarys. I'll go for it again and see what
happens. Thanks again, Denise

#: 4787 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    30-Jun-90  21:46:36
Sb: #PT68 & Modem
Fm: Jim Chapman 72557,1120
To: Scott Howell 70270,641 (X)

Thanks for the reply. I have a PT68k-2 with a 40 meg hard disc and a 3.5
floppy. I switched pins 8 and 20 but no luck. The modem cable is straight
through except pins 2 and 3 are reversed at one end. The modem only has pins
2,3,5,6,7,8 connected so I also connected pins 8 and 20 but still no luck.

You mentioned using STERM or Kermit. I can't download anything to the PT68
until the modem works with it. I downloaded TUBE to a PC at work and keyed it
into thye PT68. I suggested to Fred that he include Kermit with the OS9 discs
but he wasn't interested. I had hoped to get it from the User Group but I have
had no response from them.

For a while I wondered if anyone else was trying to use OS9 with the PT68. I
have had a lot of trouble with it. Good to hear from you.

Jim Chapman, Toronto

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4792 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    01-Jul-90  01:58:33
Sb: #4787-#PT68 & Modem
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Jim Chapman 72557,1120 (X)

Hey I can mail you Kermit and Sterm if you have a 5.25 HD FD. You said you have
had a lot of trouble with OS9 on the PT68k. I am interested in what kind of
trouble you are having, mayme we can both work these problems out!
                        Thanks,
                        Scott Howell

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4795 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    01-Jul-90  05:39:04
Sb: #4792-#PT68 & Modem
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641 (X)

Hi Scott:

Re your response to Jim Chapman

If Jim has an older K2 machine, the drivers for the 68681 won't support a modem
- he'll need the drivers I sent you (from Simmy).

I think Jim said he had a 3 1/2" drive - if you want, I can send him the stuff.

My k4 is up and running with 4 Megs.  Nice doing a single drive backup with
-b=800!

Ed

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4834 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    02-Jul-90  17:54:27
Sb: #4795-PT68 & Modem
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Sounds great!! Wow 4 megs. I will be upgrading mine slowly, like 1 meg at a
time.

#: 4798 S1/General Interest
    01-Jul-90  11:26:28
Sb: #MASTERING THE SAT PATCH?
Fm: - Visitor 72167,20
To: ALL

HOW CAN THE COCO LEVEL 1 "MASTERING THE SAT" OS-9 PROGRAM BE USED ON THE COCO 3
WITH LEVEL 2 OS-9? IS THERE A PATCH TO MAKE IT WORK WITH THE COOC 3? ANY HELP
WILL BE APPRECIATED.
             DONALD A. TUROWSKI
             72167,20

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4802 S1/General Interest
    01-Jul-90  14:05:43
Sb: #4798-MASTERING THE SAT PATCH?
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: - Visitor 72167,20

Hi Don, go ahead and Join the forum, and welcome aboard.

Is that SAT program one of Tandy's?  Does it use graphics or just a 32x16 text
screen?

best - kev

#: 4827 S1/General Interest
    02-Jul-90  07:47:11
Sb: #4798-MASTERING THE SAT PATCH?
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: - Visitor 72167,20

Don,

Seems to me, SAT is on an Os9 bootable disk with a version of the operating
system that is incompatable with the CoCo 3.

My first attempts would be to copy all the SAT specific files over to a Level
II disk and give that a go.

Alternately you could try booting a Level II system. Swap out the system disk
for the SAT disk and hit RESET _once_ and see if it won't boot up.

Let us know what happenss.

Steve

#: 4803 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  14:10:50
Sb: #os9-Rsdos
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Dan Robbins

Help, I'm getting into a can of worms I think. I got the file "rsdos.ar"
unarced and over to a os9 disk with the attr's set. I then read the doc and it
says that I have to use the "cc3disk.ar" file to patch my cc3disk module. I
then downloaded the cc3disk.ar file and I learn that I can't use it until I use
the "IPatch" utility. Then I have to build up a new os9boot file using os9gen.
That is getting a little heavy for a "learning" os9 user. I have built up a
boot with the Config utility. It takes a long while to use that one. I know it
takes a lot less to use os9gen but I don't know what tools and files to include
when building a new boot file up with that tool. All I really want to do is
move a file from os9 to RSDOS. Is there a os9 terminal program that uses the
bit banger? If so, I could get rid of all this gar-bage of switching between
os9 and RSDOS based terminal pkg. Denise

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4812 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  21:26:29
Sb: #4803-#os9-Rsdos
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Denise,
  Well, there was at one time a terminal program (300 baud) that worked with
the bit-banger under Level 1 OS9, but it meant a special cable, etc. to go with
the terminal program, and I don't think it is even being sold anymore. I
believe you're still gonna have to go the IPatch route to get the files between
one to the other. Solly!
  Dan

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4835 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  18:32:22
Sb: #4812-os9-Rsdos
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

Thanks Dan, I just thought of a program I bought a year ago called Burke and
Burke RSB.  It allows disk basic under os9. It sounds kind of silly to run
basic under os9 but thats what I was familar with and got me started in os9. I
used the Skitzo tool and created a split personality disk, os9 first 17 tracks
and dos the last 17. I then used the tool called Hcopy, which copies between
the split disk, and guess what, bingo its there where I wanted it to be The
only thing was I had to use standard os9, I have mine customized to use 40 trk
double sided drives and the RSB copy tools would only work with standard 35
track format. So I got out my old level 2 original disk. Thanks again for all
the help anyway, Huggs, Denise

#: 4806 S1/General Interest
    01-Jul-90  14:39:36
Sb: #Happy Birthday!
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Kevin Darling 76703,4227 (X)

Happy Birthday, Kevin! Is it 37 or 73? (grin).

Wendell

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4816 S1/General Interest
    01-Jul-90  23:27:39
Sb: #4806-Happy Birthday!
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)

37, ya bum <grin>.  The forum is growing older, ain't it?!   thx - kev

#: 4809 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  20:19:09
Sb: #os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: All

Is there any info on how a os9 disk is formatted? I have a coco 3 512K with 2,
5.25 drives. I am familar with the format under RSDOS, such as where the
granule table is located and how to trace a file from the directory. How do you
trace a file under os9? Lets say your disk crashed and you want to try and
recover a file. I have an os9 disk zap tool, but don't really understand the
format, because the tutoral with the tool dosen't go into detail on how a file
is allocated. Thanks, Denise

There are 3 Replies.

#: 4811 S10/Tandy CoCo
    01-Jul-90  21:15:20
Sb: #4809-os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Denise -

Basically the disk is broken up into the following areas:

  o - LSN0 (logical sector # 0)

  o - storage bitmap

  o - File descriptor sectors

  o - Directories and files

The LSN0 contains all the crucial info about the disk (heads, cylinders,
allocation strategy, etc.). It is the 1st sector on the media. It is followed
by the bitmap. The bitmap is a series of sectors full of bytes that represent
what part of the disk is used, and what part is free. Typically, a bit in the
bitmap = 1 sector on the disk (although clustersize may be set to be greater
than 1 sector, and then each bit represents 1 cluster). The size of the bitmap
is recorded in the LSN0 sector. The File descriptor sectors are the map for
each file or directory. They contain information on date of creation, owner,
size, attributes, etc. in the 1st 16 bytes. The other 240 bytes of the sector
are 48 5-byte records of the form:

   LSN(3) #ofSectors(2)

Indicating where the file is mapped on the disk. The 1st 3 bytes show the
starting logical sector number of the chunk, and the next two show how many
sectors are in that chunk. The FD sector for the root directory is specified by
LSN # in the LSN0 sector. From there, you can find the root directory, and all
files and directories below it. All directory entries are of the form:

  Name(29) LSN(3)

Where name is up to 29 bytes long (last character has the high bit set), and
then 3 bytes tat indicate the LSN of the FD sector for that file.

You can get more information by reading about the RBF manager in the technical
reference manual. Hope that was enough to get you started.

Pete

#: 4823 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  06:23:44
Sb: #4809-#os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

The best place to look is in the OS-9 Technical Manual, in the section on RBF. 
That shows the layout of directories, and the contents of file descriptor
sectors and LSN 0, which is what you need to know to unravel a scrambled disk.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4836 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  18:33:20
Sb: #4823-#os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

Where can a person order the manual?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4844 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  20:48:46
Sb: #4836-#os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

The manual comes with OS-9.  Do you not have a copy?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4932 S10/Tandy CoCo
    06-Jul-90  18:39:26
Sb: #4844-#os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

I have not read a lot of the manual since it goes into great detail on a lot of
stuff I don't understand yet. I thought they were refering to the technical
manual like the coco3 has for the internal workings. I will have to look in the
manual I got and read about the disk format. I didn't know it was in there.
Thanks, Denise

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4933 S10/Tandy CoCo
    06-Jul-90  20:11:18
Sb: #4932-#os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Ahhhh.  *That* technical manual.  Sorry; I should have been clearer. I meant
the OS-9 Technical Manual.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4988 S10/Tandy CoCo
    08-Jul-90  12:20:28
Sb: #4933-#os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

To make things clear, are we talking the manual you get with the 2 os9 disks
when youn purchase os9? I looked in the technical chapter and did find some
material on how a disk is sectored and formatted. Denise

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4991 S10/Tandy CoCo
    08-Jul-90  13:45:42
Sb: #4988-os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

That's the very manual I mean.  In particular, Chapter 5 of the OS-9 Technical
Manual that comes with CoCo OS-9/6809 Level Two.

#: 4833 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  16:32:19
Sb: #4809-os9 Disk Zapp
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274 (X)

Check out Chap. 5 in the OS9 Tech Ref. It's all there.

Zack

#: 4810 S6/Applications
    01-Jul-90  20:46:47
Sb: #Speller
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

Bob,

I downloaded your speeded-up version of the Users' Group spelling program and
noted significant improvement with the Dict lookup program - often 600 percent
faster than the original program. However, I haven't found any improvement with
the Spell program. In fact, the new Spell occasionally runs significantly
slower than the older version, especially when the text in question has words
that appear in the Auxdict file. Is this to be expected? Am I doing something
wrong?

Wendell



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4883 S6/Applications
    05-Jul-90  01:14:26
Sb: #4810-#Speller
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)


Wendell,

I'm not sure what you are doing, but I suspect that something IS wrong. Neither
the new or old version uses an "Auxdict file". Are you confusing this with
another program (maybe T/S Spell?). Or do I have an old version which I spent
all my time rewriting?

PS. Mark Griffith tried it and reports the speedup. Mark: did you try both Dict
and Spell? \ex post

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4886 S6/Applications
    05-Jul-90  03:41:05
Sb: #4883-#Speller
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

Bob,

I checked my copy of Spell - it contains 10,185 bytes and uses three files in
the /DD/MISC directory: dictionary, dict.index and auxdict (the same dictionary
and dict.index files I use with your Dict lookup program - I linked them to the
/DD/SYS/SPELL directory).

When Spell reads a file it first prints out: Reading file, Checking common
dictionary (then gives the number of matches), Checking user's dictionary
(number of matches), Checking master dictionary (and a final number of
matches).

Your version of the Dict program was SO much faster than the original (6 times
as fast) I wondered why the Spell program was not equally accelerated.

Wendell




There is 1 Reply.

#: 4945 S6/Applications
    07-Jul-90  01:30:56
Sb: #4886-Speller
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605 (X)

Wendell,

Seems like you have a later version of spell than I do. If you have the sources
for it could you mail me a copy?

#: 4815 S4/MIDI and Music
    01-Jul-90  22:52:34
Sb: #midi help
Fm: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366
To:  76703,4230 (X)

Can you somehow make a program that I can play my keyboard and record it in my
computer?

Not sampleing But making the out of the midi keyboard into the coco.



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4830 S4/MIDI and Music
    02-Jul-90  12:26:27
Sb: #4815-#midi help
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

Everett -

What you're describing is a SEQUENCER program. Lester Hands has one called CM3
that's about all there is for the coco market. Sequencing is tough to do in
multitasking systems because the music must be acurately timestamped as to when
notes arrive, and must correspondingly be played back without undue delay.

Anyway, talk to Lester.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4841 S4/MIDI and Music
    02-Jul-90  20:03:09
Sb: #4830-#midi help
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Pete & Everett -- I am working (on the side) on a MIDI recording program under
OS9, but can't say when or how well it will work. I do know that the technique
does not "mess" with anything in the system, tho you shouldn't have other tasks
running in the background except in I/O wait state. --mike k

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4848 S4/MIDI and Music
    03-Jul-90  01:21:00
Sb: #4841-#midi help
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111 (X)

Mike : what kind of timestamp or other data would you wish in a MIDI driver,
btw? In other words, how would you arrange to get/play data?

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5047 S4/MIDI and Music
    10-Jul-90  20:12:45
Sb: #4848-midi help
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Well, each received event should have the time of its reception included. An
event may be 1 to 3 bytes, tho it may not be the driver's job to parse that
out.  There are various ways to cut down on the extra data of time stamps --
like using only the low 8 bits, and throwing in special byte whenever the time
carries over.

For play, you should be able to give a timestamp followed by a whole bunch of
MIDI data bytes; when the actual time becomes equal to that timestamp, all
those bytes get blasted out as fast as possible.  THis allows buffering and
lets the play program get ahead of the job, so as to have a reserve of real
time to fall back on when things get tuff.

There are some pretty simple ways to do things in both directions. I think the
driver per se should do it simply, with more efficient encodings handled by the
application.  I'll have to think about this some more. Keep bugging me.  Best
to handle this via my Bitnet address. Thanks for asking, mike k

#: 5051 S4/MIDI and Music
    10-Jul-90  20:22:20
Sb: #4848-#midi help
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kev, want to add that time resolution of 10 ms (or 1/100 sec) is probably good
enough.  5 ms or even less might be better, but I hear 10 ms is waht best suits
the MM/1. Umuise3 on the Coco3 gets by on 16.7 ms, but sxome folks can notice
it, or so they say.  Actually it's when recording hand play that you want the
most resolution -- playback you can fudge a lot better.  --mike k

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5054 S4/MIDI and Music
    10-Jul-90  21:28:10
Sb: #5051-midi help
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111

Okay... I think Jon Cluts once told me that 1/96th second was good for MIDI.
That sound about right?

#: 5085 S4/MIDI and Music
    11-Jul-90  16:31:02
Sb: #5051-midi help
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111

Maximum data rate is 31200 bps, or 3120 bytes/sec. That equates to a resolution
at highest density of .00032 sec (320 usec). Assuming a note on/off event is
your prime concern, they typically float around in 3 byte packages [note on &
ch # | note # | velocity], that would add up to just under 1 millisecond. Also,
if several note-on's were sent as a stream, a 'running status' in the MIDI spec
allows for only one NOTE-ON/CH# byte, followed by any number of two byte tuples
of NOTE#|VELOCITY. Theoretical worst case for resolution on the timer there
would be 640 usec or so.

Pete

#: 4819 S1/General Interest
    02-Jul-90  00:08:29
Sb: #Computer Show Ideas
Fm: JOHN TEAGUE 75715,1670
To: ALL

  The Dayton Area Color Computer User Group (DACCUG) is participating in
ComputerFest which is held in Dayton on August 25 and 26. It's very well
attended (thousands) and although we are vastly outnumbered by Amigas and
Ataris and Apples and MESSY DOS machines, our little band of rebels and misfits
carries on and this will be our fourth or fifth year of paricipation.
  Give me some ideas for demo's or whatever would show off the power and ease
of our favorite operating system.
  If any of you will be in or around Dayton, Ohio on either of those dates,
it's a must see.  Almost any local can direct you to Hara Arena.  So come by
the booth and say hello.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4853 S1/General Interest
    03-Jul-90  20:24:04
Sb: #4819-#Computer Show Ideas
Fm: Donald R. Spoon 76417,1302
To: JOHN TEAGUE 75715,1670 (X)

John,
    How 'bout pressuring Paul Ward to bring out a MM/1 for a demo??  Maybe get
Kev up here.  I would like to see both.  Can't believe that ANYONE is 37 years
old.  BTW, I work out at Wright - Patterson.  Thanks for the tip. I am new to
the area, and I'll sure make it out there if I am in town.  Oh, another
thought----if the MM/1 is here shouldn't the TOMCAT be here also?? I think
these would make the other "types" sit up and notice at least in this area.
 Don Spoon

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4854 S1/General Interest
    03-Jul-90  20:40:06
Sb: #4853-Computer Show Ideas
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Donald R. Spoon 76417,1302 (X)

I can believe someone is 37.  (Heck, I'm 34.)  Actually, the thing to do for
those who don't like to contemplate their age is to write it in hexadecimal.
Then, for example, I'd be 22.  (A-F is hard to get past people, admittedly. :-)

#: 4858 S1/General Interest
    03-Jul-90  22:37:23
Sb: #4853-#Computer Show Ideas
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Donald R. Spoon 76417,1302 (X)

Don,

So you're in Ohio, eh? You know, I might just take you up on your offer to show
an Mm/1 up there. One of the software companies that we're FINALLY closing a
deal with is located near Cleveland. Not exactly close to Wright Pat, but hey!

Give me a call at 202 232 429:30 - 5:30 EST.

Paul



There are 2 Replies.

#: 4859 S1/General Interest
    03-Jul-90  23:28:53
Sb: #4858-Computer Show Ideas
Fm: Donald R. Spoon 76417,1302
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

Paul,
   Thanks for the reply.  I now have 2 reasons to call you.  I had a question
on running os-9 on a -386 SX machine a while back & you offered a solution via
phone.  I have obviously not gotten around to it yet!!  I think I was talking
big right after the IRS grudgingly released by impounded $, however momma
snaked the check right out of my hand & I havn't seen it since! On showing the
MM/1 here---that would really be neat!!  I was just responding to John Teague's
call for ideas.  He is definately more "in" on the planning. You might give him
a shout if you are interested, as he seems to be in the center of it all.  The
HARA arena is the place they held the Dayton Hamvention this year.  BIG PLACE!!
Hope to see you in Aug.  Right now it looks as if I might be in Woods Hole on
13-14 Aug.  Probably just my luck that is when the Dayton Computer Show is
scheduled!!
 Don

#: 4986 S1/General Interest
    08-Jul-90  12:07:26
Sb: #4858-#Computer Show Ideas
Fm: JOHN TEAGUE 75715,1670
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

Paul, I'm the one who posted the original message about the Dayton
ComputerFest.  I was looking for ideas for our club to demo.  I think Don's
suggestion is a great one.  You'd be welcome to set up at our booth in the flea
market area--no charge.  Or you might want to buy your own professional space
for $150 or a flea market space for $25.  If you give me a mailing address,
I'll send you a flyer with the details.

The dates are Saturday, August 25 and Sunday August 26.

John Teague

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4996 S1/General Interest
    08-Jul-90  15:08:53
Sb: #4986-Computer Show Ideas
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: JOHN TEAGUE 75715,1670

John,

Send away!

Paul Ward IMS 1840 Biltmore Street NW Suite 10 Washington DC 20009

I look forward to looking over the stuff! And by then, the MM/1 will be getting
stockpiled for massive shipments all over the Free World.

Paul

#: 4821 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  01:46:08
Sb: modem help
Fm: Wayne Day 76703,376
To: Everett Chimbidis 76370,1366 (X)

Sorry, Everett...we do not allow "War Games" dialers in our libraries, so
you'll have to look elsewhere.

Wayne

#: 4824 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  06:33:31
Sb: #Mouse vs. Keyboard
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: All

Help!  Has anyone seen the following symptoms before?

My CoCo was chugging along nicely.  I decided to interrupt the B&B repack (it
hasn't made it quite halfway through my 30 Mbyte drive yet in about 18 hours of
runtime) and dial up a few places.  The repack stopped in reasonable order
(well...it does have this habit of leaving "." entries in some directories
wrong, but I can fix that with ded), and I was in fact about to fire up ded
when I found that what I was typing was being ignored.  I powered down, pulled
the CoCo out, opened it up and pulled and reseated the plastic ribbon connector
from the keyboard to the circuit board, and just hooked it up to the monitor
again to try it out.  Hot dog, it worked.

Plug everything back in again and power up.  It doesn't work.

Experimentation shows that the killer is not the printer connection, as I
suspected (after all, that's the other half of the PIA, right?), but the
high-res mouse adapter.  If I leave it unplugged, all looks well.  If I plug it
in, I can't type at my CoCo.

Any ideas?  I really would like to use my mouse.  (I guess for completeness's
sake I should try the mouse without the adapter.)

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4828 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  07:55:49
Sb: #4824-#Mouse vs. Keyboard
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

Use to be, when RSDOS was the way, I'd get similar crazyness whenever one of
the joystick buttons were depressed, and I didn't know it.

Perhaps something similar here?

Steve

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4842 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  20:45:55
Sb: #4828-#Mouse vs. Keyboard
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Steve Wegert 76703,4255 (X)

You hit the nail on the very head.  A book had slipped over and was sitting on
a mouse button.  Oy, did I feel stupid!

Thanks for the reply; just goes to show it pays to look for the simple things
first.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4850 S10/Tandy CoCo
    03-Jul-90  07:34:22
Sb: #4842-Mouse vs. Keyboard
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

Just shows to go ya!  :-)

All those years under RSDOS were useful after all!

Steve

#: 4831 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  12:30:06
Sb: #4824-#Mouse vs. Keyboard
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

JJ -

Look for a shorted mouse button (or a sticky one). The way the scanning
routines used to be written, the keeyboard would be ignored if a fire button
was being pressed.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4843 S10/Tandy CoCo
    02-Jul-90  20:46:57
Sb: #4831-#Mouse vs. Keyboard
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

That's what it was--not a sticky mouse button, but one with a book sitting on
it.  (This is the point where Kevin is supposed to nag me to clean my room.
<grin>)

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4849 S10/Tandy CoCo
    03-Jul-90  01:21:52
Sb: #4843-Mouse vs. Keyboard
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

CLEAN YOUR ROOM!!!!!

Kev (the Nag ;-)

#: 4851 S10/Tandy CoCo
    03-Jul-90  12:06:30
Sb: OOPS
Fm: George Hendrickson 71071,2003
To: Wayne Day

Please disregard the earlier message about not finding the OS9 sig.
Appaarently, I was having trouble with the 'go os9' thingy. Thanks.

#: 4852 S10/Tandy CoCo
    03-Jul-90  18:37:11
Sb: #ZAP
Fm: PHIL SCHERER 71211,2545
To: ALL

Hi Folks--Does anyone know of a Zap type program that will read a disk
regardless of format. One that will read the bits and come back and say heres
this garbage if it means anything to you great but I dont understand it. I
hatried reading damaged disks with the zap programs I have and some sectors it
just will not read. I am looking for something which will return whats there
and not try to make sense or order out of it.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4855 S10/Tandy CoCo
    03-Jul-90  22:12:10
Sb: #4852-#ZAP
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: PHIL SCHERER 71211,2545 (X)

dEd or the standard dump utility will do it for you. Just specify the "entire
device" with the file specifier /dd@ (note the@ at the end of the device name.)

Zack

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4912 S10/Tandy CoCo
    05-Jul-90  19:21:40
Sb: #4855-ZAP
Fm: PHIL SCHERER 71211,2545
To: Zack Sessions 76407,1524 (X)

thanks Zack--I have Ded but I never tried that format. Thanks!

#: 4860 S15/Hot Topics
    04-Jul-90  00:08:42
Sb: #TOMCAT Uploads
Fm: Frank Hogg 70310,317
To: sysop (X)

I have upload 2 new messages to DL15. The first is a question and answer file
(20K 10 pages) on the questions I have collected for the TOMCAT. This thing
kept getting bigger and it began to look as if I would never finish it. I
decided to make this version 1.

Thanks frank

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4861 S15/Hot Topics
    04-Jul-90  00:09:57
Sb: #4860-#TOMCAT Uploads
Fm: Frank Hogg 70310,317
To: Frank Hogg 70310,317

I also uploaded a file called TCVMM.CMP which is a comparision of the TOMCAT
and the MM1. Took a chance that this would be useful. Hope Paul doesn't put out
a contract on me.

Frank

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4902 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  13:21:31
Sb: #4861-#TOMCAT Uploads
Fm: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715
To: Frank Hogg 70310,317 (X)

~ Frank,

I don't think Paul would contract out on you (snicker) After all you two are
taking different approaches on the new machines and each has its advantages and
disadvantages. What one person would see as not practical on one machine the
other fills the bill (IE: yours allows users to continue to use all there
current CoCo hardware and later decide to upgrade) where the MM/1 replaces most
of it (but some expensive parts are preserved thank god!) Some won't want to
move to OSK or OS9 so yours allows RSDOS compatability since it is a CoCo3 that
is souped up and fixed the brain-damaged parts (like reul serial ports and not
a bitbanger and a real keyboard w/o expensive adaptors) but the MM/1 is a more
one-piece system with more standard hardware for those who will take the jump
sooner... so in a sense your nrt fighting each other. with TWO new machines it
will sastify a wider variety of users and benefit us ALL in the end.

Do you see my point?

Mike Guzzi

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4904 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  13:38:21
Sb: #4902-TOMCAT Uploads
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715 (X)

Mike,

Actually, Frank's RSDOS compatibility needs some explanation.

Paul

#: 4866 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    04-Jul-90  04:12:43
Sb: Coco 3 + 80 MB
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony  -

Is it SCSI? New? I may be interested.

Pete

#: 4943 S11/Non-CoCo OS-9
    07-Jul-90  01:29:04
Sb: Coco 3 + 80 MB
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony -

Well - I'm still curious.... what are you able to snag the MFM drives for.

Pete

#: 4868 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    04-Jul-90  07:30:23
Sb: #PT68
Fm: Jim Chapman 72557,1120
To: SCOTT HOWELL

I would be happy to work with you in resolving OS9/PT68 problems. At the moment
the biggest problem is the system hangs occassionally. I suspect a problem with
the startup file and/or the PATH list. It seems better if I do a dir before I
do anything else.

Thanks for your offer to send software. I have a 3.5 drive so I took up Ed's
offer.What weird things are you experiencing.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4922 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    05-Jul-90  23:39:09
Sb: #4868-PT68
Fm: SCOTT HOWELL 70270,641
To: Jim Chapman 72557,1120 (X)

n One 'weird' thing was the modem not working, but it is working fine now. I do
get an occasional system hang-up when I invoke the 'mfree' command and I also
get some strange things on my TERM when I use Umacs.

#: 4871 S15/Hot Topics
    04-Jul-90  10:57:24
Sb: #Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kevin, it's _very_ important that Kenneth-Leigh get ahold of Bill Hawes and
that they _get_ a version of Rexx for the MM/1. I have a feeling that BASIC
will become very... passe' in the not-too-distant future.
--Eet--

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4877 S15/Hot Topics
    04-Jul-90  21:48:47
Sb: #4871-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Jim Williams 72157,3524 (X)

Jim,
  Whilst you have beginners (and folks accustomed to developing software
quickly in Basic), you'll always have Basic around, never to become passe'.
Personal opinion here.
   Dan

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4901 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  13:21:11
Sb: #4877-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

~ Dan,

What is so bad about BASIC? I use BASIC09 and its obvoisly not like 'standard'
basic. My BBS is programmed in Basic09 and is very nice. basic09 has alot of
nice features and is fast and powerful. I am not trying to put you down or
anything but I think we need to distingush between Basic and Basic09.

Mike Guzzi

There are 3 Replies.

#: 4903 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  13:37:10
Sb: #4901-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715 (X)

Mike,

Hold on! Dan was on YOUR side! <grin>

And Basic09 is a different creature than BASIC.

You might want to post your BBS number to let people try out a BBS that runs on
a CoCo using Basic09.

Best,

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4953 S15/Hot Topics
    07-Jul-90  11:46:46
Sb: #4903-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

Ok well I was just expressing my opinion about basic09. if anyone wants to see
my BBS which currently runs on a CoCo3 using basic09 try mine at 717-586-2771
300-2400 baud 8/N/1 24hrs. this BBS will be ported to the MM/1

If one knows how to program in basic09 then the BBS can be done. those who say
Basic09 is no good for a BBS simply doesn't know how to use basic09 to the
fullest potential (like I don't know much about C right now but I am working on
it)



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4955 S15/Hot Topics
    07-Jul-90  11:59:32
Sb: #4953-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Floyd Resler 72500,2572
To: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715 (X)

Mike,
   You are absolutely right!  I have written a BBS in Basic09 and it currently
stands at about 150k in I-code.  All the drivers and everything was written in
Basic09.  C is nice for short things so you don't have to have RunB tagging
along, but when it comes to the big stuff, I'll take Basic09 any day!

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5052 S15/Hot Topics
    10-Jul-90  20:28:55
Sb: #4955-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: Floyd Resler 72500,2572 (X)

Sorry, I take the opposite view -- Basic09 is great for quick throwaway
programs, but for big, serious efforts, you need C. My feelings stem from the
lack of global variables and macros and constatns in B09, its fascist type
checking, and the deep breaths you take whenever daring to use any object-code
routines (tho I've learned to beat that by LOADing gfx2, inkey, etc.).

Oh yes, no pointers in B09 either.  Even Pascal (blechh) has those. Of course
this is all my personal opinions, grin.  --mike k

There are 3 Replies.

#: 5055 S15/Hot Topics
    10-Jul-90  21:35:14
Sb: #5052-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111

Aha! But basic09 programs are quicker to debug, and won't blow down the house
like C programs can <grin>. And basic09 doesn't type check when passing vars...
you can pass a 32-char string to a routine expecting a 4x8 byte array and it'll
work fine. Pointers you could fudge, but not prettily.

Then again, I can read basic programs easier ;-). Each to their own. hehe -kd

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5078 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  14:11:54
Sb: #5055-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

'blow down the house'? Are BASIC programs of equivalent 'power' to C programs
easier to debug? I don't think so, unless you're a _good_ BASIC programmer and
comment the h*ll out of your code. I've seen some nightmarish code in BASIC on
the C64... looked like I would imagine an APL program would look like <grin>
--Eet--


                                   Director of Mayhem
                                  Extra Terrestrial Imports, Ltd.



There is 1 Reply.

#: 5087 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  17:05:35
Sb: #5078-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Jim Williams 72157,3524

Eet -

Yeah, well, C64 programs were never known for their readability <grin>.

Agree, comments make good sense on both Basic/C programs... and the use of good
variable names. Anytime a programmer drops back to using "i,j,x" for every
variable, he's writing hard-to-read code ;-).

I think you'd find that most Basic09 source code is commented (and has good
variable names) just as well as most C source code is.

The big diff to me is that development is faster using an interactively
semi-compiled language such as Basic09... you can try stuff out quicker. For
instance, when debugging the circle algorithm for the gfx driver, I first wrote
it up in Basic using integer math. I could quickly (very!) try out different
changes until it worked perfectly. Then the translation from Basic into 68K asm
was a piece of cake. Really. Sort of like:

                                move.w ycord(a2),d1
 REPEAT                   Loop: move.w foo,d0
  xcord = foo * ratio           mulu.w ratio(a2),d0
  run Plot(xcord,ycord)         bsr    Plot
 UNTIL ycord = 0                tst.w  d1
                                bne.s  Loop

I guess I'm acting the part of a C compiler, except my code will be smaller
;-). So for quick utils at least, I still write in Basic. I can mess around
until it works right, and without fear of crashing the machine with stray
pointers <hehe>. Granted, if I were more adept at C, I'd probably zing out
utils in it, instead. - kev

#: 5065 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  07:55:07
Sb: #5052-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Colin Smith 73777,1360
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111

A little info, please.

How does Microware BASIC (like that comes with the MM/1) compare to BASIC-09?
Any thoughts/comments?

  --Colin



There is 1 Reply.

#: 5091 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  19:57:37
Sb: #5065-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Colin Smith 73777,1360

It's the same, save that REAL is IEEE double-precision floating point, and
INTEGER is a four-byte integer.

#: 5068 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  09:57:56
Sb: #5052-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111

Although I have *NEVER* written a line of code in Microware Basic (OSK) or
Basic09 (on my CoCo), I *have* ported and written tons of "C" programs on both
systems. Because I use a mixture of systems with and without memory management
under OSK, I have seen how easy it is to write code in "C" with pointers that
point out to sea and "get away" with it. It is amazing how many programs (right
here in our dl's) are being used every day by OSK'ers that are potentially
causing sporadic and random system problems because of blown pointers that the
68000 cannot catch. I know because my 68030 system with SSM invoked (system
security) refuses to run them. With source, the fixes are almost always
trivial. I believe Kevin's comment about the relative "safety" of B09 vs "C"
has merit.
 I am not trying to scare people away from "C" - it is all I use (except for
assembler under dire circumstances). I dislike systems which require a runtime
module (runb) to operate. It's been so long since I wrote anything in Basic
(about 14 years) that I can't remember any of it anyway.
 Think of this as just a reminder that, in "C" and assembler, you can write
bugs into your code that will never be caught by most people's systems.
 Mark (Mr. Desk Check Your Code) Wuest

#: 5075 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  13:22:03
Sb: #4955-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715
To: Floyd Resler 72500,2572 (X)

~ Well the main thing is if you know how to program basic09! If you write
spagetti code like Color Basic, Basic09 isn't any faster and hogs memory.
However if you use the loops and take advantage of its file handling and
modularity a good BBS can be done in basic09 without dirty code or forking 1000
shells.

Now with Basic09 on the MM/1 (I posted a file with my observations so far) we
have no barrier and multi-tasking is much better so a BBS could really fly!

The only part of my BBS thats in M/L is a ansi translator since I did need the
absolute most speed. yet interfacing it to Basic09 was cake! Basic09 can really
call other modules of any language and is easy to pass variables back & forth.
I see it as the best basic I ever used!

Mike

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5076 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  13:58:23
Sb: #5075-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Floyd Resler 72500,2572
To: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715

While writing the BBS I'm currently working on, I overcame one of my major
obstacles in writing large programs in BASIC09 - that is, the 64k barrier. Bill
Brady helped me understand how to overcome that. And, since I have, my BBS has
really taken off.  I can do so much more with it that the one I wrote in
RS-DOS. About the only time I ever use line numbers is ON-GOTO (I like C's
switch command) and when I need something to jump to another point in the
program and don't want to try and figure out how to loop it correctly.  And, of
course, for a BBS, I use GOSUBs for I/O.

Floyd

#: 4906 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  13:50:47
Sb: #4901-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715 (X)

Hey, I don't want to put BASIC down at all (I'll leave that to the better
qualified), just IMAO, it won't last much longer. Certain
.. dialects are being dropped from various platforms, so I've heard.    --Eet--

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4913 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  19:24:23
Sb: #4906-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Jim Williams 72157,3524 (X)

Jim,
   Nope. I disagree. Basic (an easier language other than Pascal, C, etc.)
whether it is Basic09, IBM's GWBASIC, etc...will be around as long as there are
people who are in the beginning stage of programming (and as mentioned earlier,
who are proficient in Basic, and can write a quick utility in it).
   It's just too darn easy to write understandable english words (like CIRCLE,
or LINE, etc.) and give it co-ordinates when you're using your computer for the
first several months, than to figure out why your C program crashes because you
used a pointer when you shouldn't have, or forgot to declare some variables in
Pascal.
    Dan

There are 4 Replies.

#: 4924 S15/Hot Topics
    06-Jul-90  02:09:15
Sb: #4913-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

yes, all that is very true... which is why a lot of programmers that start with
BASIC have trouble later on... I learned BASIC first, and I _don't_ mean to put
it down any... You're probably right that BASIC in some form will linger on for
some time _after_ it's "demise"..
                                  --Eet--

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4925 S15/Hot Topics
    06-Jul-90  03:21:21
Sb: #4924-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Jim Williams 72157,3524 (X)

Jim - you're very right... Basic as a first language can make for a lot of
unlearning later on <grin>. Learning a good structured Basic, however, can help
with learning Pascal, C, and asm down the line.

My first language was Fortran, btw. ick!

#: 4984 S15/Hot Topics
    08-Jul-90  12:04:38
Sb: #4913-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: JOHN TEAGUE 75715,1670
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

Microsoft has now bundled a QuickBasic interpreter with MS-DOS 5.0 (Yes 5.0). 
I've never seen the interpreter, but have used the QuickBasic compiler.  This
strikes me as a shot in the arm for BASIC since QuickBasic addresses many of
the criticisms against previous versions.  I hope that bundling BASIC with the
operating system cathes on again.  I provides the user with an easy way to add
functionality to their PERSONAL system even if it only comes from typing
listings from magazines.

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4997 S15/Hot Topics
    08-Jul-90  15:12:03
Sb: #4984-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: JOHN TEAGUE 75715,1670

John,

Interesting that you should mention bundled BASICs ... The MM/1 comes with
Microware's Basic.

Also, I would be interested in knowing a bit more about your experiences with
QuickBasic. Care to post a few editorial comments about QB?

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5080 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  14:12:16
Sb: #4997-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004

I _still_ think Rexx would be better... anybody working on an authoring system
for the MM/1, btw? Have you gotten ahold of Bill Hawes yet?
                                                --Eet--


                                   Director of Mayhem
                                  Extra Terrestrial Imports, Ltd.



#: 5053 S15/Hot Topics
    10-Jul-90  20:33:46
Sb: #4984-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Mike Knudsen 72467,1111
To: JOHN TEAGUE 75715,1670

From what Paul Ward's been announcing, bundling Basic with the OS has indeed
caught on again, big grin!  Throwing in C doesn't hurt either!

Actually I was amazed at what I could do with plain old RS-Basic. It was very
fast to throw together a quick program utility. No variable declarations or
opening keywords as in B09 or C.

#: 5074 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  13:21:32
Sb: #4913-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

~ Yes and to point out with Basic09 is that its very much like standard Basic
in the fact it has easy to understand commands and syntax and has the english
commands with gfx2 (like circle, line, etc..) plus a wonderful debugger for
tracing problem code (which can't be done in C  but i THINK pascal has
something like it) then in the end you can PACK it and have a compiled module.
Basic09 in my view represents the best of both worlds to have a flexible
language and making quick changes and compiled code for speed.

Mike Guzzi

#: 5079 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  14:12:04
Sb: #4913-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Dan Robins 73007,2473 (X)

Possibly... but then there are these neat, new things called, "authoring
systems" out now...                        --Eet--


                                   Director of Mayhem
                                  Extra Terrestrial Imports, Ltd.



#: 4911 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  19:18:13
Sb: #4901-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Mike Guzzi 76576,2715 (X)

Mike,
  Actually, I was supporting Basic! I think, at least for me, quick projects
are best done when completed in Basic. Other projects are best done in C when
the Libraries are only available in C (and this, mostly on other computers).
  Some basics are slower than a turtle, on the other hand, others are as quick
as other languages.
  I think the person's use of any language is what they are comfortable with
and what works, and as I mentioned in the other message, I doubt seriously that
Basic will become "passe'", as was remarked.
   Dan

#: 4910 S15/Hot Topics
    05-Jul-90  18:29:14
Sb: #4871-#Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Jim Williams 72157,3524 (X)

Jim,

Rexx would be nice. Also looking at other IPC mechanisms. There's no Rexx
manual uploaded anywhere, is there?

Basic: heh-heh, everyone has been saying that it's passe' for quite some time
now. Almost as dirty a word as "goto" in some forums <grin>. Still, more and
more people are writing into magazines wondering why it's put down... as it
still often is the first language learned by newcomers.

More importantly to this forum, OS-9 Basic is held in pretty high regard here.
Unlike many basics, Basic09 is very Pascal-like, very fast, and very useful.
It's not fancy (no built-in machine-specific commands), but very flexible.

Most BBS programs are written in it, many applications (including word
processors) are also, and anything you write in it can become yet another
command module to preload and/or call off disk. I myself, an avowed assembly
language nut, write most of my quickie utilities in basic09, as it's far easier
to write and interactively debug with, than C or asm are.

So while many people are getting into C here, Basic09 remains the structured
language of choice for many other OS9ers. See, we've been around so long that
passing fashions don't affect us <grin>. If we see something new, we chew it
over for a few years first, to see if it's the "right" way. Weird, eh?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5081 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  14:12:34
Sb: #4910-Is Basic out of date?
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kevin, I've never worked with BASIC09, so I refuse to make an specific comments
about it. As for a Rexx manual, not that I know of... you really should go talk
to Bill Hawes, tho. (maybe a formal co with him here in OS9 Forum? nah, that'd
be to AmigaTechish <ducking>...
btw, as I recall, there are some old IPC example programs over in AmigaTech
that you might want to check out. I _think_ in lib 9, but maybe lib 13.
--Eet--


                                   Director of Mayhem
                                  Extra Terrestrial Imports, Ltd.



#: 4874 S5/OS9 Users Group
    04-Jul-90  16:16:30
Sb: Call for MOTD arrticles
Fm: MOTD Editor..Bill Brady 70126,267
To: all

I need articles for the MOTD guys! On the Tomcat & MM/1 of course!

#: 4875 S1/General Interest
    04-Jul-90  17:42:11
Sb: #OS-9 for AMIGA
Fm: - Visitor 76114,746
To: all

Hi everybody,
   can somebody tell me ifOS-9 is available on the Amiga and (if yes) from whom
shall i purchase it? thanks Michel

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4880 S1/General Interest
    04-Jul-90  23:26:40
Sb: #4875-#OS-9 for AMIGA
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: - Visitor 76114,746

Hi... there's supposedly a deal made now for someone to sell the Amiga OS/9
port in the US. However, things are moving slowly right now, and I guess I
should more or less say that it's not available yet. The company that did the
port is in Australia. I'm supposed to get a review version any day now. I'll
letcha know when I do. best - kev

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5077 S1/General Interest
    11-Jul-90  14:11:41
Sb: #4880-OS-9 for AMIGA
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kevin, what about Bem's copy? Oh, and one for me? <grin> (tell em I'm a well
known beta tester <grin again> )  --Eet--


                                   Director of Mayhem
                                  Extra Terrestrial Imports, Ltd.



#: 4899 S1/General Interest
    05-Jul-90  12:47:49
Sb: #4875-OS-9 for AMIGA
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: - Visitor 76114,746

GIve me a call at 202 232 4246. I have access to Amiga OS9.

Paul

#: 4876 S10/Tandy CoCo
    04-Jul-90  20:44:12
Sb: #EdPtrs
Fm: Joseph Cheek 76264,142
To: all

I just uploaded EdPtrs.pak, a program that lets you edit graphical pointers.
However, I forgot to mention in the description that Kevin Darling's GFX2 and
Devid Breeding's GFX3 modules are required.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4878 S10/Tandy CoCo
    04-Jul-90  22:00:21
Sb: #4876-EdPtrs
Fm: Mike Ward 76703,2013
To: Joseph Cheek 76264,142 (X)

I'll try to squeeze it into the file description for you Joe. Thanks for the
upload!

Mike




#: 4881 S10/Tandy CoCo
    04-Jul-90  23:44:59
Sb: #Ledger
Fm: David Sanchez 76200,2476
To:  76264,142 (X)

Joseph,

I have downloaded your Basic09 Program called Ledger and am running into
difficulties running it.

It seems that when I invoke the program per the manual, I get an ERROR 043.
Since I have tried to run the program by the manual, I assume I have something
wrong with my set-up.

I am using the CoCo 3 with 512K. I have tried running the program using the
stock Shell and also, after downloading and installing Shell+, I have gotten
the same error. I further assume that the ERROR 043 is a Basic09 error which
translates to "Unknown Procedure" according to my OS9 Level II Docs. I have
both Basic09 and RunB in my execution (/dd/cmds) directory.

I was hoping you, or someone else could shed some light and help me out as I do
not know much about the technical ins and outs of Basic09 or even OS9 for that
matter.

Any help from anyone would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

David

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4923 S10/Tandy CoCo
    06-Jul-90  00:17:06
Sb: #4881-#Ledger
Fm: Joseph Cheek 76264,142
To: David Sanchez 76200,2476 (X)

David, you may not have SysCall and GFX2 in your current execution directory,
or (preferrably) merged with RunB.  If not, the best thing to do is merge
SysCall and GFX2 with RunB (at the end).  Try this and see if it works.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4935 S10/Tandy CoCo
    06-Jul-90  23:33:27
Sb: #4923-Ledger
Fm: David Sanchez 76200,2476
To: Joseph Cheek 76264,142

Joseph,

Ok, but is there any specific reason RunB should be at the end? I haven't
merged them until last night but RunB was not at the end. All seems to be OK
except for one small thing, which is minor.

It seems that when I am listing to the screen, some items are highlighted. I
thought at first it was just deposits but checks written are also highlighted
and it some are highlighted with different colors. I use a monochrome monitor
and the different shades, while legible, it just seems a little strange. If it
were only deposits and they all stayed the same shade it would be great.

Don't get me wrong, though. It is a nice program. What are the possibilities of
having reconciliations and editing in future versions. That would be nice too.

Anyway, thanks for the program. I intend to use it a great deal. With the
amount of checks we write, it is nice to know that we can do a quick search
when tracking down a payment or something.

Thanks again,

David

#: 4882 S10/Tandy CoCo
    05-Jul-90  00:37:56
Sb: #Ledger runs
Fm: David Sanchez 76200,2476
To:  76264,142 (X)

Joseph,

It was amazing. For some strange reason, I was thinking of the inkey procedure
on the Basic09 disk. I had an off-the-wall thought that maybe your program had
used that procedure and could not find it in my execution directory. I copied
inkey to my exec directory but still got the same error.

However, when I copied the procedure, i noticed syscall. I then went back and
copied syscall, gfx and gfx2 to my exec directory and Bingo!, the Ledger
program came to life.

I really don't know which of the files is being used but I am sure by trial and
error I will find out. Reading my Lev II docs would help, I'm sure.

Anyway, got it running and learning more about OS9 and Basic09 at the same
time. Thanks for getting my attention with Ledger, it has given me a chance (or
reason) for "cracking the books" and learning more.

Thanks to all of you who would have or are still going to respond. I greatly
appreciate the help.

David

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4889 S10/Tandy CoCo
    05-Jul-90  07:37:22
Sb: #4882-#Ledger runs
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: David Sanchez 76200,2476 (X)

David,

Since syscal is your 'portal' to the operating system, and Inkey handles
scanning the keyboard for input, I'm betting those are the culprits.

Most folks recommend merging syscall,Inkey, gfx and gfx2 with RunB. You'll save
valuable system resources as well as being assured of having everything you
need, when you need it.

Steve

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4919 S10/Tandy CoCo
    05-Jul-90  22:27:41
Sb: #4889-Ledger runs
Fm: David Sanchez 76200,2476
To: Steve Wegert 76703,4255 (X)

Steve,

Thanks for the info and advice. I'll merge them asap.

David

#: 4884 S10/Tandy CoCo
    05-Jul-90  01:15:42
Sb: #SCSI drives
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To: all

I've been paging through the Computer Shopper checking out prices of hard
drives and it's getting me pretty confused. Of course, the fact that all the
advertisers there understand are MS-DOS machines doesn't help. And I dread the
day I call one of them and tell them what my machine is (it will be an MM/1).

Anyway, here are the questions:

1. When they talk about a SCSI drive, does this mean that a controller is
included? Or just that the drive will work with a SCSI controller? For example,
one ad lists a ST-125N-1 Seagate drive. Then it has a price for "alone", "8bit
XT Kit" and "16Bit AT Kit". The difference between the "alone" and "kit" prices
is about $30.00. So what is in the kit? Perhaps a MS-DOS type host adaptor?

2. I see SCSI controller cards (eg Seagate ST02) for XT/AT systems. Will these
work on something like the MM/1. Will I need a special SCSI drive to use one?

3. If I get a drive with a builtin controller would I be able to add SCSI
devices to my system later? How? Add to the host in the computer, or chain of
the existing drive?

4. I read some messages the other day about 512 byte and 256 byte sectors on
SCSI drives. Is this not something that is adjustable when the things are
formatted? Or does it depend on the drive?

This all seems to be quite complex to a software guy like me. Perhaps someone
in the know can do a brief primer on the subject and post it...

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4909 S10/Tandy CoCo
    05-Jul-90  18:25:54
Sb: #4884-#SCSI drives
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

Sounds like Scott can fix you up (with answers, also). In the meantime,
simplified: a bus (usually via a cable) with devices hooked to it...

 SCSI
 cable
  0||<--> adapter <--> computer (computer often acts like controller)
  1||<--> separate SCSI/HD controller <-> drive1,drive2
  2||<--> embedded SCSI controller on hard drive
  3||<--> embedded SCSI controller on hard drive
  4||<--> embedded SCSI controller on tape drive
  5||<--> adapter <--> perhaps another computer
   || etc

Actually, "adapter" is misleading, as what you really have is just another SCSI
controller on the bus.... specific to the computer. Those embedded SCSI
controllers are likewise specific to the HD/tape/etc drive that they are part
of. So...

1. Right. "SCSI drive" means the controller is embedded in with the actual
drive electronics. So you just need to hook it via a cable [see 2,3 above]. A
regular ST506 HD (or often, several) can be hooked up to a standalone SCSI/HD
controller also, for example an Adaptec 4070 [see 1 above].

2. No, those cards are for a PC bus. The second expansion board on the MM/1 has
a SCSI interface, which means any SCSI drive hooks up with a 50-pin cable and
you're rolling.

3. Sure. You can have up to 7 SCSI devices on the cable (8, counting the main
computer). Each one has jumpers to set its "device ID" number.

4. I think some drives now are set to 512-bytes/sector, and you can't change it
(PClone influence there). Older drives allowed changing (like my old Rodime
20meg SCSI HD... it could be set to almost any size.. so I used 256 for my
CoCo).

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4947 S10/Tandy CoCo
    07-Jul-90  01:31:24
Sb: #4909-#SCSI drives
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kevin,

Thanks for the SCSI dope.

I called a supplier the other day to get some prices and info. He told me (in a
very knowing way) that the controller board WAS needed with a SCSI drive and
that the ST01 controller was *both* a host AND a controller (just like the MFN
controllers...). Guess that is why he is still selling IBM-type stuff <grin>.

Now I'll have to decide what size of HD I'll be needing. The fellow I talked to
offered a 110meg drive for 900+ $$. That's too much for sure--plus, then a tape
backup would be essential. Can you imagine backing up that much data onto
floppies! With prices as they are probably something around 30meg seems to be
reasonable.

So the cable acts like a bus and the devices have select pins (I guess like
floppies do right now). Is it possible to connect more than 8 devices to a
system? (Not that I'll be able to afford that many, but...).

Am I right in assuming that in order to hook up a "normal" disk drive to the
SCSI "bus" one would need a SCSI controller card for the drive? I guess that
the select would be on the controller, not the drive.

Okay, this is starting to make sense. Thanks.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4948 S10/Tandy CoCo
    07-Jul-90  04:16:35
Sb: #4947-#SCSI drives
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

Righto... you'd need a scsi controller with it's own floppy drive 'adapter'
section, to use regular floppy drives. Perhaps embedded-scsi floppies will
become popular one day. Never know.

There's an extension to scsi which allows selecting up to 256 devices, but no
one uses it that i know about. Right now, the 8-bit data bus is used to
indicate who's talking to whom (each bit is the flag for one device)... which
is where the limitation comes from. [The data bus bits are used this way only
during the initial phase of making communication each time controllers wish to
talk to each other... otherwise they're data bits].

Yah, that dealer you talked to was selling scsi systems, but not really scsi
drives, in the way most people mean now.

Sidenote: os9 descriptor info doesn't mean much with embedded scsi drives...
because the drives themselves know how many heads/cylinders they have <grin>.
Basically, you need only tell an embedded drive to format itself, read or
write. It figures out the internal stuff itself, of course.

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4958 S10/Tandy CoCo
    07-Jul-90  16:01:19
Sb: #4948-SCSI drives
Fm: JOHN R. WAINWRIGHT 72517,676
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

For Bob:  Thanks for asking my questions for  me! For Kevin: Thanks for the
usual prompt reply.
   JohnW

#: 4999 S10/Tandy CoCo
    08-Jul-90  15:19:19
Sb: #4948-#SCSI drives
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kevin,

Actually, when in the course of our talks with Capitol Video I asked them what
their chief aggravations were in simulating CD-I titles, one of their biggest
complaints was that OS-9/UNIX could not actaully determine the PHYSICAL sectors
that were barfing in the CD-I image. The SCSI controller remapped all the bad
sectors out, and made the drive seem,once again, logically intact. Interesting
.... and somewhat of a future problem for multimedia moguls simulating their
applications off of hard drives.

I guess the biggest problem (although I really am NOT sure) is that, when
reading a realtime file with interleaved audio/video, the heads on the SCSI
drive actually reseek to find that remmapped sector, causing a hiccup, I guess.

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5034 S10/Tandy CoCo
    09-Jul-90  20:36:02
Sb: #4999-#SCSI drives
Fm: Mark S 76004,373
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004 (X)

These guys are in for a big shock then. A CD drive can only deliver raw data a
150K per sec, by the time the computer gets it. It is closer to 130K per sec. A
SCSI HD should be deliving 600-800K per sec, a re-seek is meaning less at that
speed. And on top of that the SCSI simulation will not deliver the P-Q
subchannels. Having worked for the past 2 months on a CD-ROM design time I can
vouch for those figures.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5071 S10/Tandy CoCo
    11-Jul-90  12:17:53
Sb: #5034-#SCSI drives
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: Mark S 76004,373 (X)

Mark,

Well! Thanks for the info! The real virtue of CD technology right now is the
storage volume, not the transfer rate or seek time. CD-I is really running up
against some bottlenecks on this, causing some grey hairs. Part of the problem
is CD technology, and the other part has been Philips Green Book spec, which
tried to specify that all titles be written to assume some incredibly long seek
time. Apparently, Philips wanted to antipate the creation of portable CD-I
devices that had slower mechanical performance. I understand that the Green
Book has since been slightly revised in that regard.

Still, even 130K per second is not bad -- and I know a couple of engineers that
are working with multimedia computers that have ways to smooth multimedia apps
over that hump. It DOES require DMA, SCSI, and caching.

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5094 S10/Tandy CoCo
    11-Jul-90  20:38:09
Sb: #5071-SCSI drives
Fm: Mark S 76004,373
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004

The seek times are indeed long however if the drive file structure is optimized
for to reduce distance between the files the timing is bearable. I to have been
working with DMA and Caching, but the problems in a MMU related environment are
very nasty. I have had direct conversations with Philips in the Netherlands and
There person here in the US who defined the SCSI CD-ROM implimentation. After
our conversation They agreed there Standard was flawed. This leaves us with the
inability to use a SCSI approach for any thing approaching CD-ROM Multimedia at
the level that users will expect to have.

#: 4885 S7/Telecommunications
    05-Jul-90  01:16:22
Sb: #modems
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To: all

This must be question night for me....

I'm thinking of getting a 2400 baud modem. Most of my on-line time is spent
with this system (CIS). Is there any advantage to getting one with Level 5 MNP?
From what I understand the through-put is about 2x using this protocol, but not
if things are already compressed (like an AR file)? Also, do CIS nodes support
MNP?

Any advice on this will be appreciated.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4890 S7/Telecommunications
    05-Jul-90  07:45:17
Sb: #4885-#modems
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

Bob,

I'm in the process of making the same decisions on a modem.

At present, CIS MNP nodes support only a level 3 protocol as I understand it.
You can use a level 5 modem with a level 3, but yo'll only make use of the
'error correcting' capabilities here on CIS.

If you have a nasty line, MNP will make all the difference in the world.

Next problem, CIS is in the process of phasing in MNP support. Not all nodes
support it. GO PHONES to see if you have such a supported node.

You can use a level 5 modem with a non MNP modem ...it should just drop back to
normal mode.

With prices dropping like mad, I'm planning to get the level 5 support. (I _do_
have a supported node). That way, I'll have the capability if and when it
arrives here. In the meantime, I can make use of the features on the other
systems I use that support it.



There is 1 Reply.

#: 4946 S7/Telecommunications
    07-Jul-90  01:31:06
Sb: #4890-#modems
Fm: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203
To: Steve Wegert 76703,4255 (X)


Steve,

I guess that getting one with MNP is probably the best idea. Even if it isn't
supported just now . . . if it will be later. You see, I have to call long
distance everytime I access CIS so that the savings really multiply when I cut
down my access time.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4951 S7/Telecommunications
    07-Jul-90  11:14:46
Sb: #4946-modems
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Bob van der Poel 76510,2203 (X)

You bet Bob .... my thinking as well.

Just remember that MNP levels must be matched at each end, else it will drop
back to the lowest level of commonality.

For example, if you had a level 5 modem and called a system that supported
level 5 you'd get th bennefit of the error correction and the compression.

However, use your Level 5 modem to call a CIS level 3 node, all you'd get is
the error correction.

Steve

#: 4914 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    05-Jul-90  19:51:54
Sb: #Login Shell
Fm: David George 72240,134
To: ALL

Does anyone know how the OSK system can tell a "login shell" from a shell?

In the OSK manuals it repeatedly references "login shell", but doesn't give
any specifics on how you can tell one from the other.  There must be some
way as the .logout file is only read for the "login shell".  I seem to 
remember hearing something about a "dash" for a login shell, but I am
not sure if it was called as a dash or a dash parameter.

Any help would be appreciated.
David George
72240,134

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4967 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    08-Jul-90  00:51:40
Sb: #4914-Login Shell
Fm: Kim Kempf 76701,65
To: David George 72240,134

The login program forks the shell with argv[0] = '-'.  When shell sees this, it
knows assumes that it was forked by the login program and makes itself a
special case: read the .login/.logout files, set certain options such as
"interactive mode".  Hope this helps.

#: 4930 S7/Telecommunications
    06-Jul-90  16:59:52
Sb: WIZ Query
Fm: Ches Looney 73016,1336
To: Bill Brady 70126,267

Hi, Bill, how are things with you?  I'm now "self-employed" and enjoying the
change.  Still working same place, but generally only Tues/Wed. I'm still using
WIZ as my comm package of choice (although PROCOMM is pretty good on messy-dos
machines), but I need a WIZ answer I can't find in your manual.  How do you set
the BREAK byte in the autolog sequence? I bought a Tandy 1100FD to replace the
100 (actually 102) that had given me such fine service over the years.  The
1100 is a good machine, but has a couple of annoying flaws in its built-ins;
the worst is sloppy printer drivers that can't drive the printers as claimed.  
Regards - Ches.

#: 4931 S6/Applications
    06-Jul-90  18:30:52
Sb: Help for Cousin
Fm: Richard Ries 76057,3534
To:  70745,1044

AllenIf you haven't gotten a lot of replies already, try "GO HANDICAPPED" here
on CIS. Also, in the 2/89 issue of the Rainbow, Dennis Weide wrote an article
about using a Coco for handicapped people. I got tthe impression he's done
several of them. The given address is 14201 Marquette N.E. Albuquerque, NM,
87123. Use a SASE. Also in another article, a puff switch is mentioned. It is
from Honeywell - Model PSF100A. Apparently, Edmund Scientific of Barrington, NJ
carries them.
 Good luck, and my best wishes for your cousin Rich Ries

#: 4936 S10/Tandy CoCo
    07-Jul-90  00:18:10
Sb: Unzip problem
Fm: Paul Rinear 73757,1413
To: anyone

       I've been having a problem using UNZIP. Usually I unzip files
  I download from BBS's from a floppy disk onto a ramdisk. Now and
  then, my system will lock up; sparklies on the screen, random junk
  here and there; a reboot is required. I know the ramdisk is not
  near full. Has anyone else had this problem?
                      ???,
                             Paul

#: 4941 S3/Languages
    07-Jul-90  01:26:47
Sb: #I don't C so well !
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Zack Sessions

Zack Hi there.

I have a couple of C related questions for you. How can I check to see if my
printer is on line, or even powered on for that matter ?
 I tried the following
 if ( !(status = write(printer, font_code, len) ) ) { print an error message
here ! } but when the printer was off-line, the program stopped until I put it
back on-line.

Also, I was trying to erase just a portion of the text screen by using
putchar(0X04), fflush(stdout), from within a for loop; But the $4 didn't seem
to do anything. These code can be found in the LII manual on page B-3. I also
tried using putchar(0X0B), but that is for a graphics screen. Any clues ?? TC

There are 3 Replies.

#: 4944 S3/Languages
    07-Jul-90  01:30:56
Sb: #4941-#I don't C so well !
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

I believe the later vintage coco printer drivers return E$NotRdy (error 246) if
the printer doesn't come ready within a few seconds.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4979 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  11:40:20
Sb: #4944-#I don't C so well !
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

What do you mean by later vintage coco printer drivers ? I am not using the
stock LII driver. I am using the Parallel.dr for the Disto printer port. I
beleive Kevin may have written it ??? TC

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4994 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  14:09:26
Sb: #4979-#I don't C so well !
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony,

The original printer driver timed out after a coupla seconds... which was
complained about (and patched in numerous files on BBSs and here), because most
programs couldn't deal with getting back an E$NotRdy error. And it really
goofed up people trying to single-sheet feed a printer.

So it was actually found that most people preferred no time out on the printer
driver. But you're right, it'd be good to have a way to check the status. Any
thoughts? Can't just check the busy line... would have to be a delay on that
status, etc. I can send you the original driver source if you wish.

Kev

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5027 S3/Languages
    09-Jul-90  19:24:01
Sb: #4994-#I don't C so well !
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Kev. Thanx but no thanx. I don't think I could do much with the driver. But can
you tell me why my program just sits and waits for the printer to be put back
on-line. My code is as follows, if( !(status = write(printer, font_code,
fontbuf_len) )) { printf("\nError ! Printer is off-line or not connected. ");
fflush(stdout); } Is it just the way I am implementing this, or is that the way
os9 works ?

TC

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5032 S3/Languages
    09-Jul-90  20:27:28
Sb: #5027-I don't C so well !
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104

Tony - what's happening is that the printer driver doesn't abort... it simply
waits until the printer is ready for the next character. Which could be
forever, of course. I suppose the driver could/should be rewritten to handle
some kind of ready? statcall (which would have to wait a second or two just in
case the printer is still busy, before returning the status).

Right now, I can think of two ways to handle it. One, fork another process
either to do the printing, which you can abort if it doesn't signal you that
it's started, or two, you could present a dialog box with "Please make sure
your printer is online" type of thing?

#: 5042 S3/Languages
    10-Jul-90  09:09:32
Sb: #5027-I don't C so well !
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104

Tony,
 I use OSK, but I have a solution that will work. I used this back before OSK
had the alarm() calls. I wrote a program called timesig which took exactly 3
arguments: argv[1] is the process you want to signal, argv[2] is the signal to
send, and argv[3] is the time to wait (I used seconds). (Of course, argv[0] was
"timesig"). This way, you can os9fork() timesig to send yourself a signal in a
couple of seconds just before you do the write() and, if your write() returns
(-1), just check to see if you got the signal. Here's sort of what timesig
looked like:
 main(argc, argv)
 int argc;
 char *argv[];
 {
     int pid, sigval, time;

     pid = atoi(argv[1]);
     sigval = atoi(argv[2]);
     time = atoi(argv[3]);
     sleep(time);
     kill(pid,sigval);
 }

 Good luck!
 Mark

#: 4961 S3/Languages
    07-Jul-90  18:36:49
Sb: #4941-#I don't C so well !
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

As Pete mentioned, if you try to open a path to a device which is not
ready, the error code returned is 246 (E$NotRdy). If you use the C
Systemhfunction open(), it will simply return -1 on any open error.

Without seeing more of your code, it hard to tell. I tested the following
code segment on my system and it functions as expected, ie, clears the
second line of the display.

#include <stdio.h>
main()
{
    putchar(0x0c);
    puts("This data is on Line 1");
    puts("This data is on Line 2");
    puts("This data is on Line 3");
    tsleep(120);
    putchar(0x02);
    putchar(0x20);
    putchar(0x21);
    putchar(0x04);
    fflush(stdout);
    tsleep(120);
    putchar(0x02);
    putchar(0x20);
    putchar(0x2a);
    puts("Just one more line!");
}

Oh, and $0B is not just for graphics screens.

Zack

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4980 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  11:46:52
Sb: #4961-I don't C so well !
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Zack Sessions 76407,1524 (X)

I guess I should do the error checking on the open() line, instead of the
write() line. But if somehow the printer was turned off or off-line between the
open() and the write(), how would you test for it. Aaas I said my program sits
and waits without printing any errors until I manually put the printer ON-LINE.
I like to make my programs as bullet-proof as possible. AS you can see, if I
can't detect a printer beong off-line, the program is full of holes. I'm not
sure how to upload code-fragments here or I would send yoy what I am working
with. Maybe I'll give you a call and we can do it over the phone. By looking at
the code you sent me, I'm not sure we are talking about the same situation. I
know how hard it is to get the big picture when your not actually looking at a
printout. TC

#: 4970 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  09:44:04
Sb: #4941-#I don't C so well !
Fm: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony,
     On buffered writes to SCF devices C uses I$WriteLn which activates line
editing at the op system level.  This filters out a lot of non-ASCII control
codes.  It's best to use the system call function write() to send control codes
to the screen, printer and such.  Try:

 char c;
 c=4;
 write(fileno(stdout),&c,1);

or if you have cgfx.l you can use:

 ErEOLine(fileno(stdout));

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4981 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  11:49:41
Sb: #4970-#I don't C so well !
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376 (X)

Bruce Look at my message again. I AM using write(), not writeln(). But I turned
my printer off line, AFTER I opened the path to /p1, to see what would be
returned from write() when the printer was not ready. Wwell my program just
sits there and waits until the printer is put back on line. Aas you can see
this is not acceptable, but how do I get around this ? TC

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4995 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  14:11:28
Sb: #4981-#I don't C so well !
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

PS: I think most printer drivers wait forever these days. However, they also do
F$Sleeps... I wonder if another process could be used to do the printing, and
maybe the main one could time-out and abort things?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5028 S3/Languages
    09-Jul-90  19:24:52
Sb: #4995-I don't C so well !
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Good Idea. I'll try a timeout from main. TC

#: 5025 S3/Languages
    09-Jul-90  16:41:48
Sb: #4981-#I don't C so well !
Fm: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376
To: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104 (X)

Tony,
     My reply refered to the second part of your message about why putchar(04)
didn't do what you wanted it to do.  For the printer try doing a
getstat(1,PATH).  If you're printer driver services the SS.RDY getstat call
this should return -1 if the printer is off line.  The standard LVL II bit
banger /p doesn't service the call by the way.  It always returns -1 and an
illegal service request error code in errno.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5029 S3/Languages
    09-Jul-90  19:27:42
Sb: #5025-I don't C so well !
Fm: TONY CAPPELLINI 76370,2104
To: Bruce MacKenzie 71725,376 (X)

Bruce I haven't used getstat() yet. I'm not sure how it works. I'll have to dig
into the books tonight, after school. I'm using a Disto driver and /p1, so I
don't know if it works like you said. I think Kevin MAY have written it, but
I'm not sure. Kev ? TC

#: 4950 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    07-Jul-90  06:57:23
Sb: #TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: sysop (X)

SysOP!

I've uploaded Disk 2 of the TOP - Munich Release 2.0.  Please add to the
discription, the need to use the 'tar' and 'compress' utilities in dl12.

Thanks, Ed

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4952 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    07-Jul-90  11:34:15
Sb: #4950-TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Steve Wegert 76703,4255
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Ed,

Dan must not have seen your request to modify the description of Top2, so I've
taken the liberty to fix it up for you.

Just so you know, the owner of any file in the library has the ability to
modify the description, keywords and title anytime after it has been merged
into the librariess.

Browse the file and use the CHAnge command at the disposition prompt. If you're
changing the description, you'll be placed in the EDIT editor (same as the one
we use for the message base) and at the _top_ of the current description. Use
the /type command to get yor bearings and then edit to your hearts content.

Any changes become effective immediately upon exiting the editor.


Steve

#: 4957 S7/Telecommunications
    07-Jul-90  15:07:26
Sb: Wiz Query
Fm: Ches Looney 73016,1336
To: Bill Brady 70126,267

Bill, I just noticed the file in DL7.  Should answer my query.   Ches.

#: 4959 S10/Tandy CoCo
    07-Jul-90  16:02:00
Sb: Ledger/no prob after all
Fm: David Sanchez 76200,2476
To:  76264,142

Joseph,

After further investigation I see why some of the entries are highlighted.
Negative Balances! Great! The minor problem I saw was just a frame of mind I
guess. Now that I see the reasoning behind it, it is not strange at all.

Again, thanks for the program,

David

#: 4960 S1/General Interest
    07-Jul-90  16:58:53
Sb: OS-9 image processing
Fm: greg remington 76346,26
To: Robb Swanson 72567,1335

Robb, just saw your message, I'm doing software development for a
  small German image processing company, specializing in work for
  scientists, mostly Electron microscopists. Our hardware is all
  VME based, although we have our own image bus, you can't do real-
  time work at 20 MHz. We have our own frame grabbers, with and
  without real-time ALUs, FFT boards (sub-second 512x512 2D FFTs),
  Array processors, and lots more.  Send me a mail if you're interested in
literature.
  Just to give you a few hints about OS-9, we do all our development on our own
system. Coming from VAX/UNIX is a blow at first, but the TOPS utilities (many
thanks), and an OS-9 X Windows port to our CPU make it bearable.
  One tremendous advantage for system programmers (don't tell me you write bug
free software), is the fact that normal boot time is   about 30 secs. (with a
CMOS ram disk of 512k its less than 5   secs). I read many a good sci-fi novel
while waiting for a VAX or   Unix machine to boot after lightning or bad (read
my) system   programming.
  Complaints about disk time (it can be slow) during development are only a
problem for systems with limited RAM. For image processing systems with 4-64
Mb, a 1 Mb ram disk solves any caffeine overdose problems, I can't pick up my
cup faster... When you're done with
  development, throw out the ram disk if you need to!
  The lack of a good FORTRAN compiler is a thorn for some of our customers, but
the C compiler and debugger are acceptable, although nothing to write home
about. The important selling points for us
  were;

  - 4 Gb 680x0 linear address space
  - uSec interrupt latency
  - rich process communication tools
  - overall OS simplicity/clarity
  - OS manuals under 10 feet and 100 lbs

  We'll never go back...
   

#: 4962 S1/General Interest
    07-Jul-90  18:39:43
Sb: #0S-9 for MS-DOS?
Fm: David Biediger 72627,1504
To: ALL

 Please excuse my ignorance, but is OS-9 available for MS-DOS computers? A
response to a message of mine on a local BBS's Echomail section reccommended
OS-9 as one option for multitasking on a 386. I'm heavily invested in MS-DOS
software right now and need to explore all my options for multitasking
environments besides Windows 3.0 and Desqview. Any and all responses will be
greatly appreciated.

-David

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4963 S1/General Interest
    07-Jul-90  19:03:35
Sb: #4962-0S-9 for MS-DOS?
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: David Biediger 72627,1504 (X)

OS-9000, sort of "son of OS-9," runs on 80386 computers.  The 64K segments of
80x86, x < 3, would make it darned near impossible to do the things that OS-9
likes to do, unless one went with perpetual "large mode" addressing.

#: 4966 S1/General Interest
    07-Jul-90  22:47:02
Sb: #4962-0S-9 for MS-DOS?
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: David Biediger 72627,1504 (X)

Hi David,

While OS-9 (a cpu-portable version called OS-9000, actually) is available for
the 80386 PCs, it doesn't (as far as I know) support MSDOS programs.

Windows 3.0 looks like your best bet at present.

Kev

#: 4964 S3/Languages
    07-Jul-90  20:50:29
Sb: #sqrt() function in C?
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: ALL

I have the need to use the sqrt() function in a C program. I have the latest
version of the Krieder lib. The docs state that there is an int sqrt(n)
function. When I try to link a program which uses it, I get it as an unresolved
reference. dEd of clib.l sure enough shows there is no sqrt() function. What
gives?!?

Zack

There are 2 Replies.

#: 4968 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  04:26:53
Sb: #4964-#sqrt() function in C?
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Zack Sessions 76407,1524 (X)

I'd be surprised if there were an int sqrt function.  I'd expect it to take a
double argument and return a double result.  Try clibt.l from the Kreider
library.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4971 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  10:06:08
Sb: #4968-#sqrt() function in C?
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: James Jones 76257,562 (X)

There is a double int function in clibt.l, I checked that. I also tried merging
clibt.l to the end of clib.l and then got a bunch of multiply defined symbols.
The docs DO state an int sqrt() function plain as day on page 39. The double
function would work just as well for me, but how do I use clibt.l AND clib.l at
the same time?

Zack

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4974 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  11:04:27
Sb: #4971-#sqrt() function in C?
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Zack Sessions 76407,1524 (X)

Jack -

(oops.. Zack)..

Don't merge 'em... Clibt is a superset of clib. The transcendentals are extra,
and all the math stuff is rewritten for speed at the sacrifice of size (in
Clibt). Otherwise, they're identical.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4993 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  13:56:42
Sb: #4974-sqrt() function in C?
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Like I said in my last message, it was moot. OK, I'll try clibt.l, and use the
double sqrt() function. [D

[D Zack

#: 4972 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  10:58:37
Sb: #4964-#sqrt() function in C?
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Zack Sessions 76407,1524 (X)

Zack -

Use Clibt.l instead.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 4992 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  13:55:20
Sb: #4972-sqrt() function in C?
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

What about function references to functions in clib.l? Does clibt.l provide
those functions? I have two other message I haven't read yet, so this message
may ne moot.

Zack

#: 4969 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    08-Jul-90  04:56:50
Sb: TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: sysop (X)

SYSOP!

Uploaded disk 3 of the TOP - Munich Release 2.0 series.

#: 4973 S6/Applications
    08-Jul-90  11:00:30
Sb: #.PAK files?
Fm: Ken Drexler 75126,3427
To: Bob van der Poel

Bob

I just downloaded your update on the spell checker.  The download went fine but
how do I unPAK the files. (This may be the dumb question of the week.) Is the
pak/unpack program specific to the CoCo? Is a copy here?  I have been using the
spell checker some but it is slooooow, so any improvement is welcome.

Thanks for the help.

Ken

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5002 S6/Applications
    08-Jul-90  15:41:37
Sb: #4973-.PAK files?
Fm: Wendell Benedetti 72766,2605
To: Ken Drexler 75126,3427

Ken,

Look in Lib 10 under Pak.bin. That should do it.

Wendell

#: 4998 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  15:18:20
Sb: #still sqrt() problems
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: ALL

OK, I am now using clibt.l. So how come the following program:

#include <stdio.h> main() {
    double x, y;
    pffinit();
    x = 36;
    y = sqrt(x);
    printf("Th
 square root of %f is %f\n",x,y); }

Gives the following output:

The square root of 36.000000 is 0.000000

Zack

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5004 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  17:26:51
Sb: #4998-#still sqrt() problems
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Zack Sessions 76407,1524 (X)

Zak -

Do you have the sqrt() routine declared as returning a double?

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5005 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  18:33:14
Sb: #5004-still sqrt() problems
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Oh, gosh, you're right! Default type for a function is int, isn't it. <blush>

Zack

#: 5008 S3/Languages
    08-Jul-90  22:05:17
Sb: #4998-still sqrt() problems
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Zack Sessions 76407,1524 (X)

Because C lets you sleaze out and not declare functions, assuming them to
return int.  sqrt() doesn't return an int, it returns a double--so the code
generated for main probably snarfs the least-significant sixteen bits of the
double returned and treats it like an int, which probably gives you a zero.

Either explicitly declare "double sqrt();" or put in the directive "#include
<math.h>".
{{_
#: 5001 S15/Hot Topics
    08-Jul-90  15:31:37
Sb: #Special! QUICK!
Fm: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004
To: all

All,

A few days ago, I posted a special offer on $50 off of a preordered MM/1.
Response has been very nice, thank you. However, because of that, we are
cancelling the offer as of July 20.

So, you stragglers out there need to check out the upload in Hot Topics, see
what the deal is, and ponder.

Thanks!

Paul

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5082 S15/Hot Topics
    11-Jul-90  14:12:44
Sb: #5001-Special! QUICK!
Fm: Jim Williams 72157,3524
To: Paul K. Ward 73477,2004

Hmm... does the $50 affect developer kits?                 --Eet--


                                   Director of Mayhem
                                  Extra Terrestrial Imports, Ltd.



#: 5007 S1/General Interest
    08-Jul-90  21:36:19
Sb: #Library
Fm: James Whitaker 70355,431
To: sysop (X)

The library is full to the quota again.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5010 S1/General Interest
    08-Jul-90  23:03:50
Sb: #5007-Library
Fm: Mike Ward 76703,2013
To: James Whitaker 70355,431 (X)

I'll see what I can squeeze out of it here shortly.




#: 5015 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    09-Jul-90  04:01:35
Sb: #TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: [F] Wayne Day 76703,376 (X)

Sysop!

Started to upload the second part of the UUCP package in dl12.  Got message
that the library was full.  Can you expand it?

Ed

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5020 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    09-Jul-90  09:49:52
Sb: #5015-TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Wayne Day 76703,376
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

We've requested additional space from the forum support folks at CompuServe,
and hopefully the library will be able to handle your upload this afternoon, or
evening.

Wayne

#: 5022 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    09-Jul-90  11:13:18
Sb: #5015-#TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Steve Kincade 70065,1124
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Hello, For myself, as for many of i am sure, your uploads are great, but simply
too big (cost wise) to download. Is there any way that I/we can get the files
sent on diskette? Signed, Steve Kincade, 70065,1124



There is 1 Reply.

#: 5041 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    10-Jul-90  06:53:51
Sb: #5022-#TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: Steve Kincade 70065,1124 (X)

Hi Steve!

Yes, Send me a check for $50.00.  I'll send you the discs (15 of them). The
only format I can handle right now is MIZAR (16/16) but that shouldn't be a
problem.  Let me know whether you want 3 1/2" or 5 1/4".

Send to:

     Ed Gresick
     Delmar Co
     PO Box 78
     Middletown, DE  19709


Give me about two to three weeks to get them out.

Ed

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5067 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    11-Jul-90  09:30:19
Sb: #5041-TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Steve Kincade 70065,1124
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312

Thanks for the info, I will get it right out to you. My disk system is the
format of mfm 80 trk,is your system compatable?



#: 5023 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    09-Jul-90  14:00:23
Sb: #TOP Utilities
Fm: Mark Wuest 74030,332
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312 (X)

Ed,
 I downloaded disk 1 and noticed a couple of things.
 1) You have a file in the archive called /h1/readme that requires one to
actually *have* a device /h1 to un-tar the file. (I moded'ed my /r0 to be /h1
temporarily).
 2) The versions of vi and stevie on the diskette, like the ones on their
earlier release do not support termcap properly. Specifically, they do not
delay when the termcap entry says to, but send out the numeric entry to the
terminal. This is in case you have a way to get feedback to them. Thanks for
the uploads!
 Mark

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5046 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    10-Jul-90  19:00:39
Sb: #5023-TOP Utilities
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: Mark Wuest 74030,332 (X)

Hi Mark!

I caught the '/h1/readme' problem.  Uploads beginning with disc 3 corrected
this problem.  If necessary, I can re-upload disks 1 and 2.

Re termcap support for 'stevie' and 'vi' - I'll send TOP a fax asking for a
correction (and/or source code).

Ed

#: 5059 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    11-Jul-90  05:12:43
Sb: #5023-TOP Utilities
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: Mark Wuest 74030,332 (X)

Mark,

The first line should read - I caught the '/h1/readme' problem.  Uploads
beginning disc 3 corrected the problem.  Hate to do it, but if you feel it
wise, I can re-upload disks 1 and 2.

Ed

#: 5030 S1/General Interest
    09-Jul-90  19:48:16
Sb: #Bug/Vuris Warning
Fm: PHILLIP TAYLOR 72067,3430
To: ALL

********************************* * WARNING   WARNING   WARNING   *
********************************* * TSPELL for Os9 Level 2 has    * * Either a
Bug or a virus in the* * program,And will crash if your* * Using a Hard Drive.
* *********************************

There are 3 Replies.

#: 5033 S1/General Interest
    09-Jul-90  20:29:14
Sb: #5030-Bug/Vuris Warning
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: PHILLIP TAYLOR 72067,3430

Hi Philip.... we don't have viruses (sp?), but a bug is possible. What were you
doing when it crashed you? Perhaps someone knows the reason/a patch.
 kev

#: 5035 S1/General Interest
    09-Jul-90  21:20:47
Sb: #5030-Bug/Vuris Warning
Fm: David Borgelt 71550,1323
To: PHILLIP TAYLOR 72067,3430

Phillip, I have been using TSPELL for under Level II for a couple of years and
I have yet to experience the bug to which you are referring.  As a matter of
fact, it is running in another window right now.  Yep, and I am running it on a
hard drive, too.  What are you doing exactly when the crash happens?

Dave Borgelt

#: 5036 S1/General Interest
    09-Jul-90  21:33:52
Sb: #5030-Bug/Vuris Warning
Fm: Zack Sessions 76407,1524
To: PHILLIP TAYLOR 72067,3430

Huh??? I've been using T/S Spell for over a year on a HD with out a single
problem. What gives?

Zack

#: 5039 S10/Tandy CoCo
    10-Jul-90  02:25:56
Sb: #Dedicated CoCo3
Fm: LARRY OLSON 72227,3467
To: all


   Has anyone messed around with converting the CoCo3 to a ROM based OS9
system? What would be involved or is it even possible ? Does it just involve
putting some EPROMS in the memory map in place of some of the RAM ?
   The purpose of putting OS9 in EPROM is to come up with an inexpensive
dedicated home controller.
   Any help or ideas are welcomed.

   Larry Olson
   72227,3467

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5043 S10/Tandy CoCo
    10-Jul-90  10:00:35
Sb: #5039-#Dedicated CoCo3
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: LARRY OLSON 72227,3467 (X)

Larry -

The only catch is that you'd have to use a larger EPROM... say 32K. Even on
most ROM based OS9 systems (well, the early ones), only the OS9p1 and Boot code
reside in ROM/EPROM. The rest is dragged in with the OS9Boot file. I'd say that
you might even be able to get away with a 16K EPROM if you were using an
extremely shaved down system.

Pete

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5044 S10/Tandy CoCo
    10-Jul-90  14:15:14
Sb: #5043-#Dedicated CoCo3
Fm: LARRY OLSON 72227,3467
To: Pete Lyall 76703,4230 (X)

Pete,
     I guess I have to do some more thinking about what I want. I was thinking
along the lines of eliminating the floppy drives, but after some more thought I
guess the drives would make it alot easier to change/update any of the control
routines. Maybe I should be thinking along the lines of a solid-state drive
with battery backup. Another possibility I guess would be to modify the CoCo3
so that if the power drops out the memory would be saved by a battery backup
system. I'm just not sure how OS9 would react. If a circuit detected that the
power has fallen below a set point, and this circuit then put the memory on
battery power while killing the power to the rest of the computer, how would
OS9 react when the power was restored? Would it start up from where it left off
?
   Just thinking out loud
      Larry Olson



There are 2 Replies.

#: 5045 S10/Tandy CoCo
    10-Jul-90  16:03:50
Sb: #5044-#Dedicated CoCo3
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: LARRY OLSON 72227,3467 (X)

Larry - in an MOTD not long ago, there was an article about a greenhouse
controller built around a coco-3 and os9. What they did was to use that 512K
battery-backed ram you see advertised in Rainbow. It was their ramdisk and boot
device. That allowed them to change things around, but still always reboot
after a power failure.

It might also be possible to write a special interrupt-driven driver, which
would be triggered by a coming power loss.... it would save out the entire
state of the machine to ramdisk (probably to a partition so it doesn't go thru
rbf) and set a flag for the reboot routine to reload that saved state and
return as if nothing had ever happened. Altho you'd probably want to note it in
the logbook <grin>.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5057 S10/Tandy CoCo
    11-Jul-90  02:43:10
Sb: #5045-Dedicated CoCo3
Fm: LARRY OLSON 72227,3467
To: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227 (X)

Keven,  Thanks, I had forgotten about that article in MOTD. (oops i not e)

      Maybe you wouldn't need to worry about saving the current state if all
the state flags were on the ramdisk and all the program did was read and/or
update these flags. The program could be autostarted after reboot and just
start reading the sensors and checking/setting state flags.

   Have to give this some more thought......
   Larry

#: 5084 S10/Tandy CoCo
    11-Jul-90  16:23:42
Sb: #5044-Dedicated CoCo3
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: LARRY OLSON 72227,3467

Larry -

I'd say best bet is to let the system reboot, and then have a startup script
(and other measures... say CRON based backups) that help you recover from the
power failure.

Pete

#: 5056 S2/Tutorials
    11-Jul-90  00:00:02
Sb: #programmin in basic09
Fm: DAVID DE FEO 71630,721
To: all

Hi, I need help from one of you programming gurus(of which I hope to be
one...someday).  I'm learning basic09.  The big question I have is why would I
ever want to use a sequential access file over a random access file.  Random
access files are faster (since there is no ascii conversion when "put"ting or
"get"ting data.  Also, you can find the position of any record easily with the
seek/size commands while putting data anywhere you specify.  Please don't let
me look toooooo dumb :-). Dave

There are 2 Replies.

#: 5058 S2/Tutorials
    11-Jul-90  05:07:32
Sb: #5056-programmin in basic09
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: DAVID DE FEO 71630,721

Depends.  If records aren't of fixed length, it might be necessary to read a
file sequentially.  On the other hand, there may be various pieces of
index/pointer stuff in a file such that it isn't straightforward to read it
sequentially.  Also, some applications require reading every record, so you
might as well read it sequentially (and sequential access is more predictable,
so that any caching scheme is more likely to help you out with sequential
access).

Quite a few files can be read either way.

Not a very specific answer, but it depends enough on the application that I
can't give a very specific answer.  Time to snarf yourself a reference work on
data structures and file organization.

#: 5083 S2/Tutorials
    11-Jul-90  15:09:30
Sb: #5056-programmin in basic09
Fm: Kevin Darling (UG Pres) 76703,4227
To: DAVID DE FEO 71630,721

Hi David,

If you meant database files, then yup, a random access file makes more sense by
far. And as you said, the size/seek/get/put commands can be combined in very
powerful ways.

You'll still use sequential files for writing out reports, etc tho.

best - kev

#: 5060 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    11-Jul-90  06:27:47
Sb: #TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Ed Gresick 76576,3312
To: SYSOP (X)

Sysop,

I've uploaded disks 5 and 7 of the TOP - Munich Release 2.0 to dl 12.

What are the commands to edit the material uploaded?  Several of the
descriptions I've previously uploaded are incorrect and I'd like to change
them.

Ed

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5062 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    11-Jul-90  06:41:32
Sb: #5060-TOP - Munich Release 2.0
Fm: Dan Robins 73007,2473
To: Ed Gresick 76576,3312

Ed,
  Scoot up to the LIB and BROwse the file. When you are at the "Disposition"
prompt, type:  CHA
   You'll be prompted if you want to change the Description, Keywords, and
Title. Answer accordingly on what you want to change. Do remember, when you
change to Description file, it's almost the same as if you were in the message
editor. So you can use the  /T (top) /Pxx (print xx lines) and such commands
like you were writing a message.
   Dan

#: 5066 S1/General Interest
    11-Jul-90  08:28:53
Sb: #CP.AR
Fm: Paul Hanke 73467,403
To: All

Thanks to those who answered a previous request for info on a copy command
supporting wildcards.  I have downloaded some and have puzzled over a few. 
Such as  2 versions of CP.AR, and CP.BIN in dl9.
How does one get these going as the docs are absent or very lean?   -ph-

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5086 S1/General Interest
    11-Jul-90  16:55:35
Sb: #5066-CP.AR
Fm: Pete Lyall 76703,4230
To: Paul Hanke 73467,403

Paul -


Piece of proverbial cake:

use 1:

  cp pathname1  pathname2

Copies the file listed in pathname1 to the file listed in pathname2. Examples:

 cp foo /dd/tmp/woof
 cp erf snerf
 cp /dd/cmds/dir /dd/cmds/ls

use 2:

 cp pathname1 pathname2 ... pathnameN directory

Copies all files named into the directory specified. The last argument MUST be
a directory (and is checked for that before any copying is done):

 cp *.c *.h /dd/tmp/C_sources
 cp /dd/cmds/* /dd/lib/* /dd/defs/* /dd/BIG_MOMMA_DIR

Pete

#: 5070 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    11-Jul-90  12:17:41
Sb: #Reading OS9 directorys
Fm: George Hendrickson 71071,2003
To: [F] All

Could you tell me where I can find some information that will help me to learn
about reading OS9 directorys? Is there a text file or something that explains
that or is there a book available somewhere that will show me how to get all
the information that I need on a file? ex: attrs, late date/time modified,
filesize etc.. I am in the process of writing a utility for my OS9 BBS that I
run and am having trouble understanding a few things. Thanks for the help.

George



There is 1 Reply.

#: 5092 S12/OS9/68000 (OSK)
    11-Jul-90  20:05:07
Sb: #5070-Reading OS9 directorys
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: George Hendrickson 71071,2003

There's not all that much to it.  An OS-9 directory is a sequence of 32-byte
records, each containing either (1) NUL ($00) as the first byte, indicating an
entry that is not in use (when you delete a file, its entry in the directory is
marked inactive this way) or (2) a 29-byte file name, terminated by having the
MSB of the last character of its name set, and a 3-byte LSN for the file
descriptor sector of the file named in the first 29 bytes of the record.

If you're writing a utility to read directories, be sure to avoid endlessly
recurring by noticing the entries for "." and ".."!  (This is the voice of
experience speaking! <grin>)

The file descriptor sector contains, among other things, owner, time of
creation and last modification, and file size.

The gory details are all to be found in the section on RBF (the Random Block
file manager) in the OS-9 Technical Manual.

#: 5088 S10/Tandy CoCo
    11-Jul-90  17:39:33
Sb: Sound files
Fm: James Whitaker 70355,431
To: All

I have uploded 6 more sound files for the PLAY command to Data Library 10. They
are: playit.pak, whodid.pak, snatch.pak, itsliv.pak, meltin.pak, and
frnkly.pak.

#: 5089 S3/Languages
    11-Jul-90  18:50:13
Sb: #Basic09
Fm: Floyd Resler 72500,2572
To: all

I have a couple questions about BASIC09.  Does something get messed up when you
use a GOSUB or call another procedure between EXITIF and ENDEXIT?  For example,
   EXITIF variable>2 THEN
   GOSUB 200
   ENDEXIT

   or

   EXITIF variable>2 THEN
   RUN program
   ENDEXIT

  In either of the above examples, control returns after the ENDEXIT not at the
bottom of the loop.  Am I doing something wrong or is this just a problem with
BASIC09?


Question 2: Sometimes, while in the trace mode, I'll hit a STOP in the my
program will end (of course).  However, from that point forward, all results of
variable manipulation are displayed whether I'm in trace or not.  Is there any
way to stop this other than restarting BASIC09?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 5093 S3/Languages
    11-Jul-90  20:10:23
Sb: #5089-Basic09
Fm: James Jones 76257,562
To: Floyd Resler 72500,2572

I just tried a simple example with the GOSUB in the EXITIF THEN clause, and did
not have the problem you describe.  I'd take a close look at the contents of
the subroutine.

#: 5090 S10/Tandy CoCo
    11-Jul-90  19:09:53
Sb: Arc/Unarc Coco 3
Fm: Denise Tomlinson 71021,3274
To: Sysop (X)

Is there any documentation on "arc.os9" for a Coco 3? I can unarc a file with
it ok, but can't seem to get the right command or pathlist to arc a file My
command line was (using () for slash marks): (D0)arc.os9 -u (D1)Clair.ume Do I
have to supply a destination file? or does the tool ask for one before arcing?
Thanks, Denise

Press <CR> !>