
1 If you are in need of help, you need but ask...
2 ************************* INSTALLED: 22 SEP 85 *********************
3 Welcome to BWMS (BackWater Message System)  Mike Day System operator
4 ************************************************************
5 GENERAL DISCLAIMER: BWMS IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INFORMATION
6                     PLACED ON THIS SYSTEM.
7 BWMS was created as an electronic bill board. BWMS is a privately owned
8 and operated system which is currently open for use by the general public.
9 No restrictions are placed on the use of the system. As the system is
10 privately owned, I retain the right to remove any and all messages which
11 I may find offensive. Because of the limited size of the system, it will be
12 periodically purged of messages. (only 629 lines of data can be saved)
13 To leave a message, type 'ENTER' and use ctrl/C or break to get out of the
14 ENTER mode. The message is automatically stored. If after entering the
15 message you find you made a mistake, use the replace command to replace
16 the line. To exit from the system, type 'OFF' then hang up.
17 Type 'HELP' to see other commands that are available on the system.
18 *****************************************************************
19 
20 (&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)
21 Hey! Ahem not being one to gloat... but... AT THE TOP!!!!
22 (&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&) Dren (&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)(&)
23 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
24 Tell me no more of minds embracing minds,
25   And hearts exchanged for hearts;
26 That spirits spirits meet, as winds do winds,
27   And mix thier subt'lest parts;
28 That two unbodied essences may kiss,
29 And then like angels, twist and feel one bliss.
30 
31 I was that silly thing that once was wrought
32   To practise this thin love:
33 I climbed from sex to soul, to thought;
34   But thinking there to move,
35 Headlong I rolled from thought to soul, and then 
36 From soul I lighted at the sex again.
37 
38 As some strict down-looked men pretend to fast,
39   Who yet in closets eat;
40 So lovers who profess they spirits taste,
41   Feed yet on grosser meat;
42 I know they boast they souls to souls convey,
43 Howe'er they meet, the body is the way.
44 
45 Come, I will undeceive thee, they that tread
46   Those vain aerial ways,
47 Are like young heirs and alchemists misled
48   To waste their wealth and days,
49 For searching thus to be forever rich,
50 They only find a medicine for the itch.
51                              William Cartwright
52 
53 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
54 
55 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
56  WHERE ARE MY MESSAGES?PUDMAN-MUD ON THE MACHINES.
57 
58 --------------------------------
59 Okay, is tere any user out there that has heard of a program called 'Tekterm'?
60 If so, please leave a message for Mark here in the near furture.  If you
61 haven't heard of Tekterm, ask a friend, THEN leave me a message about it.
62 --------------------------------
63 {O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}
64      A cold lifeless form lies amid the clothes.  Laying quiet-
65 ly, it is as if there were no life to motivate the body at all. 
66 But as the grey light of the morning creeps in the window, it 
67 finally begins to stir.   A hand streaches out...grasping, 
68 searching for something.  Finally it finds its prize, a pillow. 
69 Drawing it back, the form becomes silent once again, holding 
70 the pillow closly to its bossom. 
71      I lay in that state between wakefulness and sleep.  The 
72 world drifts in shadow and change.  A longing I cannot describe 
73 or understand overcomes me, and I reach out for what is not 
74 there.  My hand touches something solid, I grasp at it, and 
75 pull it near.  My senses fill with a delightful smell.  The 
76 touch, it is silken smooth, and my ears echo her silent sigh 
77 as I hold her in my arms once again. 
78      Her head next to mine, each breath intermingling.  I touch 
79 her sweet soft lips with mine. And the world dissolves into 
80 dream.  Am I still holding her?  Is this form real? The head 
81 that rests on my shoulder breathing soft warm air, is it really 
82 there?  Does the soft sigh I hear really come from her lips?  
83 How long has it been since there was even an inkling of such 
84 feelings?  To feel at peace with the world, to feel as one, to 
85 know no sorrow, to feel no pain.  Is this the true meaning to 
86 life? Is this what I truly strive for, this feeling of content-
87 ment, of eternal peace? 
88      How long have I denied this feeling?  How long has it lain 
89 hidden in the depths of my mind?  And who is this shadow that 
90 wakens it from the long dark rest, to cause me to think such 
91 things again?  Old doors are opened, and the delicous sweet 
92 smell of perfume fills the corridors of my mind, displacing the 
93 musty stale metalic air of forgetfulness.  One touch, and I am 
94 quivering to my very soul.  A look from those cool green eyes, 
95 and I melt into a small helpless child.  One smile from her, 
96 and it is eternally spring.
97      I move to kiss her forhead, to stroke her warm brown hair, 
98 but I find in my arms only a pillow, and the shadow of a memory 
99 never seen.  And in the cold morning light softly I cry for 
100 that which is not there.
101 {O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}X{O}
102 
103 HELP I am going to be on the rad for an interview about Bulletin Boards
104 and the dreaded "HACKERS" the press defination
105 you know the outlaws...people who wish to break into systems regularly...the interview can be by 
106 phone if you wish and first names only will be used
107 iof you are one or know of one PLEASE call me at 288 xxxx...thanks
108 Bill Marx CBBS/NW Sysop
109 
110 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
111 Is there something wrong with my leaving a message for Pudman on your BBS? 
112 Pudman is his video signature, and the only name I know him by.  He ask me to 
113 leave him some messages here, but they seem to keep dissapearing.
114 DEAR MR. SYSOP, PLEASE REPLY
115                Sincerely,
116                   RHD inc.
117 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
118 -+-   117/605    -JUGGLER-   -+-
119 !!!!!! Pudman !!!!!!
120 Just a quick note to let you know that I saw your earlier message.  Let me know
121 if this gets through to you or not.  I escaped from Phantasia, by the by,
122 and I gave Doug a Royal hint as to how he might also do it.  I also made a 
123 suggestion as to how he might get the water rhune.  Well, adios for now.
124                  True as they come,
125                     RHD inc.
126 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
127 [/]
128 *******************************************************************
129 good romantic stuff, sometimes i wish i could think in such modes.
130 *****************************kathyd********************************
131 -+-   -+-   And sometimes I wish I wouldn't..  Beat to the punch. -+-   -+-
132 -+-   -+-   Why isn't the phone answered?       -+-   -JUGGLER-   -+-   -+-
133  
134 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
135  
136 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
137   Perhaps the subtlest reality of all is that bone-encased reality that
138 nestles within the skull.  Here, the subtle drift of chemicals in minute
139 amounts mixes with nearly imperceptable electrical charges, weaving its
140 net that includes (for us) not only the universe, but all imaginable
141 universes.  Just as a craftsman in software for silicon-based systems
142 works at various levels of abstraction in his work, we who write for the
143 wetware of the living systems work in levels and levels of abstraction.
144   We can tell the truth by lying, and dissemble by telling only truths.
145 How then can judgements be made?  When the ground supporting the transit
146 quivers and shakes, and the surveyor's chain stretches and shrinks, how
147 can we chart these realms with accuracy?  We have only reports of the
148 explorers in these lands; their tales are wonderous and strange.  We cannot
149 know with certaintude just how to reconcile the differences, but must
150 remember that the internal vocabulary is likely different, one from the
151 other.  We can assume a common basic organization, but details assuredly
152 will change.
153   To a sensitive perception the use of many of the "mental energys" is
154 obvious.  To most, it appears as a subtle play of colors; to some, a
155 sound or smell.  Within the pell-mell, in a small chamber devoid of
156 most of the decorations that had amused the party for so long, lay two
157 bodies.  Two young women, similar in age and size, shared an uneasy
158 unconciousness, one physically strong and healthy through choice, the
159 other near death.  To a sensitive observer, the play of mental color, the
160 scent of the chase, the symphony of still-untrained energies would be
161 extremely unsettling; to the unsensitive, all was quiet and still.
162 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
163 pppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
164   Shaken by a final convulsion, the piper's body accepted at last the
165 necessity to go on living.  Exhausted by the struggle, the piper slipped
166 from the exhausting convulsive coma into a resting, natural sleep.
167 ppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
168 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
169 Cragmore had mind-sent "Piper seems to be-" just before my fatigue caught up
170 to me.  The dust I had so painfully collected and held drifted into a neat
171 little pile, to be collected by a small cleaning robot who soon vanished into
172 a panel.  I tried feebly to signal Cragmore.  I could not hold, so let go.
173 Again vertigo, but exhaustion dulled it to something that could be dealt with.
174 Suddenly, blackness engulfs me.  Not even the little points of light that
175 were my companions on the outgoing trip ventured here- I was alone.  And just
176 as suddenly, I HURT - my hands especially - as if I had been plunged into a
177 kettle of molten iron.  Nature is kind to those so hurt.  I passed out.
178 ++++++++++++++++++
179 "Will he be okay?"  Grann asked.
180 "Yah, I think he will.  At least he don't have that 'twilight zone' look to
181 him anymore.  He's just sleeping."  the Doctor tried to make his voice sound
182 confident.  He wasn't managing it very well.
183 "I'll go up to the control room and study.  Can you watch him?"
184 "Sure, Grann."
185 Grann wound his way through the nearly endless corridors that was the TARDIS
186 with an uncanny ability to find his destination by the most direct route.
187 He emerged, of course, in the control room.  Making sure the Doctor was not
188 watching via one of the several dozen closed-circuit cameras, Grann started
189 on a spell of his own.
190 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Milchar ++++++++++++ 23 Sept 85, 9:56am +++++++++
191 ########################################
192 *** To:  OLDSPICE ***
193 I have heard of your soon recent tripto The Land Of The Morning Calm, and 
194 think it best to warn you of the dangers of the terrible Sang-ang   
195 contaminated Po-gee.  I know of the attacks upon your personage from before,
196 and feel that I must warn you that the damage from these attacks is
197 accumulitive.  I think it well advised that you take precaution, by wearing
198 the protective rubber outer-garmet that you are provided with.  Another good
199 solution is to settle down to a more nearly mundain lifestyle, and Yo-bo 
200 yourself out.  Beware of the deadly Sang-ang, and know this... It got
201 Stilly where he lived.  Enjoy life safely, by taking minor precaution.
202                   As ever,
203              **** RHD inc. ****
204 ########################################
205 @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
206 *** To:  Dwarf Chight ***
207 SHAME<, OH SHAME, ON YOU.  Keeping your mommy awake 'til so very late last
208 night, with out so much as a telephone call.  Friends to were worried, but
209 with nodding heads and knowing smiles, we understand completely.  You 
210 have stopped thinking with your head with a brain, and have chosen to think
211 not at all.  Ah, LOVE.
212                  Ain't love grand,
213                  **** RHD inc. ****
214 
215 @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
216 I NOTE WITH INTREST THE VARIED ATTEMPTS AT ART. SOME ARE GOOD SOME ARE LESS
217 THAN GOOD. WOWEVER ONE THOUGHT CONTINUES TO CROSS MY MIND
218 CONNOT THESE PEOPLE AFFORD TO
219 RUB OFF THE SERIAL NUMBERS WHEN THEY STEAL SOMEONE ELSES WORK? OR AM I THE 
220 ONLY ONE WHO NOTES STRANGE SIMULARITIES TO PUBLISHED WORKS?
221  
222 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\marker\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
223  
224 no.....you aren't alone.......David...
225 ................>................>..
226 
227 .......................................
228 darn it...I knew once I got in this
229 separate reality it would be extremely
230 difficult to find the door out I had
231 enter in.   And on this adventure there
232 was no Guru...No Bagwhan Shree Rajanyone to help traverse this trail.
233 What does one do when Sheela's gone?
234 
235 
236 //OFF
237 
238 /off
239 don't you wish I could remember the magic incantation that would remove
240                           POINT-COUNTERPOINT
241 
242 Point:The alarming rise in affairs of young women with older men.
243 
244       What is this scourge that is crossing the nation's singles hangouts,
245 bars, and bedrooms? We have all seen the sight. The young, attractive,
246 vibrant woman accompanied, no possessed, by a Svengali-like old man of
247 uestionable merit and honor. What induces these women to fall for such
248 human fossils? Is this phenomenon indicative of our society? Are these
249 young women seeking irregular relationships because they are unfull-
250 filled with conventional dating and interpersonal patterns? Let's take
251 a closer look at some of the ingredients to this sickening cornucopia
252 we have cooked up for ourselves, and examine some of the common reasons
253 given for these actions.
254 
255 "It is purely physical." Of course, and as we all know the male of the
256 species is at his sexual peak in his late teens-very early twenties.
257 It is a law of nature that from beyond that time frame the physical
258 sexual performance will never be considered, for lack of a better
259 term, as adept. Experience must remain as the sole rationalization,
260 and even that criteria must be examined carefully in order not to
261 over-emphasize its importance.
262 
263 "He's much more well-to-do that men my age." We see here the importance
264 of financial means over physical and emotional designs. In one word,
265 Money. Dollars and cents over-ride common sense, and men are chosen
266 based on the amount of material wealth they possess, regardless of
267 their other negative attributes. This bodes well for the conventional
268 SugerDaddy-seeking young woman who places social stature and worldly
269 goods above all else.
270 
271 "He can teach me so much about life." Life is not some classroom to
272 be set in and lectured about. Life is the extreme form of one-the-
273 job training. It must be experienced for one's self, not taught
274 like a subject next to Biology 101 and Algebra. If these women
275 seek teachers of Life rather than partners to experience Life with
276 perhaps the path they have chosen is the correct one. It seems a
277 terrible waste to atrophy the Life experience by depending on
278 another person's interpretation of the world.
279 
280 "He reminds me of my Father." Apparently males are not alone with their
281 alleged mother-complexes. Females have a complementary complex with their
282 fathers. Of course this is the only conclusion that could be reached
283 after hearing a great deal of testimony on the subject. Young women are
284 seeking replacements for their fathers, who are always the first big
285 love of a young girl. These older lovers are merely playing a part
286 for a young woman who always wondered "What it would be like."
287 
288       The evidence is overwhelming. The proof is very clear. The causes
289 of this growing practice is apparent. The big question remains, What
290 can be done about it? Is there any hope for the future with such a
291 downward spiral of evolutionary relationships?
292 
293                           POINT-COUNTERPOINT
294  
295 
296 
297 :::::=====:::::=====
298 What was that all about?  
299 :::::=====:::::
300 Darbon:  I was hurried off the system last night by parents needing to use
301 phone.  I shall now try to rwrite what I had intended....
302 :::::=====:::::
303      Suddenly, the door creaked open and a sxaft of light fell upon me.  My
304 sleepy eyes made the picture before me very fuzzy, but soon it was clear.
305      A man it was, tall and slim.  He was wearing a seeming cross between
306 Roman and modern garb, and on his shirt (tunic/shirt, actually) was the 
307 symbol: DARBON.  In his hand was a small feather/pen and a scroll, and , 
308 even as he entered, he was writing on it.  The people seemed to know him, so
309 I guessed that he had been there before. He sat down near my table and 
310 asked another person something, though I couldn't make it out.  Then he gave
311 the scroll to the other person who began to read it.  He smiled and handed 
312 it back.  It was then that Darbon noticed the small bunny rabbit that
313 was eyeing his scroll curiously (me)....
314 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::==Zephyr::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::
315 .,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,
316 To ///Marker/// and David:  Innuendo is unbecoming.  If you truly see a rela-
317 tionship, please specify the individual responsible and the work to which you
318 refer.  Otherwise we must conclude you don't know what you're talking about.

319 To Point-Counterpoint:  Well, we see your point.  Where's the counterpoint?  An
320 article with that sort of designation should include both sides of a specifc
321 argument.  By the way, you might start by realizing that those older men also
322 probably don't spend great amounts of time pawing, grabbing, poking, ogling,
323 and manipulating the women.  Sometimes it nice to be with someone that just
324 wants to enjoy your company rather than looking for a way to relieve sexual and
325 hormonal pressures.  Besides, you
326 shouldn't assume that every time you see a young woman with an older man that
327 this is a May/December romance.  Unless that's the way your mind works.

328 .,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.Shana Alexander.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,
329 Point-Counterpoint: You mentioned something about be the men being more 
330 sexually experienced. I'll put in another little bit about sex drive.
331 A man's sex drive tends to start going down after 18, not real rapidly,
332 but by the time they are forty or what not many (now don't jump on me,
333 I didn't say ALL) don't have as much left. Getting around sixty, many
334 don't have anything but talk. Nevertheless, whether or not they do have
335 a considerable one or not, it is usually far less than they did in their
336 late teens. Women often don't reach their sexual peek until they are thirty,
337 maybe even forty. You can see, how a young woman might be better suited 
338 for an older man on just that basis.   Now why are so many young men out 
339 with older women? Is that suppose to be an Edipus-complex or the reverse
340 of this theory? 
341 (((*)))(((*)))((( RIPPLE )))(((*)))(((*)))
342 
343 
344 Point-CounterPoint:  a waste of space
345 
346 above: ditto to you
347 Zepher: you don't understand? Should you
348 understand? Heck, what do rabits know an
349 yway?
350 exit
351 |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
352 Have you ever considered that the one thing that an older man can offer
353 is love? Not physical love, but love in total, caring about the woman as
354 something other than a sexual object to be conquered. Perhaps this is 
355 what draws them, something they don't receive from the typical minuteman jock.
356 Then again, who really knows, probably there is no one reason, but rather many.
357 ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| fred ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
358 
359 Could it simply be that the young jocks are just jealous?
360 =================================================================
361 ***** tTo:  Dr. Stew ***** 
362 The number that you gave me is in error.  All that I get is a NO CARRIER
363 If I go dirrect, I get a YOU HAVE REACHED A NUMBER THAT IS NO LONGER IN S
364 SERVICE, PLEASE CONSULT YOUR DIRRECTORY message.  What gives?  I need the
365 real poop right away.
366 ***** From: RHD inc. *****
367 ********************************************************************************
368 point-counterpoint:       sounds like a personal problem to me, don't you 
369 want a nice young gal hanging around your shoulders when your 60?  Start
370 working on what you can do to attract them.
371 ****************************************kathyd**********************************
372 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
373 I agree with Kathy, and like her spirit!
374                        *** RHD inc. ***
375 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
376 [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] 
377   every person had requirement that they want the relationships in their 
378 life to meet.  whether they be spiritual, physical, monetary, social, sexual
379 of whatever else my appeal to them, it is their own business.  the only real
380 motive for POINT's little monologue seems to be jealousy.  why anyone would
381 restrict themselves to any one age group is beyond me, but that is, after all
382 their own business.  i can't expect them to think like me.
383   things seem to be pretty much equal, at least to me.  i see like numbers of
384 younger men with older women, even more so now that popular thinking seems to
385 be less critical of it.  i have on a number of occasions BEEN the younger man,
386 i know of what i speak.  mose of the women i have found to be attractive have 
387 (at least in recent years) been ten to fifteen years older that my own twenty-
388 five years.  social pressures are lessoning, but are still VERY real in these
389 situations.  the opposite situation is much more axcepted in the eyes of the 
390 public, something that POINT observed himself, if memory serves me.
391 [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] [/] THE TIN MAN [/] [/]
392 -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-
393       On the ground before me lies a small masterpiece.  The media used to
394 create this display was a mere patch of sand at the bank of a quietly flow-
395 ing current.  The imagery was drawn with a small fallen limb of a near-by
396 tree.  Sand is usually a pretty good media for those that wish to just draw
397 for drawing's sake.  In this case I would look at it and wish that it could
398 have been oil and canvas.  Maybe someday that chance shall come.
399       "What about that part over there?" I ask.  I know she'd seen me as I
400 approached for she motioned me to come closer.  She didn't quite understand
401 what I had asked.
402       "Yes?  What part?  Oh, I see."  As she had finished a portion of an-
403 other section of the drawing she had accidentally brushed away some signif-
404 icant detail made elsewhere.  "That should do it.  Does that make it look
405 any better?"
406       "Oh yes, very much so.  That's really a... unique drawing you've made
407 for yourself," I add.  "Is that figure in the center to be a knight?"
408       "A knight I guess.  Or maybe just the empty shell of a suit of armor.
409 It all depends on what you want it to be...  But the drawing isn't just for
410 me to look at.  They're for anybody that wants them."
411       "Anybody?  Then why do you wipe them away when you are finished?
412 Wouldn't you care for others to see them?  They are good you know, I find
413 this one quite interesting personally."  She heard what I had said but only
414 smiled.  She then looked back at the sand, I continued.  "You have saved
415 some of what you've done, haven't you?  On parchment, or maybe even paper?"
416       "Saved?  On parchment?"  She giggled.  "Don't be silly, that's for
417 people that are really good at it."  Then she had a sparkle in her eye.
418 "Why, do you know that I've seen a drawing of a Dragon once?  It was mar-
419 velous!  But I only try to draw that well.  I know my limits.  I'm not that
420 good yet...  But I will be!"  Slowly my head began to nod in agreement.
421             -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-
422 Ripple:  What we've discussed about writing was only a small portion.  Do
423       not do as I have done, don't knock what you've done.  Only by build-
424       ing may the individual reach the final construction.  Some skills are
425       slow to develop, but do they ever make you feel good once you have
426       developed!  (I'll have more on the morrow.)  (Call.)
427 (Counter)Point:  Yes, what about something that Ripple pointed out?  Some-
428       thing about us younger(?) men seeking/saught by older(?) women?
429 
One should be cautious with there definitions of older and younger though.
430 Ratios seem to stick in some people's minds, and a couple of years can make
431 all the difference in the world!    (Yowza!)
432 -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -+-   -JUGGLER-   -+-   -+-
433 
434 *********************************************************************************
435   The old woman sat at her table, her eyes held a glazed look as her mind s
436 searched the universe for Alex.   Alex, Leo and Ontho had left headquarters
437 months ago to aid in the pinpointing of radio transmissions that seemed to
438 be orginating near the planet Pluto.  Since then communications ceased and
439 several spaceships had mysteriously fanished, among them "the great guaran".
440 A strange name for a ship the old woman had once remarked.  Leo in her 
441 boundless energy explained that "Guaran" was a shortened version of 
442 "Guarantee" A seal of quality, great courage and faith.  With spunk like
443 that nothing could hold her back muzed the old woman as Leo inspected the
444 ship.
445    Many of the elders worried little for the trio, knowing Alex's talents
446 would ensure their safty dispite how much Ontho got in the way.  The old
447 was not among those, as leader she liked to know what her troups were up
448 to.  So long and no reports makes any sargent uneasy.  She closed her eyes
449 and leaned back on her chair.  "Oh where, oh where has my little Alex gone,
450 Oh where, oh where can he be"
451 ***************************kathyd***********************************************
452 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
453   Let's consider, for a moment, what is known of the young woman laying
454 wounded within a compartment of the pell-mell.  She had been on the strange
455 black plain when the piper arrived there, and seemed to have some knowlege
456 of both the properties of the area and how she had arrived there.  She
457 told the piper "you can call me ZEB", betraying some knowlege of the
458 pell-mell, if not its owner.  Even stranger, she claimed to be an inhabitant
459 of a reality of reversed entropy -- one in which the arrow of time moves
460 in the opposite direction.  
461   Her wound is self-inflicted.  She and the piper had agreed that the
462 destruction caused by their continued existence made it necessary to 
463 terminate that existence.  She had attempted to plunge a small knife,
464 taken from a sheath in the top of one of the piper's stockings, into her
465 heart.  She had been deflected in this aim by the piper, who (through
466 cowardace? compassion? hunch?) intercepted her deadly aim and recieved 
467 a freely-bleeding wound on one arm.  The mingled blood from the two caused
468 some strange breach in the reality plane beneath them and rescue was
469 soon accomplished by the piper's companions.
470   But what of the person behind these actions?  How did this young woman
471 gain the knowlege that she obviously had, if not about Trainor, at least
472 about his terminology?  What kind of person is this woman, and who is
473 she?  How did she get where she was, and how long had she been there?
474 These are all vital questions to the adventurers, questions that only
475 one person can answer, and she cannot be asked.  Even the lesser choice,
476 qestioning the piper, is not possible as he is slumped unconcious while
477 the events go on around the pell-mell.  Only the lady Tayree has the
478 necessary combination of skills and gender to make the perilous voyage
479 into the unkown inner world of this strange person.
480 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
481 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\marker II\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
482 Shana Alexander: While the marker was mine, the words above were not. When I 
483 have something to say, I use two (2) borders. Okay?
484 \\\\\\\\\\\\\innocent marker, saying nothing...\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
485 
486 I am shocked by the lack of considerate thought this experiment
487 received here. While some of the written material was constructive
488 criticism, there was also a great deal of personal attacks and
489 insults. If this is how kathy and others respond to an attempt
490 at a debate, no wonder this board has been so devoid of clear
491 non-combative discussion for so long.
492 
493 
494 COUNTERPOINT-POINT
495 
496      As was nicely pointed out by Ripple, Tin Man, and others, society
497 seems much more suspect of the Older woman-younger man relationship. This
498 appears to be another case of inequity and lack of understanding in our
499 society. An older man-young woman is considered normal, and in some cases,
500 very macho, while the older woman with a younger man is accused of
501 robbing the cradle and the younger man is accused of weakness for his
502 lack in finding someone his own age. Why must we always impress our
503 own moral and ethical standards on others that see fit not to follow
504 our examples? Why is such a stigma attached to the older woman-younger
505 man couple but not the converse? Why should age be such a determinant
506 factor at all?
507      The biological facts previously mentioned are quite true. Males
508 reach their sexual peak in their late teens and early twenties. For
509 females, this peak comes much later in life. As far as physical grouping
510 goes, it seems only natural that the peaking males and females be
511 matched up. In a biological sense, this is true, but what about the
512 more important emotional sense. There is more to a relationship than
513 physical involvement. In the ideal relationship, sex should not play
514 the leading role, but it should not be ignored either.
515      Our society has been based on the teacher-student model of learning.
516 My opponent pointed out that life should not be taught, it should be
517 experienced. While in essence this may be true, experience can also
518 be transferred from the teacher, in this case an older experienced mature
519 woman, to the student, a willing, able learner who seeks the knowledge
520 and joy the other can give. Older generations will always pass on what
521 they have learned to younger generations. There is no natural law that
522 says this passing can not involve emotional and sexual ties. The
523 bond between two lovers is the strongest and most complete bond that
524 exists for the transfer of information. The minds and hearts of two
525 people in love are on one plain, and this singularity of purpose 
526 induces teaching and learning of far more lasting effect than any
527 other method.
528      The most important thing for us to learn is that judgmental
529 characters are a constant thorn in the side of society. In as much
530 as we are all adept at jumping to conclusions and flying off the
531 handle, we should really find other modes of exercise.
532 
533 COUNTER POINT-POINT
534 ###############
535 ###############
536     And the peanut fell from the loftiness of the cloud.
537 It whooshed through the air heading straight down.  Through
538 the storms and pollution and smog.  It left the white of clouds
539 and the pollution of the city.  It sank faster than an elevator
540 towards the depths of the horizon.
541 It came down towards the green of squared off plains.
542 A slowly meandering river wound its way through the gently
543 rolling hills off to one side.  As it sped toward the ground,
544 the river fell further away.  The peanut saw the ground
545 and fell through.  A small hole marked the remains of the flight.
546 ##########################################################Palor######
547 ;';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';
548 POINT-COUNTERPOINT: AGE ALL TOO OFTEN HAS LITTLE TO WITH THE SITUATION.
549 I SPEAK FROM FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE. I AM 27 WHILE MY LADY FRIEND IS 36.
550 WHAT IT IS REALLY ABOUT IS FRIENDSHIP. I FOUND IN MANY CASES, A PERSON
551 OF THE FEMALE PERSUASION WHO ALSO MATCHED MY AGE ALL TOO OFTEN WAS MORE 
552 CONCERNED ABOUT HER MAKEUP, MY CAR OR MY BANK BALANCE. I ALSO, AT TIMES
553 FEEL A LITTLE MORE MATURE THAN MY AGE WOULD HAVE ME BE. SUCH IS LIFE.
554 I THEREFORE FEEL THAT THE CONCERN OVER AGE GROUPS IS UNWARRANTED. IT'S
555 WHAT MAKES YOU HAPPY AND COMFORTABLE THAT COUNTS, NOT WHAT OTHERS WANT
556 FOR YOU.  AND BY THE BY, MY MOM DOESN'T THINK THE CRADLE HAS BEEN, AHEM!
557 ROBBED. BEST WISHES AND CONTINUED LUCK IN YOUR SEARCH FOR THE TRUTH.
558 ;';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';';FINI FIN;';';';';;';';';';';';';';';';
559 :-]Max[-:
560 ((( RIPPLE )))(((*)))(((*)))(((*)))(((*)))
561 
562 We learn something from everything we do.  Even if what we learn is 
563 that we never want to do it again.  I have many male friends and many
564 of them are younger than me.  But I believe that the friendship you 
565 build with them is more important than anything else.  The physical
566 part of a relationship will come if it is supposed to,  but it is not
567 really something I impatiently wait for.  It will come maybe but if
568 not I still know I have a strong relationship that I can count on.
569 Having someone close that talk to, laugh with, and if need be I know 
570 I can ask for that hug that everyone needs once and a while.  TIN MAN
571 I think you know what I mean.....
572 
573 (((*)))(((*)))(((*)))(((*)))(((*)))((( RIPPLE )))
574 :::::=====:::::=====:::::
575      The small scroll was on the table next to mine.  It I tried to paw at 
576 (ch:It I tried/I tried to paw at) it but it was just beyond my reach.  DThe
577 man, Darbon, eyed me curiously.  Here, before him, was a small grey and whit
578 (ch whit/white) rabbit, pawing at his most recently written scroll.
579 :::::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::==Zephyr::=====:::::=====:::::=====:::::
580 WHhereas there have been dozens of reasons of why age is not important,
581 (all which I think are valid), there are others that lean the other
582 way. Such is a power-play in a relationship. Many times things can work
583 out just fine. Often times they don't. Particularly in those relationships
584 in which the younger party is considered "very" yuong in the eyes of
585 society. (Say, up to 25). The older person generally has more "life"
586 experience than the other and often has more control and power over the
587 relationship.             another point  .
588 *%_$*_)@*%_)!*#%)_!*%_)!*%_)!&%_)!&*%)_!&^)_@#^@_)*^@)_*!_)*%@_#)^&@)_*^@)_*
589 Mikey: Did you upload copylink to CIS yet? I hope my information was useful in your quest for country-wide
590 distribution. As of today, the adventures had been downloaded 130 times in the two boards (IBM and Tandy).
591 The money should be rolling in any day now (sigh)
592 *$_*$*%_)#@%*&#%(&%_!&%!_%&)@_#&%$$$ L'homme sans Parity $$$*$)#*$**@#%*)_@*%)_*^*)_%*@)_%**)_$!*$_)*_)$*!#*$@*$@
593 ]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
594 Anyone present played "Hacker" by Activision?  64, 128, Apple, and Atari
595 computer owners can now break into their very own private computer system,
596 and cause absolutely no harm to anyone/thing else.  Certain parts resemble
597 an adventure, others are more like puzzles.  Now if I can just remember that
598 level 4 security clearance code...
599 [[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[ UNDERGROUND [[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[

TOTAL NUMBER OF LINES = 599 
