Note: I seemed to have screwed up and deleted the whole disk on this 
one, not leaving the usual opening message. 

******************* REMOVED: 11 AUG 84 ********************************

LI
FILE ON
MARGIN IS 80 
STATUS: ENTER ONLY
NUMBER OF LINES: 588 
1 If you are in need of help, you need but ask....
2 
3 Whaddya know, now I'M at the top.....
4 Mikey, this is the sysop of CBBS/Aloha.  I'd like to feature 'back-issues' of BWMS on the modem section of CBBS/Aloha,
5 available for downloading at 1200 baud.  This would help prevent the problem of people missing disks if they don't
6 manage to get on every day or so.  CBBS/Aloha could easily spare around 250K or so.  What do you think?
7 
8 -------------------------------------
9 
10 POSSIBLY, SUGGEST YOU CONTACT THE ARCHIVE GROUP FOR ARANGMENTS IF YOUR
11 INTERESTED IN THE OLD BACKUPS. OF COURSE YOUR FREE TO DISEMINATE WHAT
12 EVER BACKUPS YOU GENERATE YOURSELF VIA DOWNLOADS.
13 ****************** CISTOP MIKEY ************************************
14 ///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\///\\\
15 To the person who stated that you can win over all by smoking 
16 joint, you are a total moron ( being nice here ). What has become
17 of BWMS?  All this talk, why don't you all talk about your income taxes?
18 That would be better than crime and prostitutes (only you guys could talk 
19 about) and other stuff. consider this, "life is unfair!!!" and that ihow
20 it is no atter what you do. still have any complaints? write you local
21 congressmen!
22 ///~\\\///~\\\///~\\\///~\\\///~\\\///~\\\///~\\\///~\\\///~\\\///
23 
24 
25 -HELLO
26 TO: ERIC O'BRIEN
27 HI ERIC, THOUGHT I WOULD TRY THIS BBS
28 
29 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
30 LAISSE-FAIRE, MY FEELINGS ON KILLING ARE BEST SHOWN IN THE BOOK'S OF HARRY HARRI
31 SON(WE'LL SEE IF THAT STIRS UP SOMETHING ) REALLY, TRUE SELF DEFENSE(MURDER IN 
32 HOT BLOOD)IN WHICH YOUR LIFE IS OBVIOUSLY IN DANGER, IS A FAR CRY FROM THE 
33 MURDER THAT I MENTIONED. ASK THIS, WHAT ARE THE PRIMARY PURPOSE OF ARMIES? 
34 DEFENSE? COME ON, IN A PEACEFUL WORLD?(ONE NOT IN A WORLD WAR)NO, ACTUALLY THE 
35 REAL REASON IS TO MAINTAIN THE ILLUSION OF 'STRENGTH'(REAL OR OTHERWISE). AND 
36 HOW IS THIS DONE? BY PUTTING A DIRECT THREAT OF DEATH ON SOMEONE OR SOME COUNTRY
37 NOW, TO ESTABLISH THIS THREAT, ONE NEEDS THE MECHANISIMS OF DEATH, GUNS, TANKS, 
38 ETC. SO IT FOLLOWS THAT THE PRIMARY PURPOSE OF THE ARMY IS TO KILL PEOPLE(WHEN O
39 RDERED) ANYONE WHO GETS INVOLVED WITH AN ORGANIZATION LIKE THAT HAS MADE THE 
40 DECISION THAT POSSIBLE MURDER BY ORDER IS THE PRICE TO PAY. SO, A SOLDIER HAS 
41 (IN MY OPINION)MADE THE DECISION TO MURDER. THIS DECISION IS NOT THE SAME THAT 
42 IS MADE WHEN A PERSON IS, SAY, ATTACKED BY A MUGGER. THEN, REFLEX TAKES OVER AND
43 THE INSTINCT TO SURVIVE TAKES PRECIDENCE. DO YOU SEE THE DIFFERENCE? PERSONALLY,
44 IF MY COUNTRY WERE INVADED(THE LOWER 48, NOT ALASKA OR HAWAII) I WOULD CHEERFULL
45 Y JOIN THE RESISTANCE AND BE KILLED. HOWEVER, THAT IS A DECISION OF SELF-DEFENSE
46 I FAVOR WASHINGTONS BRAND OF FOREIGN POLICY, KEEP TO YOURSELF. EVEN IF CANADA 
47 AND MEXICO TURNED COMMUNIST, I WON'T FIGHT UNTIL THEY STEP OVER THE BORDER. 
48 ALTHOUGH PEOPLE MAY ARGUE ABOUT U.S.'S INTERESTS, IN THE LONG RUN WE DONT NEED 
49 ANYTHING THAT WE CANNOT GET FROM EITHER U.S. SOIL OR OUTER SPACE. FURTHER, IN 
50 REGARDS TO THE BUDGET DEFICIT, BY FAR THE BULK OF U.S. TAX MONEY GOES OUT IN 
51 TRANSFER PAYMENTS. I HAVE A COPY OF THE U.S. '82 BUDGET THAT I WILL POST ON THE 
52 BOARD IF ANY CARE(ITS A BREAKDOWN BY SUBJECT)THAT WILL TAKE UP ABOUT 20-30 LINES
53 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++000000001TED++++++++++++++++++++++++
54 1TED: THE PURPOSE OF THE MILITARY FORCES OF THIS COUNTRY
55 IS TO ENFORCE FOREIGN POLICY. THE DUTY OF ANY MEMBER OF THE
56 MILITARY (REGARDLESS OF RANK) IS OBEDIENCE. THE EFFECTIVE RESULT
57 OF THIS IS TO PROTECT THIS COUNTRY AND IT'S CONCOMMITANT
58 IDEOLOGY, THE FREEDOMS WE HAVE THAT DO NOT EXIST IN SOME OTHER
59 COUNTRIES, IE THE BILL OF RIGHTS FREEDOM OF SPEECH, ASSEMBLY, 
60 REDRESS, ETC,ETC, AS OUTLINED IN THE CONSTITUTION. WITHOUT AN EN-
61 FORCED FOREIGN POLICY, WE AMERICANS WOULD BE LEFT WITH TWO
62 ALTERNATIVES: LEARN TO SPEAK CHINESE, OR LEARN TO SPEAK RUSSIAN.
63 THE USSR INTENDS TO CONQUER THE WORLD. THEIR CHANCES OF DOING SO
64 INCREASE PROPORTIONALLY WITH THE PACIFIST QUOTIENT AMPLIFIED BY
65 THE GENERAL PUBLIC DISCONTENT WITH
66 THE BOTTOM LINE ORIENTED ABUSE OF THIS IDEOLOGY, PER PATRICK HENRY 
67 :IS LIFE SO DEAR, OR PEACE SO SWEET AS TO BE PURCHASED AT THE
68 PRICE OF CHAINS AND SLAVERY---.
69 THE PROBLEM, THE REASON FOR THE PACIFISM SO INCREASINGLY EXTANT
70 IN AMERICA IS A COMBINATION OF THE "ME GENERATON", AND A LOSS 
71 OF FAITH, TRUST IN OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS.AT THE ONSET OF OUR DIRECT INVOLVEMENT 
72 IN WWII, THE PEOPLE "RALLIED ROUND THE FLAGPOLE", AND "WON" THAT WAR. 
73 THIS PATRIOTISM FADED SOMEWHAT IN 1950, IN THE "POLICE ACTION"
74 IN KOREA, AND IT FAIRLY WELL FIZZELED DURING THE VIETNAM "CONFLICT"
75 PEOPLE ARE TIRED OF WAR. I IMAGINE THE TYPICAL RUSSIAN CITIZEN IS LIKEWISE TIRED
76 OF WAR. BUT THE POLITBURO AND THE
77 DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE (AND ALL THAT IS BEHIND THEM) APPARENTLY ARE NOT. 
78 WAR IS THE NATURE OF MAN.(SUN TZU) AND WE SHALL ALWAYS HAVE THEM. 
79 AND SO IT GOES-----.
80 COMMENT ON PIPERS ENTRY ABOUT VICTIMLESS CRIMES: YOU ARE (IN MY
81 OPINION) COMPLETELY RIGHT. EG PROSTITUTION, IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN
82 AND IT WILL ALWAYS BE. THE PROBLEM, AS HAS ALREADY BEEN STATED
83 IS THAT NOT ALL PROSTITUTES ARE "WILLING". THERE ARE TOO MANY
84 'HOOKERS' THAT HAVE BEEN FORCED INTO THEIR 'TRADE'. VICTIMS OF GREEDY PIMPS. 
85 IF PROSTITUTION WERE TO BE LEGALIZED, AND REGULATED TO SOME EXTENT, AND BY ALL 
86 MEANS TAXED! THE ECONOMY WOULD HAVE ONE HELLUVA NEW SOURCE OF
87 REVENUE, LAW ENFORCEMENT COULD
88 MORE EFFECTIVELY DEAL WITH OTHER CRIME, ETC, ETC. ONELAST
89 THOUGHT-SUICIDE. AND ON THIS, I CAN SPEAK FROM (ALMOST) EXPERIENCE.
90 I THINK ANYONE WHO HAS THE OPPOR-
91 TUNITY TO PREVENT SOMEONE FROM KILLING THEMSELVES SHOULD DO SO.
92 (INCLUDING SPECIFICALLY COPS.)
93 I TRIED IT ONCE. FOR REAL. SOMEONE 'SAVED' ME. SHE HAS MY ETERNAL GRATITUDE. 
94 YOU SEE, SUICIDE IS LIKE THE DEATH PENALTY (TO WHICH I AM
95 UNALTERABLY OPPOSED). BOTH ARE TERRIBLY FINAL. THERE ARE NO
96 SECOND THOUGHTS, NO 'LATER'.THINK ABOUT ALL THIS.
97 I GUESS I SHOULDN'T HAVE TAKEN UP
98 SO MUCH SPACE, BUT I GET CARRIED AWAY. THE PHANTOM PHILOSOPHER
99 
100 
101       >>>>>>>>>    >>>>>>>>>>>>
102      >>>   >>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>>
103     >>>>  >>>>>>    >>>>>>  >>>
104    >>>>  >>>>>>     >>>>>> >>>>
105    >>>> >>>>>>      >>>>>   >>>
106     >>> >>>>       >>>>>>>>>>>
107      >>>>>        >>>>>>>>>>>
108        LESS AT A TIME,I BELEIVE
109        AS IT WERE IN THE FLIGHT
110        YOU ASKED FOR MORE,NOW
111        LET'S DECIPHER SHALL WE
112        SINCERLY,OMEGA,OMEGA SIX
113 
114     >
115    >>         >
116   >>>>        >
117   >>>>>>>  <<<<<
118    <<<<<    >>>>>
119     <<<<<  >>>>>
120      <<<<<>>>>>
121       <<<<>>>>
122         <..>
123 PPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
124   Just a quick note ... suicide attempts should be thwarted, yes indeed.
125 
126 However, the attempt should not place the person who attempted the act open
127 to criminal prosecution.  Unless I am mistaken, in many states a failed
128 suicide attempt can land you in prison.  Could that be interpreted as an
129 incentive to succeed?   Please correct me if I am not up to date on the law.
130    Frank -- I assume that your entry was the last on the last disk.  I agree
131 with much of what you say, however I disagree that man is a herd animal.
132    Man is by nature an omnivore, and does indeed have some herding instincts,
133 however it is not unusual for rouge members of the species to prefer a 
134 solitary existence.  We have invented many means of social control to 
135 reinforce the weak instincts that still drive us.  It is difficult to tell where
136 these vague instincts end and social conditioning begins.  An example of how
137 normal social conditioning can be erased is military basic training.  Here,
138 young males are penned up together, conditioned to total obedience in a
139 bland and colorless environment, subjected to continuous regimentation that
140 elicits a belief that their individual worth is measured by others.
141   Unfortunately, any military man will tell you that a troop of green recruits
142 is nearly useless as a fighting force.  To be a useful tool, they must be 
143 blooded -- placed in the field under hostile fire -- kill and be killed.
144 This final breaking of the social taboos changes a raw recuit into a valuable
145 soldier.  Once changed into a blindly obedient killer, the young male is now
146 controlled by a system set up to keep him rigidly controlled even after leaving
147 the service.
148 pppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
149 PIPER: TRUE. BUT THEN TOTAL OBIDIENCE IS NECESSARY IF ANY
150 MILITARY UNIT IS TO FUNCTION AS A TEAM, 'WORK' TOGETHER, DEPEND
151 UPON EACHOTHER, ETC. ANALOGOUS TO A FOOTBALL TEAM---. AS I UNDER-
152 STAND IT, A PERSON WHO ATTEMPTS SUICIDE MIGHT BE HELD FOR PSY-
153 CHIATRIC OBSERVATION, AND UNDER
154 SOME CONDITIONS, KEPT AT SOME
155 FACILITY FOR THE MENTALLY ILL, IF IT IS BELIEVED THEY WILL CON-
156 TINUE TO BE DANGEROUS TO THEMSELVES, MAYBE. MORE LIKELY 
157 THEY WILL SIMPLY BE RELEASED, AND REFERRED TO SOME MENTAL HEALTH ORGANIZATION 
158 ON AN OUTPATIENT BASIS. ALMOST NEVER WOULD SUCH A PERSON BE SENT
159 TO PRISON. DO YOU REALLY PLAY THE PIPES? THE PHANTOM PHILOSOPHER
160 ^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^
161 PIPER: Would not a suicide attempt be attempted murder ?  Just
162        a passing thought, not really relevant.
163        I think legalizing prostitution and marijuana fall in
164        the same category.  Both are going to happen anyway, 
165        so why not at least make them safe and taxable ?
166 
167 ^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$   Laissez-faire   $^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^
168 
169 ;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-
170 Suicide? Prostitution? Murder? Hmmmmm sounds the local, national and
171 international news being discussed here. While my usual blitherings may not
172 interest you here's a thought or two on said subjects:
173 1. Suicide is a crime, this is true. But the true Utopian would tell you it
174 is a noble gesture on the part of the individual to the whole of society. 
175 Considering the world today, it's understandable that some folks feel lost
176 and have no where to turn to. I once quite seriously considered this "option"
177 and was fortunate enough to have had a friend who talked me down. It is a
178 thing that is not easily contemplated, there's so much you don't realise.
179 I recommend that anyone thinking about it call a friend, and if you can't
180 do that then wait for the sunrise and realise that you CAN make it through
181 another. I did.
182 2. I ALSO PREFER TO CLASS MURDER INTO TWO AREAS: ACTIVE AND PASSIVE.
183 MY BASIC PHILOSOPHY HAS ALWAYS BEEN: YOUR FREEDOM ENDS AT THE TIP OF MY
184 nose. Should a person murder wantonly, we should do our utmost to bring
185 him/her to justice. To me this means a death sentence. To kill because the
186 life of someone you love is endangered or your own self is put under duress
187 isn't a sin. You shouldn't be punished for surviving. Mankind has been doing
188 it for few centuries and as whole I say that wev'e not gone down the tubes
189 yet.
190 3. As for national defense and ARMIES being there for the expressed purpose
191 of murder. Obviously you haven't read the newspaper lately. I usualy adhere
192 to the rule of "Believe half of what you see and nothing of what you hear"
193 WHEN IT COMES TO POLITICS AND SUCH, BUT I CAN'T HELP NOTING THAT, WHILE THE
194 "ENEMY" has amassed great quanities of arms, ammunition and militia he has
195 made no attempt to usurp our borders. This is due in a large part to the
196 armed forces of our nation. The key to defense is that it's ready, willing
197 and waitng.(at least, I hope it is) Without our trained"killers" you and
198 i might not exist now. Or if we did it would either be goose step city or
199 A SLAVE LABOR CAMP. I'M NOT ONE TO RATTLE SABERS, BUT I DO FEEL IT'S OUR
200 best bet for now.
201 ;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-
202 jjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjj
203 BW is looking great. I don't know how to reply. Anyway, as people are 
204 talking about contempleting suicide, I think I'll add a statistic. 60%
205 of all persons surveyed at least contempleted suicide in the last month.
206 We all have our down times when we feel as if we would like to no longer
207 continue to live. A suicidal person might be enjoying life a week later.
208 Suicidal people should be given emotional help to overcome depression. How
209 do you people feel on euthenasia [SIC?]?
210 The Ninja
211 jjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjj
212 TO "TED";
213          I REALY DO EPRICIATE ALL THE TIME YOU WASTED ON PRINTING ALL THAT
214 JUNK, BUT THAT HAS GOT TO BE THE LONGEST "20-30" LINES I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!
215 I HIT "DOWN 30" AT LEAST 5 TIMES, AND WAS STILL IN YOUR MESSAGE, I THINK
216 POLLITICKS (?) HAVE A PLACE; IN THE TRASH, OOOPPPSSS, I MEAN IN WASHINGTON
217 OH WELL, SAME DIFFRENCE I GUESS. NOW I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT CAUSED ALL
218 THAT MUMBO-JUMBO IN THE FIRST PLACE?!?!?
219                   THANK YOU,
220                             THE MARTIAN MAN
221 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?/
222 
223 Jello all,I feel I must add my .000002 cents worth.
224 WAR:What is preventing Russia from taking over things like Sweden? The U.S.
225 of course, there must be a deterant force, be it trained killers or missiles.
226 My first wife went into the army thinking that she would be back in a year
227 or two. They turned her into a trained killer and now that she is back, 
228 she is so alien to me that it hurts to be around her. I am in favor of the 
229 mechanical deterants rather then the foot solder.
230 On prostitution and dope:in Nevada, it is legal 
231 and nobody can complane about it, her it is illeagal and thats all they can do.
232 Dope has been around sence the earliest civilizations, it was made illeagal 
233 by the FDA when heroin and morphine were made prescription. When states figure 
234 out that they can make BUCKS on dope, it will be legal.Also understand that I 
235 use the stuff so I am biased.
236 suicide:I have worked in a hospital and seen people after they have been saved.
237 most are happy and joyous and a few keep at it untill they get it right.
238 One case that sticks in my mind was of this 17 year old male who was brought in 
239 about once every week or 2 with ether his wrists slashed or with 50 or so 
240 pills in him. Each time after we save him, he would be happy again.
241 one day he came close enough that he was clinicly dead for 2 miniuts. when we 
242 told him this, he started crying and said that all he had wanted was the 
243 feeling of somebody loving him. Kind of makes me wonder about this society.
244 Man as a pack animal:Yes, go to your avarage high school and see for yourself.
245 Piper: the above 17 year old lived alone, perhaps if he had given in to the herd
246 instinct he would not have had all that trouble.
247 Ninja(I think) I never saw the 82 budget, am I going blind?
248 All Nerders:Michael is holed up in Troutdale not far from my house with the
249 Epson, his sterio and a french exchange student. Each is getting the same amout 
250 of time and I think we will see a new nerd in a few weeks. This time writen
251 in KAMAS where the user has near total control.
252 Aaron:I my be able to get my hands on a PDP 11/04. what is a PDP 11/04 in compar
253 ison to the rest.
254 8/8/84 12:57 P.M.
255 MiG
256 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?/
257 The problem with "mechanical" detterents is that they tend to be overkill
258 (we did not use nukes when Afghanistan was invaded, when KAL 007 was shot down,
259 etc). We have, in fact, relied on our nuclear arsenal so heavily that we CANNOT 
260 win if we don't use it! If the Soviets & Eastern Bloc countries were to invade 
261 Germany we could either try to delay them (a week at MOST!) or we could
262 "go nuclear". If we took the latter course, THEY WOULD LAUNCH A FULL SCALE 
263 NUCLEAR ATTACK ON THE U.S. 
264 The nuclear arsenal is ONLY useful for:
265 A. Launching a MASSIVE FIRST STRIKE, or
266 B. Discouraging them from launching a first strike on us.
267 Unfortunately, no one seems to see it that way. It is NOT a defense! 
268 As I mentioned above, we CANNOT win a convential war. We can't even
269 FIGHT one for more than a couple of weeks! (lack of supplies) We can't try to
270 train people and produce supplies AFTER the war starts because training a
271 "dumb footslogger" takes longer than the war would last. (note: the only reason 
272 we didn't run into this kind of thing in WWII was that Roosevelt had pushed the
273 "peacetime army" up to a high level of readiness & we were producing war 
274 materials for Lend-Lease).
275 While I am not entirely sure I'd like it, I begin to think that 
276 the Swiss have the right idea- EVERYONE goes through basic traing & "serves a 
277 hitch". 
278 ____________________________________Leonard_____________________________________
279 
280 
281   FROM HAWTHORNE :THE DESIGNED
282   WAIT FOR A MOMENT I MISSED THE 1982 BUDGET AND IT BEING 20- 30 LINES I DONT THINK I BLINKED TO LONG AND MISSED IT.
283   L'HOMME I DID NOT MEAN THAT TO BE AN EFFORT IN BRAGGING. AN,ER ENTICEMENT IF YOU WILL. MAYHAPS A PLEA?
284   I HAVE PLAYED MERELY SIX OR SO GAMES AND HAVE NOT LOST YET.  I AM RATHER PROUD OF THIS.
285   NUCLEAR RISK? DOES THIS NOT ER GET A LITTLE MESSY WITHOUT EVEN MENTIONING COSTAT ROUNDABOUT TWELVE DOLLARS A COPY?
286   SUICIDE; I BELEIVE ATTEMPTS AT SUICIDE SHOULD BE FOILED. IF AT ALL POSSIBLE THOUGH I WOULD NOT LEAVE SOMEONE WHO HAD TRIED
287 TO THE MERCY OF A MENTAL/ PENAL INSTITUTE. I DOUBT THE REASONING OF THIS BEING PROCEDURE.
288   MENTAL OR PENAL INSTITUTES ARE NOT WHAT EVERY SUICIDAL PERSON WANTS OR NEEDS AND IT SHOULD NOT BE ASSUMED THAT THEY ARE.
289 
290   HERDING INSTICT; NO, PACK TYPE INSTINCTS; YES. MAN IS PREDATOR AND PREDATORIALS DO NOT HERD.
291   EVER HEARD OF LONE WOLVES?
292   ARCHIVISTS; 80 DOUBLE DENSITY EIGHT INCH DISKS AS MY PART AND PARCEL OF THE ARCHIVES. ACCEPT?
293   AARON; NICE TALKING ACCROSS OH SO MANY PLANES WITH YOU YESTER.
294   
295   POLICE DETRACTIONISMS; WE MUST WATCH MOST CLOSELY THOSE WHOM  WE APPOINT TO WATCH OURSELVES.
296   PROMETHEUS HAWTHORNE SD8408.08
297 
298 Leonard ?  Welcome back.
299 
300 $%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$
301 Piper - The young male you speak of was rigidly controlled long
302 before he entered the service.
303      Penning people up, conditioning them to obedience in a 
304 bland and colorless environment, and subjecting them to 
305 continuous regimentation is a graphic description of our 
306 educational system. Team sports, lining up to go to the bath-
307 room, rewards for good (acceptable) behavior, punishment for 
308 violation of arbitrary rules, emphasis on learning facts rather
309 than thinking processes, are all manipulative techniques to
310 condition us for "the real world".
311      After all, the primary purpose of education is to 
312 prepare us for the blind obedience required of American
313 corporate culture or the military. It has nothing to do with
314 teaching people to think, to create, or to function 
315 teaching people to think, to create, or to function 
316 independently. It is purely a process of socialization and 
317 acculturation.
318      It is the awesome power of the herd instinct that forces 
319 us to bow to the whims of society. If you seriously doubt the 
320 power of this primal instinct test it, try isolating yourself 
321 from society for a year. I'm not talking about going off by 
322 yourself for awhile, I'm talking total isolation. No books, no
323 magazines, no television, no radio, no telephone, no human 
324 contact of any kind. You'll discover just how powerful social 
325 needs are to the herd animal.
326     If that seems too drastic try going without sexual 
327 satisfaction for a year. I imagine those "vague instincts" 
328 won't seem so vague anymore. After all, it's not nice to fool
329 mother nature.
330 
331                             Frank
332 $%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$
333 &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&YOU CAN ALWAYS BEAT OFF&&&&&&SEXUAL INSTINCTS&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
334 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
335 WELL, MY LITTLE WRITING ON THE ARMY SEEMS TO HAVE STIRRED UP A BEE'S NEST. I DID PROMISE THE BUDGET HOWEVER, SO HERE IT IS:
336 FEDERAL BUDGET EXPENDITURES(IN BILLIONS OF DOLLARS) FOR 1982
337 1.INCOME SECURITY  (A.)SOCIAL SECURITY    154.1   (B.)GENERAL RETIREMENT   7.7   (C.)FEDERAL RETIREMENT   19.4   
338 (D.)UNEMPLOYMENT COMPENSATION   23.8   (E.)HOUSING ASSISTANCE   8.0   (F.)FOOD AND NUTRITION   15.6   (G.)OTHER   19.8   
339 2. HEALTH CARE  (A.)MEDICARE   46.6   (B.)MEDICAID   17.4   (C.)OTHER   10.0   3.DEFENSE  (A.)PERSONNEL SALARIES   42.3   
340 (B.)RETIREMENT PAY   14.9   (C.)OPERATIONS   59.7   (D.)PROCUREMENT   43.3   (E.)OTHER   27.2   4.INTEREST   84.7   
341 5.VETERANS BENEFITS   24.0   6.TRANSPORTATION   20.6   7.EDUCATION   14.3   8.AGRICULTURE   14.9   9.ENVIRONMENT   12.9   
342 10.INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS   10.0   11.SCIENCE AND SPACE   7.1   12.ENERGY   4.7   13.HOUSING COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT   7.2   
343 14.LABOR AND TRAINING   6.0   15.SOCIAL SERVICES   6.0   16.JUSTICE DEPARTMENT   4.7   17.ADMINISTRATION   4.7   
344 18. FISCIAL ASSISTANCE   6.4              TOTAL BUDGET   728.4
345 **************************************** NOW, BEFORE SHOOTING IN YOUR TWO CENTS, THIS IS REQUIRED READING!!!!!!!        ******
346 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++0000000001TED+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
347 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
348 WHEN ASKED IF I WOULD SAVE A MAN TRYING TO KILL HIM
349 SELF, I REPLIED, YES, EXCEPT FOR ONE MAN. THAT MAN
350 IS YOU FRANK. YOU ARE A DISGUSTING PERSON WHO HAS
351 SHOWN THOUGH YOUR WORDS YOU CARE NOTHING FOR YOUR
352 FELLOW MAN BEYOND THE IMMEDIATE PLEASURES YOUNG
353 BOYS GIVE YOU. YOU LOOK APON THE WORLD THOUGH BLACK
354 COLORED GLASSES. YOU SEE NOTHING GOOD. ALL IS BAD 
355 YOU THINK, AND THEREFORE, WHY SHOULD YOU CARE ABOUT
356 ANYTHING. YOU FAULT SOCIETY, BUT THE FAULT LIES
357 WITH YOU AND YOUR KIND. THE UNCARING. THE ONE'S
358 WHO ARE NEVER GUILTY. YOU THINK YOU ARE ON THE SIDE
359 OF RIGHT, AND ALL OTHERS ARE WRONG. TO READ YOUR
360 ENTRIES, WHICH EVERYONE THOUGHT WOULD NEVER APPEAR
361 AGAIN, ARE TO READ DESPAIR AND DEPRESSION. YOU
362 ARE THE ONE I BLAME FOR THE PROBLEMS OF SOCIETY. AND
363 IT IS PEOPLE LIKE YOU WHO SPUR THE CAUSE OF
364 RETRO ACTIVE BIRTH CONTROL. IF IT COULD ONLY BE SO,
365 OUR LIVES WOULD BE SO MUCH BETTER. MAYBE SIMPLE
366 CORRECTIVE SURGERY, BOTCHED ACCIDENTLY OF COURSE,
367 COULD BE USED INSTEAD. I SHUDDER TO THINK THAT
368 A SOULESS PERSON LIKE YOU EVEN HAS ACCESS TO A
369 MODEM AND COMPUTER. THERE IS NO FILTER IS THERE?
370 THERE IS NO WAY TO MUFFLE YOUR VOICE AND SILENCE
371 YOUR SICK CALLS FOR ATTENTION. IN THAT RESPECT,
372 WE HAVE REALLY FAILED. FOR THAT I AM SORRY
373                                        
374 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
375 THE CITIZEN OF THE WORLD, THE ONE WHO DOES CARE
376 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
377 TO: JACK
378 FROM: GARY WEBER
379 
380 > YOU ARE RIGHT! THIS SYSTEM DOES HAVE A LOT OF INTERESTING INFORMATION. I REALLY LIKE READING ABOUT THE NATIONS 
381 PROBLEMS, PROSTITUTION, SUICIDE, AND DRUGS. WHY DON'T YOU WRITE A FEW THINGS
382 ON THIS SYSTEM. I'M SURE YOU HAVE AN OPINION ABOUT THESE ISSUES.
383 WELL, CATCH YOU LATER ON KGON,CBBS,PAC.
384 
385 ---------------------------------------
386 ppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
387     Frank-   I believe you are confusing you social conditioning with your
388 instincts.  MiG - likewise with the H.S. crew.  Speaking from personal 
389 experience, living for years without other human contact is not difficult
390 if you are comfortable with yourself and your own belief set.  The first
391 month is diffucult, the second month much more pleasant, and should a
392 hapless traveller come through several months later, it can be quite 
393 difficult to be pleasant -- the urge is to shout and throw stones.
394    The sexual urge is also largely planted by social conditioning.  It
395 drops to a quite acceptable level if not exited by advertising, display,
396 or availability.  (Someone once remarked to me that sex is the most
397 overrated sensation in the world -- the most underrated is a good BM.)
398    I would agree that mankind tends to be a pack rather than a herd 
399 animal.  Although man is an omnivore, rather than a pure carnivore or
400 herbivore, the tendency to band together and attack is quite strong.
401   About conditioning young males and schools -- there is merit in what
402 you say.  Schools are not designed to teach students how to think, except
403 incidentally.  They exist as social balance wheels, giving all members
404 of a society a common experience and instilling many of the socially
405 "acceptable" habits.  Example.  In the 9th grade (4 yr high school) I
406 had my hair rumpled before coming to English class.  The teacher presented
407 me with a comb in front of the class.  (My reaction?  I kept the comb
408 for the full 3 1/2 remaining years and did not comb my hair again until
409 I had been out for nearly three years.)  I consider myself somewhat
410 abnormal in that I have replaced much social conditioning with my own
411 intentionally instilled conditioning.  However, I have left much of 
412 the underlaying social conditioning intact, as it has great survival value
413 in our present society.
414    To the one who inquired -- Yes, I do indeed play (or at least play at)
415 the pipes.  After several hours it induces a feeling of great philosophical
416 calm that I have been unable to achieve in any other way.  The bass drone
417 seems to create a primal OM that does strange things while sustained.
418 ppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
419 
420 ;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;
421 Pack animal? What is man? A truly perplexing question in light of our so
422 called world situation. I propose that man was nothing more than a step
423 in natures quest for a more "flexible" species. While I'm not saying that
424 humanity is the end product, I will say that we have managed to change
425 ourselves and those factors which affect our SURVIVAL (shelter, food and
426 so forth) as race. For all this hoopla though, I still can't see why we
427 aren't under a more centralized world government, make that really big
428 leap (sorry Ed) and take over our section of the solar system. Space is
429 where it's at, and that's where we should be. Imagine the possibilties:
430 new medicines, metals, unlimited living space, and the list could go on
431 forever. It's time to quit fighting over this little dustball and go for
432 the big one. Galactic pioneering, anyone?
433 ;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;-;
434 [*=*] PIPER: MOST INTERESTING ENTRY. HAVE YOU READ THOREAU, ON
435 OF MY "HEROS"? MAN IS INDEED A SOCIAL CREATURE, FEW OF WHOM CAN
436 SEEM TO FUNCTION WITHOUT OTHERS AROUND THEM. EG, IF YOU HAVE EVER
437 FLOWN OVER A HIGHWAY IN A SMALL AIRCRAFT, YOU MIGHT HAVE OBSERVED
438 HOW CARS, TRUCKS, ETC ALWAYS SEEM TO END UP IN 'STRINGS' RATHER
439 THAN ALONE. INTERESTING. WHAT IS DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND IS A TOTAL
440 WITHDRAWL FROM SOCIETY. MYSELF, I AM SOMEWHAT THAT WAY, MAINLY
441 BECAUSE I PREFER MY OWN COMPANY BUT I STILL NEED AND WANT TO BE
442 WITH PEOPLE SOMETIMES. COULD/WOULD YOU TEACH SOMEONE TO
443 PLAY THE PIPES? I HAVE WANTED TO
444 LEARN FOR A LONG TIME, BUT THE COST OF A GOOD SET OF PIPES IS
445 CONSIDERABLE---.
446 YOU MIGHT ALSO, FIND TWAINS LETTERS FROM THE EARTH INTERESTING.
447 [*=*]
448 $%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$
449 Piper - I don't believe I'm confusing social conditioning with 
450 instinct. Freud established that there were essentially two 
451 fundemental instincts. Eros, the love or life instinct, and 
452 Thanatos, the death or destruction instinct. This would seem 
453 to imply that sexuality and violence (war) are written into our
454 biological life plan and are inevitable and eternal. 
455      Instinct, as defined through the Freudian position, is 
456 "Any set of responses, shown by a great majority of the members
457 of a species, that are associated together in time under 
458 specified environmental conditions". I think this pretty well
459 establishes sexuality as an instinct. After all, if you can't 
460 believe Freud who can you believe?
461      As to man being an omnivor, this is inconsistant with your
462 position that we are pack rather than herd animals. Pigs do not
463 run in packs.
464      As to your ability to run independently of the pack, 
465 you have demonstrated that ability admirably. By the values of
466 the Backwater herd (perhaps in this instance pack would be more
467 appropriate) I am the sleeziest scum on the earth. Yet you
468 treat me with a certain respect. Considering that you socialize
469 with these folks I think you're demonstrating considerable 
470 personal courage.
471      I couldn't help but notice that your recent entries have 
472 been the most well conceived, intelligent, thoughtful responses
473 I've seen on Backwater. I think it's also commendable that you
474 seem to be the first person to see through what I'm doing. I'm
475 impressed.
476                           Frank
477 
478 P.S. - MIG: Thanks for your earlier acknowledgement of the 
479             quality of my writing. It didn't go unnoticed.
480 $%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$%$
481 ^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^
482 Frank- Pigs do run in packs, when in the wild.  The segregation 
483 that man has placed on them has perhaps overcome their inherent
484 instincts in this environment.
485 I did not enter into the discussions about your sexual prefer-
486 ences as I thought it was probably a hoax.  I do not agree with
487 you in that area, but that does not mean that you are 'the
488 sleeziest scum on Backwater'.  I was under the impression that
489 we had once again banished personal attacks in favor of reasoned
490 arguments, but I see from Citizen of the World's entry that we
491 have not.  I apologize for him, and extend my welcome to your
492 thoughtful replies.  
493 I think that man is basically a loner, clinging to one or two
494 others naturally, and only becoming social of necessity.  It
495 seems that the more crowded and close society comes, the worse
496 the situation becomes.  In this century, radio, TV and the
497 communications sattelite have so narrowed the borders of the
498 world that an individual has no time to be alone anymore, not
499 even in his sleep.  That is what I feel is driving us towards
500 mass insanity, and perhaps mass suicide.  Unfortunate, but
501 apparently true from my perspective.  I expect the Nuclear War
502 to occur, and probably within 20 years.
503 
504 Sorry to all for the rambling.  I am still in favor of a position
505 of defense to bargain from.  (I know that is not wholly consistent,
506 but no one has shown me a better way that would still maintain
507 our freedom.)
508 
509 ^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$   Laissez-faire   $^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^$^
510 
511 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
512 
513 WELL, AT LEAST THERE ARENT AS MANY INSULTS AS 
514 THERE WAS A WHILE BACK.ANYWAY I ALSO BELIEVE 
515 THAT THERE IS GOING TO BE NUCULEAR WAR IN THE 
516 NEXT TWENTY YEARS.
517   
518    GREETINGS E.C.
519       IF YOUR OUT THERE
520 ::::::::::::::::::HALDRIC::::::::::::::::::::::::::
521 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
522 ug, who set the damn columns so low?
523 Much better now.  Frank, I have a short lived remembery, what was it I said?
524 
525 Ted:could you mellow out a sec and notice that Frank said in one of his messages "portraid" a child 
526 molester the whole thing was probably a small experiment in hate conditioning.
527 
528 My, my syntax sucks today, I think I shall stop here and return when more sober
529 MiG
530 ? ? ? ? ? > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?`? ? ?  ? ? ? ~ ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?/
531 (FNORD**************FNORD)
532 H'LLO,LOGAN HERE.   NEW IN TOWN,ANYBODY HERE
533 COLECT COMICS,  ALSO TRYIN' TO SELL SOME OLD
534 STAR WARS OR TRADE FOR SOME OLD DEFENDERS OR X-MEN
535 
536 CON TACT LOGAN...................FNORD
537 (*****************LOGAN********************)
538 *=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*DREAMTOUCHER*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
539   WELL I SEE MUCH LIVELY SOCIO-'PHILO'... STUFF GOING ON.  AS TO SUISIDE; I THINK IT WOULD BE
540 OK IF THE DECEASED CLEANED UP AFTER HIM SELF!
541   AS TO THE VARIOS PERMUTATIONS OF 'RAPE'; THIS IS LARGLY A MATER OF
542 SOCIAL CONTEXT.  IN THE CONTEXT OF THE SOCIAL AMBIENT WITH WICH MOST OF US
543 ARE (SEMI) FAMIALIAR AND A FEW EVEN SEEM (SEMI(?)) COMPFORTABLE WITH, ANY
544 FORM OF PHYSICAL VIOLATION IS LOOKED UPON AS A VIOLATION OF SELFNESS.
545   THIS IS BAD NEWS.  ADD TO THIS THAT IT IS A NORM FOR PEOPLE TO EXPECT EACH
546 OTHER TO REACT NEGATIVELY TO THIS.  IN THE CONTEXT OF SOME ALIEN SOCIAL
547 AMBIENT ON THE OTHER HAND...  AFTER ALL OUR WAY ISN'T THE ONLY WAY; OR EVEN NECESSARILY
548 A PARTICULARY GOOD WAY IN MANY CONTEXTS.  
549   AS TO FREUD'S SUPPOSITION OF EROS BEING THE ULTIMATE MOTIVATION: FREUD WAS A DIRTY OLD MAN.
550   ON THE OTHER HAND; PSRINKOLOGY HAD TO START SOMEWARE.  ON THE THIRD HAND; OR DID IT?...
551 *=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
552   IN AN FTL SHIP OF CYBERNETIC LIFT, EFFORTLESSLY GLIDING THROUGH THE
553 LIMITLESS VOID, I HOLD IN MY HAND A SMALL PEICE OF DRIFTWOOD.  IT'S SHAPE
554 THE DELICATE ARTISTRY OF THE SUBTLE FORCES OF NATURE.
555 
556   IN THE CRYSTAL STARBLAZE OF MIDNIGHT, POINTED EARED COMPANIONS
557 UNDER MOON'S FULL LIGHT.  SOMETIMES THEY SING TO REMEMBER THE HONORED DEAD,
558 SOMETIMES TO SPREAD THE ALARM, SOMETIMES TO SEEK ONE ANOTHER, TONIGHT THEY
559 SING FOR THE SHEAR JOY OF SINGING.
560 *=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
561 
562 THIS IS AN ITR<<<INTRESTING SYSTEM.  WHAT IS ITS PIRPO<<<<<<PURPOSE?  WHAT OPERATING SYSTEM IS IT TRYING TO RUN.
563 TO ABOVE:YOU READ THE DIRECTIONS. THATS HOW
564 -----------------------------------------------------------------------
565 OH HOW FRUSTRATING IT IS; SO MUCH TO 
566 RESPOND TO, BUT LACKING THE ABILTIY TO
567 PHRASE IT PROPERLY.  THE DISCUSSIONS ON
568 SUICIDE, WAR, ETC. - THEY ALL INVOKE A
569 REACTION WITHIN ME, BUT HAVING SEEN THE
570 ELOQUENCE WITH WHICH THEY ARE BEING
571 ARGUED HERE, I FEAR MY PALRTY ENTRIES
572 WOULD BE CUT TO SHREDS.  MAYBE IN A 
573 COUPLE OF YEARS, AFTER I HAVE THOUGHT
574 RATIONALLY ABOUT MY VIEW OF LIFE, AS
575 OPPOSED TO THE KNEE-JERK RESPONSES
576 I FIND MYSELF BEING PRODDED BY.
577   AH, TEMPTATION.  HAVING TRIED THAT
578 ROUTE, I HAVE MUCH TO SAY ON THAT.
579 NOT WISHING TO FIND MYSELF COMMITTED
580 TO DAMMASCH FOR OBSERVATION, I MUST
581 REMAIN ANONYMOUS.
582 DAMN!  AFTER "TEMPTATION", I MEANT
583 TO REFER TO SUICIDE.  
584 IF THE TOPIC MAINTAINS, PERHAPS I
585 WILL OFFER MY VIEWS AND EXPERIENCES
586 ON THAT TOPIC.  
587      FOR THE NONCE, GOODNIGHT.
588 ------------------------------------

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